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View Poll Results: What states are part of cultural Appalachia?
Alabama 19 36.54%
Georgia 30 57.69%
South Carolina 20 38.46%
North Carolina 44 84.62%
Tennessee 46 88.46%
Kentucky 48 92.31%
West Virginia 49 94.23%
Virginia 41 78.85%
Maryland 30 57.69%
Ohio 19 36.54%
Pennsylvania 43 82.69%
Upstate New York (Southern/Central/Western) 28 53.85%
Upstate New York (Eastern/Northern) 13 25.00%
New Jersey 3 5.77%
Connecticut 2 3.85%
Massachusetts 4 7.69%
Vermont 10 19.23%
New Hampshire 10 19.23%
Maine 11 21.15%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 52. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-10-2011, 09:40 PM
 
Location: Appalachian New York, Formerly Louisiana
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LINative View Post
I agree with you but I believe CookieSkoon used to live in Upstate New York and wanted to see what others thought.

Anyway the Southern/Western choice for New York is partially more or less correct because the definition of Appalachia seems to have moved North over the years into Pennsylvania aka Pennsyltucky and southern New York aka the Southern Tier. However Western New York, if it means Buffalo/Niagara Frontier and the Finger Lakes, is not part of Appalachia.

The Northern/Eastern choice is also mostly incorrect. Eastern New York (The Hudson Valley & the Taconic Mountains) is probably more like New England lite than anything else. And Northern New York is the Adirondacks, Lake Champlain and the Thousand Islands which geographically is not part of the Appalachians.
You are correct, save that the southern Finger Lakes are actually in the Appalachians (See Watkins Glen for example). Remember they run almost the entire north/south length of the "snout".

By western NY I meant The areas south of Buffalo since Buffalo and the immediate surrounding area are on the Ontario plains, and far more Midwestern culturally.

Since the cultural effects of NY are so drastically different between the halves east to west, I segmented them to signify the cultural boundary.

But I digress, I don't wish, and hadn't intended, to make this all about NY. It's about all the states mentioned.

I am still curious why West Virginia does not sit at 100% or so. I wish the folks that didn't vote it in would have said why.
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Old 11-10-2011, 09:42 PM
 
Location: 30-40N 90-100W
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CookieSkoon View Post
I segmented NY since the culture of the state is drastically split down between those areas. Further east and north is very New England like whereas further west and south is very Pennsylvanian.

The reason this wasn't done for other states is because the areas of cultural difference are not geographically Appalachian (say, southern Georgia), so they aren't in the running at all. If that makes sense. Whereas New York state is almost entirely in the hills and mountains yet the two halves have very distinct identities I thought were important to the poll.

I did not intend to cause offense or confusion. My apologies.
I think Pennsylvania could also have been segmented as, for the East anyway, it's a fairly long state. Also it seems like Western Pennsylvania is sen as a good deal different than Philadelphia or the like.
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Old 11-10-2011, 09:46 PM
 
Location: Appalachian New York, Formerly Louisiana
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Desert kid View Post
Southern Appalachian (the part that gets most Media attention):
Virginia (western, think "The Waltons")
West Virginia (all of the state)
North Carolina (western part of the state)
Tennessee (pretty much THE stereotypical Appalachian state)
Georgia (Northern 1/3rd, "Deliverance" is there)
Alabama (Same as Georgia, but no Ned Beatty stereotypes)
Kentucky (the OTHER stereotypical Appalachian state)

Northern Appalachian:
Maryland
Pennsylvania
(Western) Ohio
Western/Northern New York
New Hampshire
Vermont
Maine
I like that. I would only change a few details.

West Virginia is actually the stereotypical Appalachian state, rather than Tennessee.

Eastern Ohio rather than western. Western Ohio is mostly plains and it's hills are akin to the coals in Kentucky, which are not actually Appalachian despite the closeness.

Western/Central and eastern NY are geographically Appalachian (Allegheny if you want to be specific). Northern NY is Adirondack, which is debatable since it has northern/New England style Appalachian culture, but it's geologically Canadian Shield.
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Old 11-10-2011, 09:48 PM
 
Location: Appalachian New York, Formerly Louisiana
4,102 posts, read 4,740,688 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas R. View Post
I think Pennsylvania could also have been segmented as, for the East anyway, it's a fairly long state. Also it seems like Western Pennsylvania is sen as a good deal different than Philadelphia or the like.
You are right. The "T" of Pennsylvania, Western PA and the Philadelphia region are all very distinct.

In that regard, northern West Virginia and southern West Virginia are also distinct from one another.
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Old 11-11-2011, 06:04 AM
 
Location: SW Pennsylvania
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Desert kid View Post
Southern Appalachian (the part that gets most Media attention):
Virginia (western, think "The Waltons")
West Virginia (all of the state)
North Carolina (western part of the state)
Tennessee (pretty much THE stereotypical Appalachian state)
Georgia (Northern 1/3rd, "Deliverance" is there)
Alabama (Same as Georgia, but no Ned Beatty stereotypes)
Kentucky (the OTHER stereotypical Appalachian state)

Northern Appalachian:
Maryland
Pennsylvania
(Western) Ohio
Western/Northern New York
New Hampshire
Vermont
Maine
If you go by the Appalachian Regional Commission definition, the northern 2/3 of West Virginia is in northern Appalachia and the remaining 1/3 is in central Appalachia.

Central Appalachia, which also incudes eastern Kentucky, southwestern Virginia, and northeastern Tennessee, is the core Appalachian region if you ask me.

As a comparison, the Tri-Cities region of Morgantown, Fairmont, and Clarksburg, WV is nothing like the Tri-Cities of Bristol, Kingsport, and Johnson City, TN-VA. Northern West Virginia towns have that classic "Rust Belt" look with houses perched close together on the hillsides, very similar to nearby PA and eastern OH. The atmosphere is also different. It's hard to explain, but I know when I am in central or southern Appalachia.

Last edited by tallydude02; 11-11-2011 at 06:16 AM..
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Old 11-11-2011, 06:10 AM
 
Location: SW Pennsylvania
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Here are some examples of northern Appalachia towns centered on southwestern PA, northern WV, eastern OH, and western MD. There are a lot of pictures so it may be slow....

Urban Appalachia 2009 - SkyscraperPage Forum
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Old 11-11-2011, 12:03 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
1,321 posts, read 2,747,558 times
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There is no such thing as "cultural Appalachia", it is impossible to maintain anything like a culture over such a wide swath of territory. The App. Regional Commission is not a cultural or educational organization, it is a political machine for producing pork, their designations have no meaning whatever in terms of culture or history, that is not their concern at all. The southern Appalachians begin in the northern parts of West Virginia, in terms of history, dialect, religion and all the things that define culture Appalachia is not a cultural unit, it is a geological formation.



The first map (public domain) is from the US Census 2000 on Ancestry, light yellow is American and light blue is German.
US Census Ancestry

The second map (from Wikipedia, public domain) is the limits of native born speakers of southern dialect as determined by the Telsur project at the Univ. of Penn. This is the original map.
Southern dialect

The third map is predominant religion by county, red is Baptist (all denominations), green is Methodist (all denominations) and light blue is Catholic. This is my own map from information from the Glenmary Instutute survey. Here is the original map, Leading Church Bodies 2000.
You can find similar information at the Pew US Religion Landscape Survey.
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Old 11-12-2011, 04:12 AM
 
Location: Appalachian New York, Formerly Louisiana
4,102 posts, read 4,740,688 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallydude02 View Post
Here are some examples of northern Appalachia towns centered on southwestern PA, northern WV, eastern OH, and western MD. There are a lot of pictures so it may be slow....

Urban Appalachia 2009 - SkyscraperPage Forum
I always wonder why places in NY are excluded.

Binghamton, Elmira, Corning, Horseheads, Oneonta, Olean, Bath, and even old parts of Ithaca. They are all very much like this from building to hill. Part of that same PA style culture too.

It boggles my mind why the area is seen as just so different than it actually is. I blame NYC's shadow in part.

I'd love to post some photos for your comparison, but I didn't take them. Not sure if I am allowed to. Am I?

By the way, that thread has some excellent photos. Beautiful views.
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Old 11-12-2011, 05:16 AM
 
3,458 posts, read 3,113,280 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CookieSkoon View Post
I always wonder why places in NY are excluded.

Binghamton, Elmira, Corning, Horseheads, Oneonta, Olean, Bath, and even old parts of Ithaca. They are all very much like this from building to hill. Part of that same PA style culture too.

It boggles my mind why the area is seen as just so different than it actually is. I blame NYC's shadow in part.
Personally I'm not familiar with any of these areas. I've never visited them.

However I would raise the question as to whether these were geographically isolated and mostly scots-irish. To me that's a cultural requirement for "being Appalachian".
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Old 11-12-2011, 07:46 AM
 
Location: 30-40N 90-100W
13,856 posts, read 22,976,124 times
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Well if we want maps Scots-Irish is sometimes seen as "Appalachian."

http://www.valpo.edu/geomet/pics/geo...cots_irish.pdf

That leads to some oddities though as Idaho looks pretty Scots-Irish. Still Western North Carolina and Eastern Tennessee do look about the most.
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