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Yes in the NYC area and Wisconsin, Minnesota and the Dakotas English ancestry is pretty rare. It's pretty common almost everywhere else. I think it's impossible to believe there are actually more Americans of German than English ancestry. There were at least five times as many people of English ancestry than German in colonial America, giving the English a massive headstart. As I said earlier in the thread, there were 8 million people in the US born in Germany or with one or two German-born parents in the 1900 census, out of a total population of 76 million (and 67 million whites). Most German immigration occurred 1830-1890 (with a peak in the 1880s), which means that a majority at the descendants of these immigrants would still have been first or second generation. Even if you add in the third- and fourth-generations, colonial German descendants, and the Germans from Russia that went to Kansas and the Dakotas it couldn't have been more than 15 million or about 20% of the population. Given that the southern and eastern European immigration hadn't peaked yet in 1900, at least half of white Americans - maybe 35 million - would have been of colonial stock. That yields about 20 million of English ancestry off the bat. Adding in 19th century immigration from England and of Canadians of English origin, brings up to maybe 25 million. Also the denial of German heritage changing of names, etc. occurred mostly during the anti-German hysteria of World War I. In 1900 it's likely that about half of German Americans were still speaking German at home.
That's a rather convincing arguement. Though, if you remove the south, assuming most (90% ?) of Germans were in the south, the German % could be higher than English. Until the last 50 years, there wasn't much movement between the two regions (excluding the Great Migration), and were almost independent from each other demographically.
Btw, Census 2010:
Wisconsin: English + American: 9.6%, German: 43.7%
Minnesota: English + American: 9.1%, German: 36.8% [but Swedish is 9.2%]
South Dakota: English + American: 10.4%, German: 42.8% [but Swedish is 14.7%]
Looking at some suburban NYC counties, English + American is about 7-8%, German ranges from a high of 16% in Suffolk, NY to only 7% in Westchester. Fairfield County, CT (home to Grenwich) stereotyped as WASPy is 11.5% English + American. Grenwich itself is 13.3%, but a similar % of Greeks(!), Irish and Italians.
also referring to some of the photos of Germans posted earlier in the thread, they look like photos of northern Germans. Parts of southern Germany aren't particularly blond, and are probably on average a bit darker complexioned than British. The colonial German settlers of Pennsyvlania were mostly from southern Germany. People I've met from that area don't have a particularly light complexion.
I'm pretty sure that in the West as a whole there's more English than German ancestry. German ancestry is ahead in the Midwest and Pennsylvania and probably New York/New Jersey. English ancestry is far more common in New England and the South. Also, the English to German ratio in New England and the South would be much larger than the German to English ratio in the Midwest and Mid-Atlantic states, given the line of settlement from Virginia running to southern Ohio, Indiana, etc. and of Yankee settlement in Upstate NY and Michigan (Wisconsin/Minnesota Yankees were quickly dwarfed by Germans and Scandinavians). Of course descendants of Pennsylvania Germans migrated to Ohio, Indiana, Kansas, etc. as well.
Last edited by King of Kensington; 10-29-2013 at 03:56 PM..
I should have probably blacked out their names. I'm going to try this with women, posted separately in a random order. Maybe you're right that there's something to this, but I'm not letting you start with the information pre-supplied. There's one each of America, England, Germany, Ireland, and Italy.
The italian stick out as being a bit more tanned and almond/darker eyed, you can tell the southern european morph there.
american stick out more as not being a very defined european looks, the different structure of face of them all.
Irish female face has the typical rough masculine expression
The german face is more warm undertone although light skinned, lighter hair colo than others and overall the prettiest
The english female is a considerably more femenine version of the Irish.
Last edited by Traveler86; 11-01-2013 at 10:34 PM..
If you add up English ancestry + "American" ancestry in the 1980 census, you get 62 million or 27% of the population or one third of the white population. Which sound about right.
What increased even more than "American" ancestry was not reporting any ancestry at all. In 1980, there were 23 million (10%) not reporting any ancestry. This was nearly half located in the South but differed that it included a lot of blacks. The number in the South reporting "Afro-American" ancestry was 79% of the Black population. Thus close to 20% of blacks weren't reporting an ancestry.
In 2000, unreported ancestry had risen to 54 million or 19%. Since the number reporting "Afro-American" continued to increase, it seems reasonable to assume that a disproportionate number not reporting were white Southerners.
Looking at Alabama as an example, 1980 out of a population of 3,894,000:
English: 1,140,000
American: 506,000
English + American: 1,646,000 (42.3%)
Irish: 633,000 (16.3%)
German: 308,000 (7.9%)
Not reported: 537,000 (13.8%)
In 2000 out of a population of 4,447,000:
English: 345,000
American: 756,000
English + American: 1,101,000 (24.8%)
Irish: 342,000 (7.7%)
German: 254,000 (5.7%)
Not reported: N/A
Given the drop in the number of English ancestry - by two-thirds and a smaller but drop in "Irish" (mainly Scots-Irish) - and with relatively little change in Alabama's demographics over that 20 year period, it's obvious a good number of white Southerners are not reporting anything at all.
Except that's only one ancestor. As to white ethnics intermarrying, yes, but they may intermarry with each other instead of someone with English ancestry.
90 % it's pretty high, I'd say it's more like 20 % of African Americans who have English/Scots ancestry. Some scientific analysis indicates that current African Americans inherit about 14–17.7% of their ancestry from Europeans, the most common "non-black" mix is English and Scots-Irish.
I kinda feel that because you come from the Northeast, you think English ancestry may not be as numerous in the all country because it's no longer the largest ancestry there, am i right ?
90% might be too high, but I would not even think to put it below 75%. Excluding recent African black Americans, and Haitian-Americans and other West indies people, I'd say almost anyone descended from antebellum black Americans has some English ancestry. All that history of intermarrying. All it takes is one English ancestor for you to qualify as having English ancestry. I'm not trying to be an advocate here, I sort of dislike most things English or British, but I'm trying to estimate what seems like a likely truth.
States with 40%+ English/American ancestry, 1980 (in thousands):
Utah 837 (57.3%)
Kentucky 1,796 (49.1%)
Maine 537 (47.8%)
West Virginia 887 (45.5%)
Tennessee 2,004 (43.7%)
Alabama 1,646 (42.3%)
Vermont 214 (41.9%)
Arkansas 939 (41.1%)
Virginia 2,182 (40.8%)
Idaho 385 (40.8%)
Georgia 2,218 (40.6%)
North Carolina 2,357 (40.1%)
So basically New England Yankees, white Southerners and Mormons.
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