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Old 04-24-2016, 04:59 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smash XY View Post
I think there's a process that you forget it's the multiplication. When other immigrants arrived (Germans, Irish, Dutch or Scandinavians), they mixed with the English Americans already present and thus their number grew more and more. It doesn't necessarily mean they're fully or mostly of English descent, it can be 1/8 English or 1/16 but they still have an English ancestry.

Thirty years ago, they represented on average 25% in the south, I know there have been many transplants from the northeast, midwest and west since then but not from the point of completely changing the demographic of the south.

Keep in mind that the South hasn't received as many Europeans during the great wave of immigration of the 19th century as the Northeast and the Midwest so most southerners can trace their lineage to the colonial era, therefore, English ancestry who were the most numerous but also Scotch-Irish and Scottish.



I'm not confusing English and British, I really speak about Americans tracing their lineage to England alone. I didn't even bring the fact that Scotch-Irish & Scottish ancestry combined are only 9 million, which if you think about it and look at their early arrival must be much higher.
Oh watch out now, it really depends what states, see. In Utah for example, many Mormons and so forth intermarry between each other, thus there is much more of a chance to find a person of predominantly English ancestry than in the south!
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Old 04-25-2016, 08:23 PM
 
4,690 posts, read 8,589,642 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norse View Post
Ok, just needed to post because this age old arguement needs to to be put to rest. Americans have become such German wannabes and self haters its ridiculous.

Firstly, immigration:

People from the British isles have been immigrating to this country in mass numbers SINCE colonial times. Lets backtrack a little the largest wave of Germans came in the 19th century, the greatest number was 6 million. What are you smoking to think 6 million German Americans could outnumber/outbreed the population of British Americans who have been migrating for hundreds of years in such a short time? Clearly nowhere near 40 or 50 million. The real German American input should be much lower & far less than even 20 million (Even today Caucasians from the British Isles still make up the bulk of European immigrants). Some people claim most Americans in the Midwest are German. Ok, lets examine that theory for a minute, all those states have relatively small populations and even if they were all "100% German states" they would not NEARLY have the number to make up 50 million, i mean c'mon.

The problem is here, German is foreign to Americans. You have a lot of Americans who don't know their ancestries past 3 generations so they either A) Lie, don't know what they are. B) Pick the most recent ethnicity ignoring their ancestors. English has blended in and become synonymous with "American", American culture is dominantly Anglo, its not as foreign, not as desired.

Secondly, Phenotype & Genetic Data:

No matter where you go in the United States. You will not find many White Americans who look like Til Sweiger or even Arnold Swarzenegger. Germans & Scandinavians look quite foreign next to the Typical white American who looks clearly of British isles origin (Note, German/Scandinavian phenotype =/= Blonde, blue eyed most Scandinavians have a clearly baltid influenced head shape that is foreign in America). Just because you're blonde does not mean you look like other blondes. Just like just because you're blonde doesn't mean you have a Nordic skull shape. As most Scandinavians are not Nordic in phenotype. They are Crogmagnid/Baltid. I don't know where the all Germans/Scandinavians blonde stereotype comes from anyway. Far from the truth, but its a moot point really because nearly ALL German Americans came from the South and this number also included non ethnic Germans. The South is ethnically different from the North. You have Germans who are darker in pigmentation & hair color and A LOT also have Slavic input from the history with their border they had with Poland.

Do you find this to be more typical of White Americans




or these obvious British isles types that can be found in all corners of America.

















One was Australian, Two were Brits (and i gurantee you if i asked Americans to distinquish the brits they would be lost. One is rather easy because he has a cricket bat, the other not so much as he has a look that is pretty uber white american) & the rest American. Yet all of them are not foreign in any of those 3 countries. These are more or less the faces of the majority of entertainers, news anchors, and politicians of the US, Canada, & Australia. Add in the fact that most presidents were predominantly of English/British isles ancestry. That is no coincidence. If all your politicians look like it, if all your entertainers look like it then you can only be mostly it!

For every typical American white actor/actress there is a British look alike counterpart.

British isles ancestry is terribly underreported in the US, there's no way around it when all the evidence shows it. I am not shocked that its this way. Americans confuse phenotypes a lot and many of them don't even know what terms like "Nordic" actualy mean. I bet if half actually visited England they would see there is no extreme difference in how the British look from typical Americans.

This is an English guy




He could easily come here, put on a fake American accent and NOONE would question whether he's American or not (Hell i recall some Americans not even knowing Christian Bale, Scott Speedman, & Kate Bekinsale was british) because his look is found everywhere in America where there is a strong white population. I see this type almost everyday.

Not even in Minnesota (the state claimed as Nordic land) do typical white americans look Scandinavian. It doesn't matter who you compare. Politicians, Actors, Singers, Pornstars the bulk of them look no different than typical Anglos in other Anglo dominated countries. Canadians (who are also mostly of british isles descent) as well as Australians ultimately don't look that much different from typical white Americans. Canadian actors can come here and pass as a typical White American (and Canada has an even smaller German input than America). Most people might think most of our actors in our Tv shows are American? NOPE, a lot of them are actualy Australian, British, & Canadian import actors like they were in Legend of the Seeker, Spartacus, Battlestar Gallactica, and many other mainstream television shows. Yet an American sees them as a typical White American when they don't use their accents. Thats more than enough evidence of who the real majority is. British people can (and have) easily come to the United States and fit in with the typical WASP population of America. Ive been to England, and honestly its like being in a less obese America.

TheApricity, Forumbiodiversity, most Americans who post their 23andme results (DNA testing) on these forums cluster with the UK more than anything. Not Germany. And most foreign people on these antropology sites who visit America come to the same conclusion. The majority of the whites look like whites from the British isles and other Anglo dominated nations such as New Zealand, Canada, Australia etc.

What America does have, is a load of Germaphiles. I don't understand for the life of me why more Americans aren't more proud of their British ancestries they invented & contributed a hell of a lot more to the modern world than Germans did in all fields, Be proud.

Third, Surnames:

Don't be silly. The assumption that EVERY single German American family could have Anglicised their names is extremely ridiculous and unfounded. As there are Italians and many other groups who still retain their original surnames. Heh, you could also turn that around and say how do you know that many of those Germans weren't actually German jews? or that many of the existing German surnames were not ethnic Germans. You could even go a bit further and say how do you know many of the people who report German ancestry could have had some non ethnic German speaking ancestor? I knew a guy who up until a few days ago thought his family was primarily German & Irish. Turns out he's mostly of English stock.

Regardless of African Americans having English names. If the so called German Americans were as high as the number claimed they were, you better be damn well you would see German surnames somewhere in the top & yet you do not.

Using the Census is pretty much useless at this point since demographers have already agreed that it was an overcount. Not to mention non ethnics & mixed people are also counted which renders its pretty inacurate. Irish are another group that should not be as high, as many of them AREN'T ethnic. The majority of Irish Americans were actualy Ulster-Scots.......see, the census doesn't project reality well at all. Keep in mind this is a census that also includes Arabs as white & also includes Hispanics as an ethnic group,

Fact is, the British component is the strongest in Whites of the Anglosphere. Most German Americans are not even close to being pure. Many Americans are mixed, but that does not negate the fact that the British component is strongest. Other white Americans will almost ALWAYS have English, Scottish, Welsh, or Irish input. Even the two Dutch presidents had British isles input & even the current Black one has British isles input. Americans just love overestimated non british isles ancestries i blame part of this on making "English" synonymous with "American".


False. You seem to be confusing the term "English" with "British". Yes there would more Americans of British ancestry than German. If we added the Irish then for sure, they'll be in the majority. You are also in stereotyping Germans in the "typical Nordic" clause. Germans are not Scandinavians by all means, there is a much greater variety in Germany than in the entire British Isles! The "typical" Nordics (blonde hair+blue eyes) are the Icelanders, Norwegians, Swedish, Danish, Faroese Islanders and also the Finnish. Blonde hair is common enough in Germany and the British Isles, but is not typical enough as it in Scandinavian nations. The British and the Irish as a whole have a higher frequency of very pale or freckled skin, blue or light eyes, reddish hair than the Germans. 78% of the Brits have blue or green eyes (ScottishDNA Project 2014), this as high or higher than the average for northern Germany which is the lightest-eyed part of Germany. If we separate the British, Scotland is roughly as blue-eyed as Denmark, but the Scots are on average only darker -haired than Danes.
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Old 01-06-2018, 10:42 AM
 
5,322 posts, read 1,994,130 times
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Saxonworld post an immense amount of disinformation that relies on the ignorance of his audience to be accepted.

It sounds good because he mixes in a lot of correct information. This also makes any point by point argument with him immensely tedious and a complete waste of time because, in my opinion, he has a political agenda that he won't deviate from.

My advice is to ignore his information in full, so as to not be misled. Instead, do your own research (meaning that you also don't have to take my word for it).

Merely start with the three early main Germanic tribes that he mentions and work out from there in terms of tribal identity. Reference the German dialect map on Wikipedia to start. The dialects will point to the tribes. The far north and the east tribes are relatively unimportant in the beginning, though not unimportant in the larger view.

Note: The East German dialects are extinct because those people mixed with Slavic and Italian culture. Though, these Germanic people still exist as de facto tribal political entities in many cases.

Political geography is overwhelmingly still regional everywhere in the West, and not so national as Saxonworld implies.

ie: An extension of this is that he thinks, going on his picture labeling, that someone of Germanic descent living in the political borders of Celtic lands makes him a Celt. As we see everywhere, political papers do a very poor job of defining a tribe. In nice, liberal political tirade's it is asserted that they do. However, the continuing history of the world forcefully maintains that they do not.

Very often, these type of tribal insertions into other lands are also marked by differing economic interests and differing regional political representations. Just as we have in the USA. Just as Europe had before the nation sate. And just as it continues to have.

Saxonworld also over-generalizes as o the amount of mixing that has occurred. For instance, he claims that Germans are or were always mixed based on pockets of borderland regional mixing. Note the over-generalization, which overlooks still defining political separations that also still demarcate significant genetic and ethnic separations.

Pay attention to haplotype maps of Europe, how they align with stem duchy maps that represent each tribal type (aligning all of this information is admittedly a large task) and learn how to identify different tribal types on sight. Learn how to tell someone of Germanic descent from someone of Celtic descent, and learn how to tell what mixed types look like. This is all toward learning how to accurately interpret the real machinations of modern politics and conflict, and nothing more.

Identifying tribes will allow you to identify their traditional economic modes through their preferred geographic locations over time. The economic mode of international trade and finance is the natural way of life for the coastal tribes, represented by the Ingaevones. This is why they later populated the coast of the USA, but not inland. This is why the USA coasts are overwhelmingly liberal, while inland in non-international urban areas is conservative. Empire vs international city. Airistocrat vs merchant. Emperor vs pope. Guelf vs Gibillene. Look at the European history.

Learn to look at history accurately, and not in terms of "White" and "Asian" for example. Inter-tribal "white" fighting has defined modern history in the West, and it still continues to do so. For instance, which "white" tribe(s) actually perpetrated slavery and which did not? Which so called "German" tribes fought the so-called "Germans"?

And to drive the point home: what you are actually looking at is the battle of economic power, which then absolutely defines politics (as well as tribal religious forms).

Mercantilism vs farming vs industry.

What does that mean? It means that the political pawns are expendable should they ever become non-useful.

Why do you think that the government directly funds the existence of immense swaths of urban underclass? Because they like them or that it has hope for them? Don't be childish.

It's for one reason and one reason only: to ensure the continued existence of the finance-political-international merchant class through the continuance of the democratic mode of government that ensures the suppression of the economically inherent imperial (monarchy) mode of government of the agrarian class. That's the one and only reason. As soon as the underclass is not needed to ensure their continued existence, they will be de-funded at best and perhaps something worse. The underclass is a required bug, and thus increasingly a feature, of internationalism. In the future, and until the merchant class does not need the underclass, the dystopia will worsen. The underclass needs to stay an underclass for the system to work. If they gained functional family values, then they might gain functional tribal interests in land ownership that would, through the inherent anti-democratic politics (imperialism) in land ownership, inherently combat the political interests of international mercantilism.

But don't kid yourself that this internationalism (and the required internationalist interpretations of tribalism and history that Saxonworld perpetuates) is for a shining happy world where everyone loves on another. The merchant class does not love you. They merely need you.

Figure out how and if you are a pawn that exists merely to ensure the continuity of the dominance of a particular type of economic system, whatever it is.

Over-generalizing obscures history and politics. Which makes one unknowledgeable. Which makes one equivalent to an underclass (modern slave class) citizen.

Last edited by golgi1; 01-06-2018 at 11:30 AM..
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Old 01-06-2018, 11:02 PM
 
10,552 posts, read 13,107,085 times
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Seems like German. I can't think of any American born person I know that claims English ancestry. Scottish and Irish? Sure.
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