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Old 03-21-2012, 05:51 PM
 
3,644 posts, read 8,996,337 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stlouisan View Post
Right...so the map I provided, plus the lingustics map, proves that I make things up that don't exist. Thanks for you insight, I'll try to be less accurate from now on.
The part about things that dont exist wasn't directed at you. I was simply saying, while I love St. Louis and I like finding things in common, I dont make up similarities that dont exist.
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Old 03-21-2012, 05:54 PM
 
Location: Jefferson City 4 days a week, St. Louis 3 days a week
2,709 posts, read 4,225,932 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smtchll View Post
The dialect maps shows that Ste Genevieve is in a similar position as Northern OK, towards the bottom of the Midland dialect, not far from the Southern dialect. Half my family is from Northern OK and they definitely have a Southern accent, more Southern than mine, but on the maps, they're in the Midland area. So it's not out of the question that some places in Missouri that fall into the Midland areas on the map might have some people that sound Southern. That being said, I dont think the guy in the video sounds very Southern, every now and then, yes. But the guy in the Hannibal video sounds more Southern than the Ste Genevieve guy.
I don't think either of them sound very southern to me...it's a typical south midland accent...a few southern influences, but not enough where you could call it southern...if for example, he pronounced his i's like "ah", lenghthened his o's and u's, u sound like "yewww", and said "y'all" all in one setting, I might agree...but if he only does one of these, it's not enough to call it southern and classify the place as such..that's the minimum criteria I typically have for a southern accent...having most or all of those features..in most of Missouri, you're not going to get those ingredients...the only place in Missouri where there is a true, no questions asked southern dialect, or at least where it is even close to dominant, is in the far southern parts of the state...linguistics maps, plus the testimony of all the Missourians who have posted in this thread, continuously enforces that, yet people still think they know better. Just mind-boggling, and to be honest, more than I'm interested in dealing with...if hard studies, combined with testimony from people of the state who know the south well, doesn't work, then it's a waste of my time even to make another post on this topic.

Last edited by stlouisan; 03-21-2012 at 06:04 PM..
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Old 03-21-2012, 06:02 PM
 
Location: Jefferson City 4 days a week, St. Louis 3 days a week
2,709 posts, read 4,225,932 times
Reputation: 998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smtchll View Post
The part about things that dont exist wasn't directed at you. I was simply saying, while I love St. Louis and I like finding things in common, I dont make up similarities that dont exist.
Well I don't make up differences that don't exist either...I never deliberately make things up to get a point across on here. I don't waste my time making things up on here...there's no honor in it, and I'm not interested in misleading people. I didn't expect you would react in the harsh manner you did, so I will choose my words more carefully.
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Old 03-21-2012, 07:32 PM
 
29,873 posts, read 27,324,185 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stlouisan View Post
The son and dad have a slight southern influence to their accents, but nobody in their right mind would mistaken either of them to be southerners.
It wouldn't exactly be outrageous for someone to assume they were Southern based on their accents. Not every Southerner has a thick drawl.
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Old 03-21-2012, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Jefferson City 4 days a week, St. Louis 3 days a week
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
It wouldn't exactly be outrageous for someone to assume they were Southern based on their accents. Not every Southerner has a thick drawl.
I guess every person hears it differently, and yes, obviously I will admit even my instinct is to assume someone is southern if i hear an accent that sounds like it...but assuming an accent is southern based solely on what your ears tell you is not a foolproof method...I know because it's happened to me. I once heard a guy who I thought was from Boston, not 100% but was leaning toward it...turned out he was from Virginia and was speaking Tidewater. And some people just have funny accents that don't obey the regions they're in. And the other thing is, some people just talk funny in general, has nothing to do with where they are from. The places where these accents are happening in though are not culturally southern, and far too north to be classified as the south. Sainte Genevieve and Hannibal are not culturally southern by a modern standpoint. And in any case, southern accents are out of the norm in both these areas. That's why these places are not the south...and in my opinion, they aren't southern accents. people seem to be of the idea that you can't have a midland accent with southern overtones, or a southern accent with some midland overtones.

And it is generally true that most places in the rural south even as far north as Kentucky and Virginia have fairly thick and unmistakable southern speech patterns that you just won't hear to the same degree in most of Missouri, Kansas, Illinois, and the rest of the Lower Midwest.
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Old 03-21-2012, 08:42 PM
 
Location: West Tennessee
2,081 posts, read 2,897,290 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
It wouldn't exactly be outrageous for someone to assume they were Southern based on their accents. Not every Southerner has a thick drawl.
Like I said, if I would have heard someone talk like the teenager did I would assume he is without a doubt from the St. Louis area. I didn't hear any evidence of a southern accent at all. I grew up about 60 miles south of Ste. Genevieve in an area with 3 or 4 different dialects, and that dialect he spoke was one of them. Most people that speak it in the area are people of German and/or French ancestry, and is without a doubt a Midwestern accent. Lower Midwestern? Yes, but still a Midwestern Accent.
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Old 03-21-2012, 08:45 PM
 
Location: Jefferson City 4 days a week, St. Louis 3 days a week
2,709 posts, read 4,225,932 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GunnerTHB View Post
Like I said, if I would have heard someone talk like the teenager did I would assume he is without a doubt from the St. Louis area. I didn't hear any evidence of a southern accent at all. I grew up about 60 miles south of Ste. Genevieve in an area with 3 or 4 different dialects, and that dialect he spoke was one of them. Most people that speak it in the area are people of German and/or French ancestry, and is without a doubt a Midwestern accent. Lower Midwestern? Yes, but still a Midwestern Accent.
well put sir
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Old 03-21-2012, 10:30 PM
 
3,644 posts, read 8,996,337 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stlouisan View Post
I don't think either of them sound very southern to me...it's a typical south midland accent...a few southern influences, but not enough where you could call it southern...if for example, he pronounced his i's like "ah", lenghthened his o's and u's, u sound like "yewww", and said "y'all" all in one setting, I might agree...but if he only does one of these, it's not enough to call it southern and classify the place as such..that's the minimum criteria I typically have for a southern accent...having most or all of those features..in most of Missouri, you're not going to get those ingredients...the only place in Missouri where there is a true, no questions asked southern dialect, or at least where it is even close to dominant, is in the far southern parts of the state...linguistics maps, plus the testimony of all the Missourians who have posted in this thread, continuously enforces that, yet people still think they know better. Just mind-boggling, and to be honest, more than I'm interested in dealing with...if hard studies, combined with testimony from people of the state who know the south well, doesn't work, then it's a waste of my time even to make another post on this topic.
I relistened and he still sounds Southern. I cant point out specific things because I'm not good at talking linguistics, but almost everything he said sounded Southern. The overall sound is Southern. I dont think that just because we're posters from the South and not MO means that we dont have credibility. We have ears too and we also have daily exposure to Southern accents. When someone posts a video and Southern posters think the person sounds Southern, it doesn't mean that they think the whole region sounds Southern, just the person in the video. The guy in the Hannibal video might have parents from the South. His accent is different from everyone else in the video

And for those that don't know, I'm talking about a video from earlier in the thread, not the more recent one from Ste Genevieve
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Old 03-22-2012, 04:49 AM
 
Location: Silver Springs, FL
23,440 posts, read 31,707,623 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
It wouldn't exactly be outrageous for someone to assume they were Southern based on their accents. Not every Southerner has a thick drawl.
If you think the folks in the Eckenfels farm video are southern, then I have some very cheap land I would love to sell you here in Florida.
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Old 03-22-2012, 04:53 AM
 
Location: Silver Springs, FL
23,440 posts, read 31,707,623 times
Reputation: 15560
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smtchll View Post
I relistened and he still sounds Southern. I cant point out specific things because I'm not good at talking linguistics, but almost everything he said sounded Southern. The overall sound is Southern. I dont think that just because we're posters from the South and not MO means that we dont have credibility. We have ears too and we also have daily exposure to Southern accents. When someone posts a video and Southern posters think the person sounds Southern, it doesn't mean that they think the whole region sounds Southern, just the person in the video. The guy in the Hannibal video might have parents from the South. His accent is different from everyone else in the video

And for those that don't know, I'm talking about a video from earlier in the thread, not the more recent one from Ste Genevieve
Thanks for being specific about which vid you are speaking of, I think thats where some of the confusion is coming from.
Be specific, folks!
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