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Old 07-11-2010, 05:03 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caleb Longstreet View Post
Whole thing gives me a headache, just like my wife but, I think I can boil it all down.....

True South? Mississippi, Alabama, Georgia, South Carolina, Tennessee and North Carolina. Defining the rest will ultimately lead you to areas too far and perhaps too diluted to note....

While Virginians will no doubt blow a gasket about being left out as will parts of Kentucky, Arkansas should just be quiet as it's only damp, had a goofy President with an evil wife, and a gawdy vacation destination, Texas is unique and all by itself, to it's credit, Illinois and Indiana??? Are you kidding???

Hope this helps....
Oh Lord help us, another one of these damn Deep South purists!

But come to think of it, you ain't so bad as some I know (me having ancestral roots in Mississippi and Alabama, a few are distant kin! LOL), who confine it even further to exclude the Carolinas and Tennessee!

But I have to say I chuckled a little -- although I had seen variations on it before -- over the North/South differences.
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Old 07-11-2010, 05:08 PM
 
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IMHO I have two suggestions:
1)I would combine your Northern South region on the South map and your lower Midwest region on the Midwest map cause the two areas are practically the same. Just call it all the Lower Midwest. This should include St Louis, Springfield IL, Evansville, Cincinnati, and Columbus all together.

2)Split Appalacia into two regions at the line JJW drew and extend upper appalacia up into PA. The line should split northern and southern WV in half cause the boundries somewhere in there.

These maps are cool. It'd be neat if you could combine them and add in the NE and West eventually completing the whole US.
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Old 07-11-2010, 05:10 PM
 
10,167 posts, read 17,117,165 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MN55 View Post
IMHO I have two suggestions:
1)I would combine your Northern South region on the South map and your lower Midwest region on the Midwest map cause the two areas are practically the same. Just call it all the Lower Midwest.

2)Split Appalacia into two regions at the line JJW drew and extend it up into PA. The line should split northern and southern WV in half cause the boundries somewhere in there.

These maps are cool. It'd be neat if you could combine them and add in the NE and West eventually completing the whole US.
Good suggestion!
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Old 07-11-2010, 05:29 PM
 
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In terms of the Lower Midwest/Upper South boundary. It should be based on which traits are most dominant. But I would also have it as a softer line due to being a more fluid boundary over time and make a note that these two regions are closer to each other than their parent region.

The difference in the two I have a couple of base ideas on how to list a place as one over the other.

South:Midwest
Baptists outnumber Catholics (or if info is around Evangelicals outnumber Catholics): The reverse is true
In ancestry
American+English+Scottish+Scotch-Irish>German:Reverse is true
>5% black in rural areas:Mostly less (Note: Many Southern areas have few blacks in rural areas due to lack of plantations in antebellum period. This is more that any place with greater than 5% automatically counts as a Southern trait but less than doesn't preclude it)
Related to relgion
Which is more culturally important in an area, Catholicism or Protestant (especially Evangelical in nature)? Interesting not is that Catholics seem more devout in the South and lower Midwest than in other areas.
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Old 07-11-2010, 05:45 PM
 
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The area you have listed as Northern South, the border is basically in the right place, I wouldn't change the border. But you have described it as "Mostly Southern culture with a Midwest influence". I think the whole area is mostly Midwest culture with a Southern influence, even as far south as places like northeast Oklahoma and southwest Missouri. Midwest with a Southern influence, not Southern with a Midwest influence.

I would change the name to something other than Northern South. The region is not really part of the South. It is more like Southern Midwest. The part that is in Arkansas is in the South, so is the part that is in Kentucky. The rest of the region is more Midwest than South.
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Old 07-11-2010, 06:07 PM
 
Location: Englewood, Near Eastside Indy
8,340 posts, read 14,102,864 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyingwriter View Post
JJW, it may seem Midwestern to you, being from the lower South, but to me (from the Midwest) it seems very Southern. I've spent a lot of time in Northern Kentucky, Southern Indiana and Southern Ohio, and those areas are nothing like the Midwest. I made a Midwest map earlier, and the blue ends right where the Lower Midwest starts. If anything, I would move the blue further north to include Indianapolis and Cincinnati.
Your map should be called; degrees of southern-ness in relation to my perspective from Minnesota. I can promise you that I have spent a lot more time in Indiana, Cincinnati, and Kentucky than you have. To suggest that Kentucky has a lot in common with Cincinnati and most of Indiana is.....foolish.
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Old 07-11-2010, 06:14 PM
 
Location: Southern Minnesota
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State lines mean nothing. I flew into Bloomington, Indiana once, expecting to find the Midwest, albeit the Lower Midwest. I stepped off the plane and . . . thick Southern drawls, Magnolia trees, red dirt, steep hills. That's not the Midwest.

I've spent a lot of time in places like Indianapolis, Cincinnati, Columbus, St. Louis - those areas are Midwestern. The "Southern side of Cincinnati" (Northern KY), Bloomington, IN, Southern Illinois, Evansville, Athens, OH, etc. are the SOUTH. You do see Midwest influences as you head north in the region, but they are still the South. Driving north on I-65 in Indiana, you can see the South end and the Midwest begin somewhere around Greenwood, Indiana.

I agree with MN55 that the Lower Midwest and Northern South have a lot in common with each other and fit better as one region, but if I have to divide South from Midwest, then I'll stick by my line. Also, Columbus, Cincinnati, Indianapolis and Springfield, IL are all together on my Midwest map as "Lower Midwest." The Northern South starts just south of those cities.

Toxic Toast: Cincinnati is NOT on the South map - Northern Kentucky is. The blue ends right at the Ohio River in Covington. Also, I included the southern 1/3 of Indiana, not "most of Indiana."
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Old 07-11-2010, 06:32 PM
 
Location: Englewood, Near Eastside Indy
8,340 posts, read 14,102,864 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyingwriter View Post
State lines mean nothing. I flew into Bloomington, Indiana once, expecting to find the Midwest, albeit the Lower Midwest. I stepped off the plane and . . . thick Southern drawls, Magnolia trees, red dirt, steep hills. That's not the Midwest.
Thick southern drawls, in Bloomington? Uhhh.....no. I have lived in the south. Places like Bloomington, Evansville, Cincinnati; they are not southern. They may seem southern to you, but you are an outsider from Minnesota. You are not exactly qualified to talk about how southern a place is. I have lived it. You have not. I will agree, Evansville is a lot more southern than anything else in Indiana; but it does not approach the southerness of neighboring Henderson, KY. Not even close. There is a pretty obvious difference also between New Albany and Louisville.

Quote:
Originally Posted by flyingwriter View Post
Toxic Toast: Cincinnati is NOT on the South map - Northern Kentucky is. The blue ends right at the Ohio River in Covington. Also, I included the southern 1/3 of Indiana, not "most of Indiana."
I am aware. The only reason you include Cincinnati in the Midwest is because you were called out in the other thread.
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Old 07-11-2010, 06:38 PM
 
Location: Southern Minnesota
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Here's the latest version of the map.

South boundaries - Google Maps
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Old 07-11-2010, 06:53 PM
 
Location: Southern Minnesota
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Both South & Midwest combined

South boundaries - Google Maps
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