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The urban core of Louisville has not been on a continual decline on the same scale as other places. Old Louisville, The Highlands; these among others are nice areas comfortably in Louisville's old city limits.
I mean decline in the sense of decades-long population decline. My brother and his wife are moving to Louisville soon, and I'm aware there are some stable and even gentrifying areas.
Edit: Ultimately, there are two things which seem to characterize most rust-belt cities, which is why most have been in continual population decline since the 1970s (except for those, like Boston and NYC, which have transformed).
1. Core zone highly built up, and state incorporation rules (or local conditions) meant they were surrounded by incorporated suburbs they could not annex.
2. Very little immigration, particularly from Latin America and Asia, compared to the rest of the U.S. Although many have a Hispanic neighborhood or two, for the most part they remain "white and black" cities.
I mean decline in the sense of decades-long population decline. My brother and his wife are moving to Louisville soon, and I'm aware there are some stable and even gentrifying areas.
Edit: Ultimately, there are two things which seem to characterize most rust-belt cities, which is why most have been in continual population decline since the 1970s (except for those, like Boston and NYC, which have transformed).
1. Core zone highly built up, and state incorporation rules (or local conditions) meant they were surrounded by incorporated suburbs they could not annex.
2. Very little immigration, particularly from Latin America and Asia, compared to the rest of the U.S. Although many have a Hispanic neighborhood or two, for the most part they remain "white and black" cities.
Good point about number one and people forget about that. Number 2 is pretty true outside of maybe some cities. I believe that some smaller Rust Belt cities like Lorain OH, Dunkirk and Amsterdam NY, Saginaw MI and in NW Indiana have pretty high Hispanic percentages. Rochester NY is a respectable 16-17% Hispanic. I think Syracuse at around 6% Asian, has one of the highest percentages of Asians for a Rust Belt city center.
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We can rave away in our little mental cells all that you want. The Sunbelt cities are still gaining population, the Rustbelt cities are losing it. The list of reasons are too long to list here.
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Originally Posted by eschaton
I see Louisville as similar to Indianapolis and Columbus. All of them are essentially "lower midwestern" cities. However, because the former two have city-county mergers, and the latter has annexed a ton of unincorporated suburban land, they function more similarly to sun-belt cities than rust-belt cities, where the "urban" predominates.
The core of these cities has still experienced continued decline, but this is masked by the amount of suburbs within the city limits, leading the cities as a whole to seem like greater success stories than they are.
Of course, the traditional urban cores of a lot of southern cities faced the same issues, until gentrification began changing those as well. The point is many of the differences has to do with how easy it is to annex runaway suburbs.
Louisville is culturally a Southern city, and is not a rust belt city in the sense that heavy manufacturing was not nearly as prominent there, and that it also experienced the boom in population and regrowth as the Sun Belt. It may not be in the Sunbelt per se, but it has more characteristics from a modern standpoint resembling those cities. Its buildings are new, its economy is booming, and its population has been growing for a long time.
We can rave away in our little mental cells all that you want. The Sunbelt cities are still gaining population, the Rustbelt cities are losing it. The list of reasons are too long to list here.
Yes, but many are just going to the suburbs in Rust Belt metros and the lack of annexation should be considered. For instance, Syracuse hasn't annexed anything since the late 1920's-early 1930's. This also doesn't get into the urban renewal affect on these cities too.
Yes, but many are just going to the suburbs in Rust Belt metros and the lack of annexation should be considered. For instance, Syracuse hasn't annexed anything since the late 1920's-early 1930's. This also doesn't get into the urban renewal affect on these cities too.
Exactly. This is apples to oranges and more complex then just a simple "this place is still losing population and this one is still gaining" type of situation.
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Originally Posted by ckhthankgod
Yes, but many are just going to the suburbs in Rust Belt metros and the lack of annexation should be considered. For instance, Syracuse hasn't annexed anything since the late 1920's-early 1930's. This also doesn't get into the urban renewal affect on these cities too.
Im afraid youre missing the point. The migration from Rust Belt to Sun Belt is much larger in scope than that.
Feel free to compare the pros and cons of living in places like Detroit, Pittsburgh, Milwaukee, Cleveland, St. Louis, Chicago, and Cincinnati to living in places like Nashville, Louisville, Richmond, Charlotte, Miami, Houston, Atlanta, New Orleans, Dallas, etc.
Specifically, discuss what the advantages of living in the Rust Belt are over living in the Sun Belt. Statistics to support your views would greatly be appreciated.
Preface - grew up in Lima, Ohio (a city of about 40,000 on I-75, classic rust belt town / city) about an hour south of Toledo.
Spent 18 years in Lima, 4.5 living in Toledo (another classic rust belt city) and then moved home for another year back to Lima. Have lived in Greenville, South Carolina for 8 years now.
Pro's of the rust belt - geographically you know where you're going. Northwest Ohio is nothing but a giant grid pattern so there is absolutely no way you can get lost unless you try and even then it's tough. School districts focused on one small town or one city as opposed to covering a several communities in most cases. Local control meant greater decision making for the community. Fall's in Ohio are absolutely gorgeous. My favorite time of year in Ohio has been and always will be the fall. Small towns are safe and great places to raise families in the midwest.
Con's of the rust belt - employment opportunities can make you a little depressed. chances for advancement once you get a job depending on the industry can be just as depressing. WINTER's can be brutal in NW Ohio where it's all flat land. School districts are losing money or are not being run efficiently some might say due to too many of them existing. Consolidate and move on already.
Pro's of the Sun Belt (I live in South Carolina) - tons of employment opportunity for me at least being in the education industry. I kind of enjoy living in a state that has a very mild winter weather wise. October and November down here are pretty good. Metro South can be a boooming place with all the young midwest and mid atlantic college grads moving down here probably due to the cons of the midwest haha. Way more chances at recreation down here. I'm big into hiking so with dozens of state hiking parks within a minutes time from me has been great.
Con's of the Sun Belt - poor urban and metro area planning. road systems in the south in general are very screwy to begin with. add in thousands of new transplants a year and it gets ridiculous. Housing costs are inflated. A nice middle class home down here can cost up to 250,000 while that same home back in my hometown would sell for half that at best. Poorly funded public services (as a teacher you know i'm talking about schools haha). small towns in the south are usually the most crime infested. usually the most dangerous cities in south carolina each year are the small ones as you get closer to the coast. i would NEVER raise a family in a small southern town. some are nice but the vast majority you're better off driving around or through really fast.
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