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Old 04-02-2012, 04:37 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GraniteStater View Post
Even rural areas of eastern SD have very low population densities, so it has more of a wide open western feel. The Midwest has much higher population densities in its rural counties.
It has a wide open feel, but I don't consider it western.
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Old 04-04-2012, 09:30 AM
 
Location: Jefferson City 4 days a week, St. Louis 3 days a week
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lake County IN View Post
I think it's pretty easy.

The Midwest crowds around the Great Lakes above the former "slave states" of the South, west of the Northeastern states and east of the Rocky Mountain states.
IMHO, the USCB's definition of the Midwest is about as accurate as it gets...using state lines it's impossible to be any more accurate than that. If the neighboring Plains states can't be considered the Midwest, then Oklahoma and Texas can't be considered the south...all of these states, from south to north, follow the same rule...except for the far western parts of these states, they have more in common with their neighbors to the east.

Last edited by stlouisan; 04-04-2012 at 09:41 AM..
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Old 04-05-2012, 01:30 PM
 
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I just visited the Midwest for the first time and imo, the Midwest consists of everywhere from Fort Collins, CO to Buffalo, NY and from the northernmost extent of the Southern dialect to the Canadian border.
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Old 04-06-2012, 12:49 PM
 
Location: Jefferson City 4 days a week, St. Louis 3 days a week
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tothesky View Post
I just visited the Midwest for the first time and imo, the Midwest consists of everywhere from Fort Collins, CO to Buffalo, NY and from the northernmost extent of the Southern dialect to the Canadian border.
Then by your definition, this map ought to reflect the southern borders of the Midwest.

http://www.ling.upenn.edu/phono_atla...p/NatMap1.html

All of the cities below the southernmost green line (southern boundary of South Midland region) are the extent of southern dialect...although Oklahoma I think the line is at least 100 miles too far to the south...OKC is definitely the south. I'd say the latitude of where the Texas and Oklahoma panhandles border each other is the northernmost extent of southern dialect in Oklahoma.
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Old 04-06-2012, 07:44 PM
 
Location: IN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stlouisan View Post
Then by your definition, this map ought to reflect the southern borders of the Midwest.

http://www.ling.upenn.edu/phono_atla...p/NatMap1.html

All of the cities below the southernmost green line (southern boundary of South Midland region) are the extent of southern dialect...although Oklahoma I think the line is at least 100 miles too far to the south...OKC is definitely the south. I'd say the latitude of where the Texas and Oklahoma panhandles border each other is the northernmost extent of southern dialect in Oklahoma.
What about outliers like Henry and St. Clair counties in MO? They have a fairly strong southern dialect.
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Old 04-06-2012, 08:01 PM
 
Location: plano
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lake County IN View Post
I think it's pretty easy.

The Midwest crowds around the Great Lakes above the former "slave states" of the South, west of the Northeastern states and east of the Rocky Mountain states.

That's pretty much how the USCB defines it

I think mostly the confusion comes from the fact that they don't know how to find the Rocky Mountain states and want to include those, but pretty much those are "frontier" states that have nothing in common with Detroit, Chicago, Omaha, Minneapolis, etc or even our Breadbasket states.

I just consider those "The West" along with California, Oregon, etc. . .

They were the last frontier of the U.S.'s Manifest Destiny crusade of the North American continent and have a certain culture that is different than the eastern, western, and midwestern states.
Interesting post, what do you consider frontier states? For those who claim Tx is southern, they need to get to know west texas including big bend country. Definately out west in Tx is what I consider to be frontier states.
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Old 04-06-2012, 08:28 PM
 
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The great plains are a definite region as are the great lakes.

The great plains tend to be drier, robust economies and tend to be less populated but have higher growth rates. The cities have higher growth rates for the most part and the rural areas decline more, but the overall population of these states have a bit higher rate of growth. The great plains have a very diverse terrain but tend to be more savannah or semi-arid. The drier climate becomes more noticeable as you go west of Illinois and even more prominent as you drive through these states (Nebraska, Dakotas, Kansas, Oklahoma maybe Texas). There are periods where they can be humid, but the dry, southwestern arid air reaches these regions much more often which results in more sun and drier air overall (States were rated with number of sunny days and Lincoln - in the easternmost portion of the state - was used which placed Nebraska as #15 sunniest state. Versus Ohio which was in the top 5 most cloudy). Hence the lack of trees.

These states have some cities that are growing nicely like OKC, Tulsa, KC, Omaha-Lincoln, Sioux Falls, and Fargo (Dallas, Denver and Austin if you believe in including all of the GP lands). I group nearby cities like Des Moines IA, Ames IA, Columnbia MO, Joplin Mo, Fayetteville in these group of states as they have much more in common with the GP areas than the GL areas.
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Old 04-06-2012, 10:28 PM
 
Location: Jefferson City 4 days a week, St. Louis 3 days a week
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GraniteStater View Post
What about outliers like Henry and St. Clair counties in MO? They have a fairly strong southern dialect.
henry county from my experience is not dominated by southern accents..and linguistic studies agree. you may be individually biased.the southern accent it's not the dominant accent in most of missouri.
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Old 04-06-2012, 10:36 PM
 
Location: Jefferson City 4 days a week, St. Louis 3 days a week
2,709 posts, read 4,231,628 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stlouisan View Post
henry county from my experience is not dominated by southern accents..and linguistic studies agree. you may be individually biased.the southern accent it's not the dominant accent in most of missouri.
st. clair county has a similar story.
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Old 04-06-2012, 10:42 PM
 
Location: Jefferson City 4 days a week, St. Louis 3 days a week
2,709 posts, read 4,231,628 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Omahahonors View Post
The great plains are a definite region as are the great lakes.

The great plains tend to be drier, robust economies and tend to be less populated but have higher growth rates. The cities have higher growth rates for the most part and the rural areas decline more, but the overall population of these states have a bit higher rate of growth. The great plains have a very diverse terrain but tend to be more savannah or semi-arid. The drier climate becomes more noticeable as you go west of Illinois and even more prominent as you drive through these states (Nebraska, Dakotas, Kansas, Oklahoma maybe Texas). There are periods where they can be humid, but the dry, southwestern arid air reaches these regions much more often which results in more sun and drier air overall (States were rated with number of sunny days and Lincoln - in the easternmost portion of the state - was used which placed Nebraska as #15 sunniest state. Versus Ohio which was in the top 5 most cloudy). Hence the lack of trees.

These states have some cities that are growing nicely like OKC, Tulsa, KC, Omaha-Lincoln, Sioux Falls, and Fargo (Dallas, Denver and Austin if you believe in including all of the GP lands). I group nearby cities like Des Moines IA, Ames IA, Columnbia MO, Joplin Mo, Fayetteville in these group of states as they have much more in common with the GP areas than the GL areas.
I group oklahoma and texas apart from the central and northern plains. they arent midwestern. I also think that missouri iowa and minnesota have more in common with the easter n
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