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Here's a fairly high-contrast 2012 election map by county. You can clearly see that while rural counties in MI, WI, MN, and most of Iowa are Democratic-leaning or fairly evenly split, in Missouri, southern Illinois, most of Indiana, and Southeast Ohio suburbs and rural areas are heavily Republican-voting. Minnesota and Wisconsin have unique political splits in the U.S., as they are the only places where the Republican base is almost exclusively the suburbs, with rural areas much more moderate, and often pretty liberal.
Note that some of this is recent realignment. Areas like the rural counties in Missouri/Illinois downriver from Saint Louis, and Southern Indiana, were ancestrally Democratic, but have recently become Republican (similar to the U.S. South as a whole). In contrast, the big blue patch in Eastern Iowa, Southeast Minnesota, and Southwest Wisconsin was ancestrally Republican not long ago - but then again, much of New England was not too many election cycles ago either.
Again, the same basic cycle recapitulates in the Northeast. Almost nowhere rural in New England is Republican - the last bases of the Republican party are in places like the exurbs of Boston in New Hampshire. In contrast, in Upstate New York, whiter parts of New Jersey, and especially Central (and increasingly Western) Pennsylvania, people vote Republican in large numbers in rural areas.
Location: Jefferson City 4 days a week, St. Louis 3 days a week
2,709 posts, read 5,092,866 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana
Mine in blue.
Being a professional linguist vs. someone who has had a life-long interest in linguistics is like a major league baseball player vs. a diehard fan. Not even close to a comparison. I will take the opinions of the University of Pennsylvania's study of linguistics over your's any day of the week. Talk about laughing out loud? When I hear somebody say that Kansas Citians speak with a Southern accent, it makes me want to do just that.
Location: Jefferson City 4 days a week, St. Louis 3 days a week
2,709 posts, read 5,092,866 times
Reputation: 1028
Quote:
Originally Posted by eschaton
Here's a fairly high-contrast 2012 election map by county. You can clearly see that while rural counties in MI, WI, MN, and most of Iowa are Democratic-leaning or fairly evenly split, in Missouri, southern Illinois, most of Indiana, and Southeast Ohio suburbs and rural areas are heavily Republican-voting. Minnesota and Wisconsin have unique political splits in the U.S., as they are the only places where the Republican base is almost exclusively the suburbs, with rural areas much more moderate, and often pretty liberal.
Note that some of this is recent realignment. Areas like the rural counties in Missouri/Illinois downriver Saint Louis, and Southern Indiana, were ancestrally Democratic, but have recently become Republican (similar to the U.S. South as a whole). In contrast, the big blue patch in Eastern Iowa, Southeast Minnesota, and Southwest Wisconsin was ancestrally Republican not long ago - but then again, much of New England was not too many election cycles ago either.
Again, the same basic cycle recapitulates in the Northeast. Almost nowhere rural in New England is Republican - the last bases of the Republican party are in places like the exurbs of Boston in New Hampshire. In contrast, in Upstate New York, whiter parts of New Jersey, and especially Central (and increasingly Western) Pennsylvania, people vote Republican in large numbers in rural areas.
St. Louis does not lean Republican. Furthermore, Indiana is just as Republican if not more Republican than Missouri. Indiana voted solidly red from 1964 to 2008, then back to Republican again in 2012. Ohio and Missouri are generally swing states. Illinois leans blue only because of Chicago.
Again, the same basic cycle recapitulates in the Northeast. Almost nowhere rural in New England is Republican - the last bases of the Republican party are in places like the exurbs of Boston in New Hampshire. In contrast, in Upstate New York, whiter parts of New Jersey, and especially Central (and increasingly Western) Pennsylvania, people vote Republican in large numbers in rural areas.
Agreed. And the north-south contrast is striking. Wisconsin, Michigan are less red than the non-Great Lakes portions of Illinois, Indiana and Ohio. Upstate NY doesn't have a particularly strong Republican lean, and less so than Pennsylvania. Some of the reddest parts of Central PA have very few people, skewing things.
Architecturally, this street could find in much of the north built in the early 20th century. Exceptions might be the mid-Atlantic (esp near Philly and Baltimore). The NYC metro tend to build denser housing stock in that era and in general a bit different style, but North Jersey has similar streets. New England, especially eastern New England is a bit different. Parts of the Midwest may tend to have a bigger setback.
Nor is Illinois the "lower" midwest, whatever that is.
Downstate is. Anyone whose lived in Illinois will tell you that people from Chicago, Springfield, or say Carbondale/Cairo will tell you there are deep political and cultural divisions between upstate and downstate - so much so that people downstate talk about seceding from time to time. They wouldn't, given Chicagoland actually transfers money downstate, but as you travel north to south, you pass from Interior North dialect areas in Chicagoland, through Midland accents in the center of the state, and finally areas with distinct southern twangs in the far southern portions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sayid Linus
PA isn't right wing and it isn't in the midwest either. GEEZ................
On the whole, it's not right wing. But rural central PA is more right wing than anywhere else in the Northeast, which sort of belies the whole "Northeast is liberal" as a definitive thing. PA votes Democratic because of Philadelphia, and would be an evenly-balanced (if not Republican-leaning) state without it. Michigan and Illinois both are generally more left-leaning than Illinois on a presidential level now, although PA's political balance is similar to Wisconsin, Minnesota, or Iowa. But unlike those states, it's not because there's a fairly significant white liberal population - it's because there's a fairly high number of minorities.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sayid Linus
Voting R doesn't equal right wing. Voting D doesn't equal liberal.
Correct historically, but now? Show me liberal Republican parts of the country.
St. Louis does not lean Republican. Furthermore, Indiana is just as Republican if not more Republican than Missouri. Indiana voted solidly red from 1964 to 2008, then back to Republican again in 2012. Ohio and Missouri are generally swing states. Illinois leans blue only because of Chicago.
When I spoke of a realignment, I meant in the counties just to the south of Saint Louis. In 2008, Obama won Jefferson, Washington, Iron, and Saint Genevieve counties, when he lost all in 2008. Gore actually won three of these counties in 2000 despite his popular vote win being much narrower than Obama's in 2008 (or 2012), and Clinton did great in the region (hell, he won almost everywhere outside of the Ozarks in Missouri). Missouri has been rapidly trending to the right (probably quicker than any state outside of Appalachia/the Upper South), and isn't really a swing state anymore - it doesn't vote Democratic on a national level outside of Saint Louis City/County, Kansas City, and Columbia.
Downstate is. Anyone whose lived in Illinois will tell you that people from Chicago, Springfield, or say Carbondale/Cairo will tell you there are deep political and cultural divisions between upstate and downstate - so much so that people downstate talk about seceding from time to time. They wouldn't, given Chicagoland actually transfers money downstate, but as you travel north to south, you pass from Interior North dialect areas in Chicagoland, through Midland accents in the center of the state, and finally areas with distinct southern twangs in the far southern portions.
On the whole, it's not right wing. But rural central PA is more right wing than anywhere else in the Northeast, which sort of belies the whole "Northeast is liberal" as a definitive thing. PA votes Democratic because of Philadelphia, and would be an evenly-balanced (if not Republican-leaning) state without it. Michigan and Illinois both are generally more left-leaning than Illinois on a presidential level now, although PA's political balance is similar to Wisconsin, Minnesota, or Iowa. But unlike those states, it's not because there's a fairly significant white liberal population - it's because there's a fairly high number of minorities.
Correct historically, but now? Show me liberal Republican parts of the country.
Yea, but PA isn't wihout Philadelphia or it's suburban counties. Or any one of the 1/3 of the counties that went Blue.
Just like OR isn't without Portland, WA without Seattle, CO without Denver, and on, and on, and on.
Agreed. And the north-south contrast is striking. Wisconsin, Michigan are less red than the non-Great Lakes portions of Illinois, Indiana and Ohio. Upstate NY doesn't have a particularly strong Republican lean, and less so than Pennsylvania. Some of the reddest parts of Central PA have very few people, skewing things.
The pattern was a bit muddled in 2012 because Obama blanketed Ohio with ads, and thus did far better in Central Ohio than a Democrat typically does. You can see this if you look at the NYT 2012 results map, and compare it to 2008. Obama either lost little or actually gained votes in a wide swath running from north of Columbus to the KY/WV border, despite doing notably worse in some culturally similar areas just across the Ohio. Proof that campaign ads do actually sway some votes I suppose.
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