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Old 12-10-2017, 10:24 PM
 
Location: Mile High
294 posts, read 246,412 times
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I'm a Caucasian woman with Asian Flush Syndrome. I'm still awaiting my DNA results, but there is no evidence from my genealogical research to indicate I have any Asian ancestry. AFS is rarely, rarely (if ever) found in European races and only a very small number of Indians in the Southwest.

I know most of my ancestors came from England or Scotland long before 1776, and many were in Texas by the 1830s. So I can't for the life of me understand why I have AFS. It's not just that alcohol makes my face red, it makes me extremely uncomfortable--even two glasses of wine makes me sick and gives me a hangover. It almost feels like I'm ingesting poison when I drink, which is exactly what many Japanese and Koreans say.

I know it's a long shot, but does anyone have any idea why a Caucasian woman with European (and perhaps Cherokee ancestry) have AFS?

TYIA!
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Old 12-11-2017, 08:46 AM
 
Location: ATX
4,962 posts, read 7,247,203 times
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A very quick google search comes up with an explanation. It's not just people who are genetically Asian that suffer from this. https://getsunset.com/blogs/news/can...f-im-not-asian

On the flip side, I have a cousin who has thalassemia and that is linked to mediterraneans genetically. Based on our family history there's no sign of any southern European genes. However, I just got back my FTDNA results and ran it through gedmatch and found a big chunk of southern European genes, so. It could go either way.
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Old 12-11-2017, 01:27 PM
 
791 posts, read 610,037 times
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One thing to keep in mind is many genetic predispositions aren't exclusive to one specific ethnic set of DNA. Often they are simply found much more likely in said people.

For example

https://www.snpedia.com/index.php/Rs17822931

The body odor and ear wax gene, with three variations


(C;C) 2 Wet earwax. Normal body odour. Normal colostrum.
(C;T) 2 Wet earwax. Slightly better body odour.
(T;T) 2.5 Dry earwax. No body odour. Likely Asian ancestry. Reduced colostrum

There's a reason they say "likely" Asian ancestry (also this kind a shows if you know Asian people who think non-Asians are smelly they may be right lol)... There was indeed early gene flows between different regions such as Europe, Eurasia, and Asia, it was just limited and heavily diffused which makes the traits far less likely though not unheard of.

They include a simple frequency chart... CEU is the best proxy for a typical European American

"CEU - European - 180 samples of Utah residents with Northern and Western European ancestry from the CEPH collection (originally 30 mother-father-child trios)"

As you can see about 75% have CC, wet earwax and normal body odor. About 14% have CT which is wet earwax and slightly better body odor. Only about 1% or so have TT with dry earwax and no body odor.

That means you can in fact be fully European and still come up with non CC variants, it's just more rare.

For example I am a White European American and I come up CT and my mother comes up TT. Mine is fairly uncommon for my ethnicity and my mother's is very uncommon. Now my maternal grandmother's DNA comes up with some Native American DNA from 200+ years ago, so it's possibly that CC Asian variant came through them (if it's an old enough variant) or it just came through the rare chance of European DNA.


Another example that's more mixed is whether you develop more fast twitch or slow twitch muscles

https://www.snpedia.com/index.php/Rs1815739

(C;C) 2.2 Better performing muscles. Likely sprinter.
(C;T) 2.1 Mix of muscle types. Likely sprinter.
(T;T) 2.2 Impaired muscle performance. Likely endurance athlete.


CC being associated with developing more high intensity muscles for things like sprinting and power lifting (fast twitch muscles are the more bulky muscle too so for muscle size)
CT being mixed
TT your fast twitch muscle development is impaired so you develop more slow twitch muscles which are used for non high intensity muscle uses, so endurance etc

The CEU European breakdown is roughly

CC - 20%
CT - 60%
TT - 20%

The biggest outlier is YRI which is "Yoruba African" which have

CC - 80%
CT - 20%
TT - 0% (it seems)

This is why they refer to the CT and TT markers impairing fast twitch muscle development since out of Africa CC seems likely the most common (or at least in Africa) with the other variants developing afterwards.

I happen to have CC... I have distance African ancestry so either I'm just one of the 20% of Europeans who happen to have this variation or it's trace inheritance from my African ancestry.


As far as Asian Flush

https://www.snpedia.com/index.php/Rs671

"rs671 is a classic SNP, well known in a sense through the phenomena known as the "alcohol flush", also known as the "Asian Flush" or "Asian blush", in which certain individuals, often of Asian descent, have their face, neck and sometimes shoulders turn red after drinking alcohol."

(A;A) 4 Asian Flusher; increased risk of esophageal cancer; East Asian ancestry; Disulfiram not effective for alcoholism.
(A;G) 3.5 Asian Flush; worse hangovers; increased risk of esophageal cancer; East Asian ancestry; Disulfiram probably not effective for alcoholism.
(G;G) 2 Alcohol Flush: Normal, doesn't flush. Normal hangovers. Normal risk of Alcoholism. Normal risk of Esophageal Cancer. Disulfiram is effective for alcoholism.

In this sampling the Europeans had all GG, though even the Asians weren't all positive for the Asian Flush variants.

One thing to keep in mind is that this doesn't mean zero Europeans have AA or AG variants, just that's it's probably very rare. The sample sizes for these tests only show so much.
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Old 12-11-2017, 07:10 PM
 
290 posts, read 136,829 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alandros View Post
One thing to keep in mind is many genetic predispositions aren't exclusive to one specific ethnic set of DNA. Often they are simply found much more likely in said people.

For example

https://www.snpedia.com/index.php/Rs17822931

The body odor and ear wax gene, with three variations


(C;C) 2 Wet earwax. Normal body odour. Normal colostrum.
(C;T) 2 Wet earwax. Slightly better body odour.
(T;T) 2.5 Dry earwax. No body odour. Likely Asian ancestry. Reduced colostrum

There's a reason they say "likely" Asian ancestry (also this kind a shows if you know Asian people who think non-Asians are smelly they may be right lol)... There was indeed early gene flows between different regions such as Europe, Eurasia, and Asia, it was just limited and heavily diffused which makes the traits far less likely though not unheard of.
I just took a look at my "raw data" from Ancestry, and I am (C;C) at Rs17822931
What does this means in regards to my race?
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Old Yesterday, 12:13 PM
 
7,528 posts, read 4,435,997 times
Reputation: 4772
Quote:
Originally Posted by ironlady View Post
I'm a Caucasian woman with Asian Flush Syndrome. I'm still awaiting my DNA results, but there is no evidence from my genealogical research to indicate I have any Asian ancestry. AFS is rarely, rarely (if ever) found in European races and only a very small number of Indians in the Southwest.

I know most of my ancestors came from England or Scotland long before 1776, and many were in Texas by the 1830s. So I can't for the life of me understand why I have AFS. It's not just that alcohol makes my face red, it makes me extremely uncomfortable--even two glasses of wine makes me sick and gives me a hangover. It almost feels like I'm ingesting poison when I drink, which is exactly what many Japanese and Koreans say.

I know it's a long shot, but does anyone have any idea why a Caucasian woman with European (and perhaps Cherokee ancestry) have AFS?

TYIA!

I've never heard of this AFS.

Ever been to China? They drink like a mofo.

I think all races have it. Your body does not take well to alcohol just like some people get dizzy watching 3D movies.

.
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Old Yesterday, 10:22 PM
 
Location: Mile High
294 posts, read 246,412 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beb0p View Post
I've never heard of this AFS.

Ever been to China? They drink like a mofo.

I think all races have it. Your body does not take well to alcohol just like some people get dizzy watching 3D movies.

.
I can't find the source at the moment--it's buried in some scientific journal--the gene that eliminates the ability to process alcohol originated (they think) on the Japanese coast as a "protective gene" to prevent alcoholism. Roughly 40% of Japanese, Chinese, and Koreans have AFS. So yeah, 60% of those in China can drink like a mofo . There have been times in my life I have too, even if it hurt like a mofo. I won't now that I know it causes esophageal cancer for people with AFS: https://www.nbcnews.com/health/asian...ncer-1C6437432.
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Old Yesterday, 10:24 PM
 
Location: Mile High
294 posts, read 246,412 times
Reputation: 555
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alandros View Post
One thing to keep in mind is that this doesn't mean zero Europeans have AA or AG variants, just that's it's probably very rare. The sample sizes for these tests only show so much.
I guess I'm just one of the lucky ones, eh?
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Old Yesterday, 10:26 PM
 
Location: Mile High
294 posts, read 246,412 times
Reputation: 555
Quote:
Originally Posted by ashbeeigh View Post
A very quick google search comes up with an explanation. It's not just people who are genetically Asian that suffer from this. https://getsunset.com/blogs/news/can...f-im-not-asian

On the flip side, I have a cousin who has thalassemia and that is linked to mediterraneans genetically. Based on our family history there's no sign of any southern European genes. However, I just got back my FTDNA results and ran it through gedmatch and found a big chunk of southern European genes, so. It could go either way.
There might be some surprises in the DNA. My husband, the guy who thought he was a Scottish/Czech/Jew just got his results tonight and found out he has sub-Saharan African and Middle Eastern in his lineage. SURPRISE!
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Old Today, 12:42 AM
 
Location: colorado springs, CO
2,696 posts, read 1,065,804 times
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I'm a white female; my mom was full Greek (1st generation American born) & my dad Irish/Scottish/English.

I also have AFS & it can be pretty extreme, although I don't suffer any ill feelings. I remember startling people while drinking at parties because unbeknownst to me; I was covered in huge, purple, blotchy hives.

I did 23 & Me, then cross-referenced through a few different calculators on Gedmatch. Turns out; I have some Asian from both parents, including East Asian from my mom & South & West Asian from both.

I'm getting interesting references from my dad's kit, as he tested also, to the Samoyedic populations in very Northern Russia. They have Asian facial features but are known for natural blonde hair & green eyes.

I couldn't even tell you the last time I drank alcohol & I don't miss it at all. It just seems counter-intuitive to ingest something that makes you look like you will need an epi-pen at any moment.
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Old Today, 03:01 AM
 
791 posts, read 610,037 times
Reputation: 1052
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozarknation View Post
I just took a look at my "raw data" from Ancestry, and I am (C;C) at Rs17822931
What does this means in regards to my race?
Nothing absolutely, that's simply the most common variant for Europeans and Africans and pretty rare for East Asians.
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