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Indeed, that's why I put the caveat in there "when consider where they are located and how many tourists they get..."
I don't quite understand what you mean by that. There are many regions in France and Spain that tourists don't typically visit and the people there certainly don't get to talk to tourists every day. I grew up in the Netherlands, a tiny country that gets millions of tourists every year, but since I live in the eastern countryside I have never encountered foreign tourists there (except for a few Germans). These people don't know English because they speak it with tourists, they know it because they learnt it in school or elsewhere. It's no different from an American learning a foreign language. Of course, I understand that Americans and Canadians generally don't travel abroad as much as Europeans do. That's why I compared it to an American speaking Spanish or a Canadian speaking French, since these are languages most Americans/Canadians are familiar with. In fact, I'd argue the average American living in a state like California will encounter more Spanish-speaking people than the average Frenchmen encounters English-speaking tourists.
A lot of Americans vastly overestimate their own linguistic abilities. They think being able to order off a menu or buy train tickets in a foreign language makes them fluent in it.
I think there is a lot of truth in this.... I can get directions, order, say hello etc etc in Spanish, French ( Learnt them both at school) Italian and German. If someone asked me what languages I speak I say English. As a European I would not want to embarrass myself by saying a speak a language when I only know a hundred or so words.... and therefore clearly can't speak it !!
My husband speaks French, German and English... fluently.. but after a day or so in italy his italian improves from school level to chit chat level..... he would never say he speaks Italian though because he doesn't consider his 2/300 words make him competent.....
I think part of it is financial ability and part is sheer disinterest. The average US household barely gets by.
The financial part I agree with, but not the disinterested part. I only know two people who have stated they have little interest in traveling. The vast majority would love to, but simply cannot afford it. Most people I know are working to lower middle class, as there's where I reside.
Since when is ok cupid a representation of the average person?
Show us the results of a better survey.
A sample is a sample. Any sample is statistically valid, if there is no characteristic within the sample that would select out certain responses or skew the data. You show us that female respondents to OKCupid are more or less likely than the general population to be multilingual, and I will regard your evidence as a legitimate cause for a wider margin for error.
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As for the reason Americans do not travel abroad, the main one, in my opinion, is that American do not get enough paid vacation time to get further than Orlando.
It is very rare to find an American who gets 4 weeks vacation, and very few get three weeks. Many don't even get two until they have been on the job for a couple of years. In most European countries, the minimum is four weeks, even in the first year of employment, and a lot of people of young traveling age already get 6 or 7 weeks with pay every year.
Also, American students can't afford to travel, because they have to work through the summer earning their $20K per year it takes to go to college, while in a lot of European countries, higher education is virtually free.
I lived in Antiqua, Guatemala, for nearly a year, which is a popular destination for international students to take an intensive course in Spanish. I saw hundreds, possibly thousands pass through. I would be very surprised if 10% of them were Americans, even though an American wanting to study Spanish could literally get there on a bus. Nearly all had flown over from Europe, to study Spanish as a 3rd or 4th or 5th language.
Since when is ok cupid a representation of the average person?
I wondered that too, but figured I was probably too geriatric to be in the know. Locking crutches with someone is about all Cupid seems to find OK for me.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88
Show us the results of a better survey.
A sample is a sample. Any sample is statistically valid, if there is no characteristic within the sample that would select out certain responses or skew the data. You show us that female respondents to OKCupid are more or less likely than the general population to be multilingual, and I will regard your evidence as a legitimate cause for a wider margin for error.
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As for the reason Americans do not travel abroad, the main one, in my opinion, is that American do not get enough paid vacation time to get further than Orlando.
It is very rare to find an American who gets 4 weeks vacation, and very few get three weeks. Many don't even get two until they have been on the job for a couple of years. In most European countries, the minimum is four weeks, even in the first year of employment, and a lot of people of young traveling age already get 6 or 7 weeks with pay every year.
Also, American students can't afford to travel, because they have to work through the summer earning their $20K per year it takes to go to college, while in a lot of European countries, higher education is virtually free.
I lived in Antiqua, Guatemala, for nearly a year, which is a popular destination for international students to take an intensive course in Spanish. I saw hundreds, possibly thousands pass through. I would be very surprised if 10% of them were Americans, even though an American wanting to study Spanish could literally get there on a bus. Nearly all had flown over from Europe, to study Spanish as a 3rd or 4th or 5th language.
Most of the women on ok cupid express a strong desire to travel to exotic locations, while to alot of people here 'exotic' means going to Bali with about a million other Aussies. Ok cupid is for 'hip' people, compared to say match.com or plenty of fish which show what the average Jack or Jill is like.
I don't quite understand what you mean by that. There are many regions in France and Spain that tourists don't typically visit and the people there certainly don't get to talk to tourists every day. I grew up in the Netherlands, a tiny country that gets millions of tourists every year, but since I live in the eastern countryside I have never encountered foreign tourists there (except for a few Germans). These people don't know English because they speak it with tourists, they know it because they learnt it in school or elsewhere. .
True, but most people in these non-touristed areas of France and Spain would tend to speak their own language only. People who speak English as a second language in these countries are found disproportionately in the more heavily-touristed areas.
The Netherlands are not a good comparison, as they (like the Scandinavian countries) have a high level of English proficiency in their countries, due to a variety of factors which are not necessarily tourism-related.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LindavG
It's no different from an American learning a foreign language. Of course, I understand that Americans and Canadians generally don't travel abroad as much as Europeans do. That's why I compared it to an American speaking Spanish or a Canadian speaking French, since these are languages most Americans/Canadians are familiar with. In fact, I'd argue the average American living in a state like California will encounter more Spanish-speaking people than the average Frenchmen encounters English-speaking tourists.
I will not dispute that Americans and English-speaking Canadians do very poorly when it comes to second-language learning.
I have seen this stuff before and have always found it to be grossly unfair. You could ambush random people on the street anywhere in the world, ask them questions out the blue on topics they know nothing about, edit out the minority of smart ones, and make any nationality look stupid.
Americans in general are the least cultured people.
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