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Old 04-02-2012, 05:26 PM
 
779 posts, read 1,413,681 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stumbler. View Post
Thing is, I bet a lot of Americans whose ancestry have been Americans for generations might still not be willing to fight in an actual war. Support, yes. But actually take part to fight, as in put in a life on the line means a lot of people would say no...
exactly. a majority of americans (even those whose familes have been here for generations) would not want to risk their lives in a war.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Razorblade View Post

Honestly I wouldn't even consider your children as American as me. It's really kinda offensive to insinuate that someone who has a generation or two of American heritage is as American as someone who has a 500 hundred or 5,000 years worth of American heritage. America is not your homeland, or your children's it's my homeland.
Honestly, what you're saying is offensive. Who are you to decide that a 2nd or 3rd generation American is less American than you are? There are plenty of 2nd/3rd generation Americans risking their lives daily in our military and serving as our policemen and firemen. There are plenty of 1st/2nd/3rd generation Americans building our countries as engineers, healing our sick as doctors, taking care of our children in schools/nurseries, and paying large amounts in taxes to support long-time Americans who are not working.
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Old 04-02-2012, 06:03 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia,New Jersey, NYC!
6,967 posts, read 18,226,173 times
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the second you sip iced tea?
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Old 04-02-2012, 06:09 PM
 
Location: Crowntown
210 posts, read 214,616 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 55degrees View Post
exactly. a majority of americans (even those whose familes have been here for generations) would not want to risk their lives in a war.




Honestly, what you're saying is offensive. Who are you to decide that a 2nd or 3rd generation American is less American than you are? There are plenty of 2nd/3rd generation Americans risking their lives daily in our military and serving as our policemen and firemen. There are plenty of 1st/2nd/3rd generation Americans building our countries as engineers, healing our sick as doctors, taking care of our children in schools/nurseries, and paying large amounts in taxes to support long-time Americans who are not working.
I never said I'm looking down on them or think they deserve less of the pie than me or I have less respect for them but they ARE less American than me. My ancestors were risking there lives daily when they boarded THE MAYFLOWER. My ancestors were here and celebrated Thanksgiving when it was first INVENTED. My grandmother met Dr. Martin Luthor King, My Great Uncle campaigned for JFK, my cousins stepfather is a direct descendant of GEORGE WASHINGTON. My family was directly involved, influenced, or affected by every single major event you read about in American History books from the first page to the last. It is offensive to say the son or grandson of an immigrant is as American as me.

Last edited by Razorblade; 04-02-2012 at 06:20 PM..
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Old 04-02-2012, 07:29 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
10,827 posts, read 9,454,548 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maast View Post
This question can be quite controversial, but it's interesting to discuss. When does a person become an American in your eyes? Is it upon getting citizenship, is it upon being well assimilated culturally, is it upon sharing certain views?

What do you feel about dual identities 'e.g Italian-American'? and does that make you less of an 'American'?

Reason this is an interesting question to me is my own case. Though not born here, I grew up in the US in an insular ethnic community. My family didn't interact with Americans very much and by extension me as well. We had our friends from our ethnicity/country that we always interacted with. In a typical week I spoke more of my heritage language than English. I spent several months of the year in my heritage country as all my relatives are there and in a way grew up there in the summers. As a result, I developed a strong sense of identity connected to my heritage. This is the group of people/culture I connect the most with. I am also a dedicated patriot to my heritage country and would fight for it over any other country including US. I also identify myself here and in other countries as just my ethnicity.

There are many people with the case I have and others in a more grey area. What would you say for me case and what would you say in general in terms of this American identity. In Europe, for example, the conception of identity is different as they are not really immigrant countries like of the US.
I'm 17th generational American, so about as American as you can get.

IMHO I think it takes around 4-5 generations to really become an American. So your great grandson will be getting close...

Last edited by cBach; 04-02-2012 at 07:38 PM..
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Old 04-02-2012, 07:39 PM
 
Location: NJ
12,284 posts, read 31,791,580 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razorblade View Post
I never said I'm looking down on them or think they deserve less of the pie than me or I have less respect for them but they ARE less American than me. My ancestors were risking there lives daily when they boarded THE MAYFLOWER. My ancestors were here and celebrated Thanksgiving when it was first INVENTED. My grandmother met Dr. Martin Luthor King, My Great Uncle campaigned for JFK, my cousins stepfather is a direct descendant of GEORGE WASHINGTON. My family was directly involved, influenced, or affected by every single major event you read about in American History books from the first page to the last. It is offensive to say the son or grandson of an immigrant is as American as me.
what's scary is I think you are deadly serious.

what have *YOU* done to influence this nation and its future history?

excuse me for LMAO at the bolded as this somehow makes you more American than I.
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Old 04-02-2012, 07:56 PM
 
Location: Crowntown
210 posts, read 214,616 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tahiti View Post
what's scary is I think you are deadly serious.

what have *YOU* done to influence this nation and its future history?

excuse me for LMAO at the bolded as this somehow makes you more American than I.
Because I have family members that descend from men that FOUNDED the United States of America. I descend from Europeans that DISCOVERED America, and I also descend from Native Americans that have lived here as long as human beings have walked this earth. If anyone still alive who you are a direct relative to is an immigrant is should be plainly obvious why I'm more American than you.

I'm not gonna move to your homeland an raise my children and there children there and than claim my grandchildren are just as (country name in here) as you. That would be very disrespectful.

Truthfully I consider Mexican immigrants more American than a European immigrant ever could be. If your a Mexican American you get a pass an I consider you as American as me. If your from overseas forget about it, you will never be as American as me. In 500 years if your family doesn't jump ship and your great times 10 grandchildren have stories that have been passed down from you about what it was like in America when 9/11 happened and when the recession hit they will be as American as me, but you, unless you come from a lineage like me, forget about it. This is my heritage, this is much bigger than me.
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Old 04-02-2012, 07:56 PM
 
779 posts, read 1,413,681 times
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exactly, Tahiti
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Old 04-02-2012, 08:45 PM
 
456 posts, read 664,735 times
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Seems people have rather differing opinions here lol

When I was in France for example, the few fellow people of my ethnicity that I met, it was like meeting an old friend, we even went out and ate together, even though we barely knew each other, we were just of the same ethnicity. When I saw Americans there it was like seeing any other foreigner, no reaction or feelings of warmth. I also eagerly visited my ethnic group's church there and a few sites related to my heritage.
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Old 04-03-2012, 06:15 AM
 
Location: the dairyland
1,195 posts, read 1,928,915 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razorblade View Post
I never said I'm looking down on them or think they deserve less of the pie than me or I have less respect for them but they ARE less American than me. My ancestors were risking there lives daily when they boarded THE MAYFLOWER. My ancestors were here and celebrated Thanksgiving when it was first INVENTED. My grandmother met Dr. Martin Luthor King, My Great Uncle campaigned for JFK, my cousins stepfather is a direct descendant of GEORGE WASHINGTON. My family was directly involved, influenced, or affected by every single major event you read about in American History books from the first page to the last. It is offensive to say the son or grandson of an immigrant is as American as me.
Except for the Mayflower stuff most of those things could have been done by the ancestors of 2nd or 3th generation Americans as well since they all happened in the 20th century. I don't see how being a decendant of George Washington (and actually it was your cousin's stepfather, so you are not even related to him) or having celebrated Thanksgiving when it was first invented (how do you know they did that?) is a personal achievement.

People who are decendants of the Mayflower crew are a minority in the United States and, in fact, the American everyday culture has been much more influenced by the immigrants that came much later and did not originate in the UK. Most important figures in American history can't trace their ancestry back to the Mayflower. So, doesn't that actually mean that you, as a Mayflower decendant, are less American?

You can't just always look at the past only, if you go back far enough we are all Africans anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Razorblade View Post
I'm not gonna move to your homeland an raise my children and there children there and than claim my grandchildren are just as (country name in here) as you. That would be very disrespectful.
It wouldn't be disrespectful. Why would it? As long as your grand children are integrated and assimilated into that country most people would consider them a German/American/Canadian/French/whatever. Even more so in a country that emphasizes its history as a country of immigrants such as the US.

Last edited by Rob702; 04-03-2012 at 06:28 AM..
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Old 04-03-2012, 06:24 AM
 
Location: Boston, MA
11,763 posts, read 8,323,248 times
Reputation: 5813
Quote:
Originally Posted by Visvaldis View Post
One becomes an American by accepting Jesus, joining the NRA and the 700 Club, and always voting for the most conservative Republicans. Everyone who doesn't do this is not an American.
Wow! that was a great answer.
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