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View Poll Results: Best Cities in the Midwest for Living
Akron, OH 6 3.53%
Chicago, IL 57 33.53%
Cincinnati, OH 21 12.35%
Cleveland, OH 24 14.12%
Columbus, OH 22 12.94%
Des Moines, IA 26 15.29%
Detroit, MI 16 9.41%
Fort Wayne, IN 5 2.94%
Grand Rapids, MI 14 8.24%
Indianapolis, IN 23 13.53%
Kansas City, KS-MO 23 13.53%
Lincoln, NE 12 7.06%
Madison, WI 36 21.18%
Milwaukee, WI 24 14.12%
Minneapolis, MN 62 36.47%
Omaha, NE 22 12.94%
St. Louis, MO 34 20.00%
St. Paul, MN 24 14.12%
Toledo, OH 8 4.71%
Wichita, KS 7 4.12%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 170. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-22-2012, 08:38 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,663 posts, read 74,212,583 times
Reputation: 36087

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Quote:
Originally Posted by GraniteStater View Post
I've never been there and thought you were referring to a Cambridge in a different state. The point remains that plenty of small towns near Madison offer reasonable housing prices relative to the median household income that remains well above the state average. That is why Madison remains one of the best small metros in the Midwest.
You keep rejecting all that Ive said as being "moot" and then come back to use the same argument, which continues to show that there is a high ratio of housing costs to income in both Madison City and Dane County.

In fact it's hard to find a city anywhere that has a more unfavorable housing/income ratio than Madison's 4.48. Oshkosh 3.07, LaCrosse 3.45, Rockford IL 3.06, Davenport IA 2.85, Grand Rapids MI 3.16. All of which, by they way, have cheaper outlying towns, where the ratios would be even lower. With respect to the cost of living against income, Madison is one of the WORST places to live.

Last edited by jtur88; 10-22-2012 at 08:59 AM..
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Old 10-22-2012, 12:21 PM
 
Location: Bel Air, California
21,319 posts, read 21,867,229 times
Reputation: 33476
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
...I grew up 50 miles from Madison....
this now explains a great deal of things
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Old 10-22-2012, 02:11 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,663 posts, read 74,212,583 times
Reputation: 36087
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghengis View Post
this now explains a great deal of things
Would you like to say what some of those things are?
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Old 10-22-2012, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis (St. Louis Park)
5,991 posts, read 8,310,239 times
Reputation: 4270
I'll take jtur88's side on this fact: 50 miles outside of Madison does certainly suck (unless you're in the Dells, which is about 50 miles outside of Madison -- Baraboo, I think).
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Old 10-22-2012, 05:47 PM
 
Location: M I N N E S O T A
14,800 posts, read 17,703,198 times
Reputation: 9029
Quote:
Originally Posted by Min-Chi-Cbus View Post
I'll take jtur88's side on this fact: 50 miles outside of Madison does certainly suck (unless you're in the Dells, which is about 50 miles outside of Madison -- Baraboo, I think).
So it does suck or it doesn't suck?
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Old 10-22-2012, 09:35 PM
 
Location: IN
20,845 posts, read 35,927,262 times
Reputation: 13282
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
You keep rejecting all that Ive said as being "moot" and then come back to use the same argument, which continues to show that there is a high ratio of housing costs to income in both Madison City and Dane County.

In fact it's hard to find a city anywhere that has a more unfavorable housing/income ratio than Madison's 4.48. Oshkosh 3.07, LaCrosse 3.45, Rockford IL 3.06, Davenport IA 2.85, Grand Rapids MI 3.16. All of which, by they way, have cheaper outlying towns, where the ratios would be even lower. With respect to the cost of living against income, Madison is one of the WORST places to live.
I wasn't inherently disagreeing that Madison proper has higher housing costs, but still has an overall cost of living that is lower than its higher end competitors. Madison attracts highly educated human capital from across the country and has a strong technology, research, and healthcare sectors. Madison does not have very many commonalities with much of the Midwest because it outperforms in educational attainment and median household income in a significant way. It also outperforms every small metro in the Midwest for new job growth in the last 10 years. You are ignoring that key fact. Madison can lower that ratio by enacting policies to increase housing supply and new development as well as redevelopment. Until then, many towns very close to Madison offer very reasonable housing prices. Madison is NOT competing with the South in a cost of living contest. If people want cheap housing and cheap housing alone they will move to those places. The fact of the matter is that cheap housing is not the ONLY reason that people seek out.

"Oshkosh 3.07, LaCrosse 3.45, Rockford IL 3.06, Davenport IA 2.85, Grand Rapids MI 3.16."

All of those cities with the exception of Oshkosh has seen job declines over the past 10 years. It would make sense that their housing/income ratios are lower because the overall demand for housing in general is lower. Madison has NOTHING in common with those cities at all. Few small metros are comparable to Madison and that is the whole point.
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Old 10-23-2012, 03:08 AM
 
1,911 posts, read 3,239,033 times
Reputation: 910
More appropriate titles for this poll would be:

The Snooze Poll

Battle of the Most Boring Cities in the USA

Best of Boredom 2012
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Old 10-23-2012, 07:47 AM
 
Location: Silver Springs, FL
23,440 posts, read 31,707,623 times
Reputation: 15560
Quote:
Originally Posted by RonnieJonez View Post
More appropriate titles for this poll would be:

The Snooze Poll

Battle of the Most Boring Cities in the USA

Best of Boredom 2012
Because you've lived in all the cities listed, right?
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Old 10-23-2012, 08:18 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,663 posts, read 74,212,583 times
Reputation: 36087
Quote:
Originally Posted by GraniteStater View Post
I wasn't inherently disagreeing that Madison proper has higher housing costs, but still has an overall cost of living that is lower than its higher end competitors. Madison attracts highly educated human capital from across the country and has a strong technology, research, and healthcare sectors. Madison does not have very many commonalities with much of the Midwest because it outperforms in educational attainment and median household income in a significant way. It also outperforms every small metro in the Midwest for new job growth in the last 10 years. You are ignoring that key fact. Madison can lower that ratio by enacting policies to increase housing supply and new development as well as redevelopment. Until then, many towns very close to Madison offer very reasonable housing prices. Madison is NOT competing with the South in a cost of living contest. If people want cheap housing and cheap housing alone they will move to those places. The fact of the matter is that cheap housing is not the ONLY reason that people seek out.

"Oshkosh 3.07, LaCrosse 3.45, Rockford IL 3.06, Davenport IA 2.85, Grand Rapids MI 3.16."

All of those cities with the exception of Oshkosh has seen job declines over the past 10 years. It would make sense that their housing/income ratios are lower because the overall demand for housing in general is lower. Madison has NOTHING in common with those cities at all. Few small metros are comparable to Madison and that is the whole point.
None of what you say makes Madison a good place to live, unless you yourself are "high end", and if you're high end, everyplace is good.

Almost every city is "lower than its high-end competitors".

Get back to us when Madison DOES enact those policies, and we can reconsider whether it is a good place to live. Give me an example of a town that has "reasonable housing prices" that is close enough to Madison to benefit from Madison's gracious superiority.

Don't get me wrong. Madison is probably a perfectly fine place to live if you're a professional who can afford a $220K house, and so is Peoria and Akron. But if I were a single mom with an old Dodge Neon working in a nursing home, I wouldn't want to be dumped off in Madison to fend for myself.

The bottom line to this OP, if I were a mid-range wage-earner with a typical family, I think my first choice in the Midwest with 200K-pop, would be Sioux Falls, South Dakota. Almost exactly the same population and crime rate as Madison, with housing/earnings ratio of 3.36. And no sales tax.

Last edited by jtur88; 10-23-2012 at 08:56 AM..
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Old 10-23-2012, 09:55 AM
 
6,127 posts, read 6,442,655 times
Reputation: 6543
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
None of what you say makes Madison a good place to live, unless you yourself are "high end", and if you're high end, everyplace is good.

Almost every city is "lower than its high-end competitors".

Get back to us when Madison DOES enact those policies, and we can reconsider whether it is a good place to live. Give me an example of a town that has "reasonable housing prices" that is close enough to Madison to benefit from Madison's gracious superiority.

Don't get me wrong. Madison is probably a perfectly fine place to live if you're a professional who can afford a $220K house, and so is Peoria and Akron. But if I were a single mom with an old Dodge Neon working in a nursing home, I wouldn't want to be dumped off in Madison to fend for myself.

The bottom line to this OP, if I were a mid-range wage-earner with a typical family, I think my first choice in the Midwest with 200K-pop, would be Sioux Falls, South Dakota. Almost exactly the same population and crime rate as Madison, with housing/earnings ratio of 3.36. And no sales tax.
South Dakota has sales tax, but no income tax.
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