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View Poll Results: Are Pittsburgh, Erie, and Buffalo Northeastern or Midwestern?
Northeastern 42 50.60%
Midwestern 10 12.05%
Mixed 31 37.35%
Voters: 83. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 04-12-2014, 04:15 PM
 
Location: Mahoning Valley, Ohio
416 posts, read 585,089 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by travel-a-lot View Post


Yeah I always feel that way too. Ohio just feels a lot more boring than Western PA even when you just cross the border...but Ohio feels better the further south you go but still pretty boring
Interesting. I feel depressed when I get into Western PA. I grew up in Columbiana County and there is clearly a difference between the two regions. Western PA is nothing like Eastern PA. NE Ohio feels more Northeastern than Western PA. Western PA is clearly Appalachian. I can walk out my door and be in PA in five minutes and only about five minutes across the border do things look and feel different. The two regions couldn't be anymore different.

Cleverfield, I see what you're saying. Here's one thing though: Cleveland and Pittsburgh are not at all similar, siblings, cousins, or whatever posters on here like to give names to for cities that have common characteristics. That's a good thing, though.

I don't want to hear about built environment as a reason for belonging to a certain region. Brick, Pittsburgh? St. Louis, you know that city in the middle of the country, it has a lot of brick too, I guess it's northeastern as well. Many of the towns around me have New England style architecture and park-style center greens. The mountains are clearly a dividing point between east coast and other areas, and NE Ohio itself feels more like Western NY or NW PA, but not Appalachian like Western PA. Get down towards southern Columbiana County and it starts to feel a little W PA and WV, but not that deep mountain Appalachian vibe.

I like responding to posts from people from right across the border who say something as fatuous as "Ohio just feels more boring.". Yet I see thousands of PA cars every month shopping and being entertained right across the border. So you are bored in Ohio and I am depressed in PA. Around and around we go. Keep making comments like that, it makes for an interesting debate.
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Old 04-12-2014, 05:05 PM
Status: "Deep and Dark December" (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
88,545 posts, read 104,871,472 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMahValley View Post
Interesting. I feel depressed when I get into Western PA. I grew up in Columbiana County and there is clearly a difference between the two regions. Western PA is nothing like Eastern PA. NE Ohio feels more Northeastern than Western PA. Western PA is clearly Appalachian. I can walk out my door and be in PA in five minutes and only about five minutes across the border do things look and feel different. The two regions couldn't be anymore different.

Cleverfield, I see what you're saying. Here's one thing though: Cleveland and Pittsburgh are not at all similar, siblings, cousins, or whatever posters on here like to give names to for cities that have common characteristics. That's a good thing, though.

I don't want to hear about built environment as a reason for belonging to a certain region. Brick, Pittsburgh? St. Louis, you know that city in the middle of the country, it has a lot of brick too, I guess it's northeastern as well. Many of the towns around me have New England style architecture and park-style center greens. The mountains are clearly a dividing point between east coast and other areas, and NE Ohio itself feels more like Western NY or NW PA, but not Appalachian like Western PA. Get down towards southern Columbiana County and it starts to feel a little W PA and WV, but not that deep mountain Appalachian vibe.

I like responding to posts from people from right across the border who say something as fatuous as "Ohio just feels more boring.". Yet I see thousands of PA cars every month shopping and being entertained right across the border. So you are bored in Ohio and I am depressed in PA. Around and around we go. Keep making comments like that, it makes for an interesting debate.
Please note I did not say boring I said different. There were things that we liked about Ohio. When I was a kid in Beaver County (shares a border with Columbiana Co, Ohio) you could buy fireworks in Ohio, but not PA. The drinking age for 3.2 beer was 18 in Ohio at the time I was a kid; "going to Ohio" was a popular activity among some high school kids (not me).
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Old 04-12-2014, 09:09 PM
 
Location: South Jersey
13,446 posts, read 7,312,651 times
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Yes, they are all Northeastern to me. From the perspective of many people here, they probably seem somewhat Midwestern, but really they are Northeastern.
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Old 04-13-2014, 08:08 AM
 
Location: Pittsburgh, PA (Morningside)
12,713 posts, read 12,482,706 times
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As I said upthread, the problem is that Northeast and Midwest are geographic, not cultural, descriptors. People want there to be cultural commonalities, because the South is both a geographic and a cultural region. But in the North that's not how it works. the Great Lakes region is more like New England, and the Lower Midwest is more like the Mid-Atlantic, culturally than either area is to the other.

There is no way you can describe the Northeast culturally unless you restrict it to the Northeast Corridor, which is really only shares a high level of urban/suburban development, and even implicitly excludes much of rural New England. And there's no way to discuss commonalities throughout the Midwest at all.
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Old 04-13-2014, 08:50 AM
Status: "Deep and Dark December" (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
88,545 posts, read 104,871,472 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eschaton View Post
As I said upthread, the problem is that Northeast and Midwest are geographic, not cultural, descriptors. People want there to be cultural commonalities, because the South is both a geographic and a cultural region. But in the North that's not how it works. the Great Lakes region is more like New England, and the Lower Midwest is more like the Mid-Atlantic, culturally than either area is to the other.

There is no way you can describe the Northeast culturally unless you restrict it to the Northeast Corridor, which is really only shares a high level of urban/suburban development, and even implicitly excludes much of rural New England. And there's no way to discuss commonalities throughout the Midwest at all.
Chicago and Milwaukee are not like New England. Heck, they're not even totally like each other!
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Old 04-13-2014, 09:26 AM
 
Location: Cleveland
3,198 posts, read 3,968,817 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eschaton View Post
As I said upthread, the problem is that Northeast and Midwest are geographic, not cultural, descriptors. People want there to be cultural commonalities, because the South is both a geographic and a cultural region. But in the North that's not how it works. the Great Lakes region is more like New England, and the Lower Midwest is more like the Mid-Atlantic, culturally than either area is to the other.

There is no way you can describe the Northeast culturally unless you restrict it to the Northeast Corridor, which is really only shares a high level of urban/suburban development, and even implicitly excludes much of rural New England. And there's no way to discuss commonalities throughout the Midwest at all.
I disagree, the Midwest and the East both have distinct feels in terms of architecture, attitudes, immigrant groups, and layout. To demonstrate this, take a trip from the East Side of Cleveland to the West Side. The East Side is part of the original Connecticut Western Reserve, and I posit is more Eastern, the West Side was not part of the Western Reserve until a few years later, was part of the "Firelands", and is more Midwestern. On the East Side, the attitudes are much more East Coast. You have a lot more Jews and Italians, lots of Catholics, fewer protestants. People are a little more in your face. On the West Side, it is generally softer and gentler attitudes. The architecture is definitely more Midwestern (not sure how to describe that, maybe more Victorian influences, buildings tend to be lower), very few Jews and Italians, fewer Catholics, wider, more grid-like streets. It may not be obvious to someone who is not familiar with the two areas, or who doesn't pay attention to the differences, but I definitely see it.
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Old 04-13-2014, 12:08 PM
Status: "Deep and Dark December" (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
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^^If Jews, Italians and Catholics are your definition of "East Coast", there are a lot of east coast cities nowhere near the coast, e.g. Chicago, Omaha, and Denver to name but a few.
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Old 04-13-2014, 12:28 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: NYC
46,042 posts, read 43,299,323 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
^^If Jews, Italians and Catholics are your definition of "East Coast", there are a lot of east coast cities nowhere near the coast, e.g. Chicago, Omaha, and Denver to name but a few.
Not really. The % of Italian-Americans and Jews are much higher in Northeastern counties than elsewhere.

https://www.niaf.org/research/2000_census_2.asp

Only a handful of countries outside the Northeast reach even 10% Italian-American. Both the Pittsburgh and Buffalo have counties that have a sizeable Italian population, while not many counties elsewhere do. A couple of Ohio counties (Cleveland metro) do, as well as one or two suburban Chicago counties. The Northeast has rural and small city counties that make the list, that's not common elsewhere.

Jewish population is distributed differently, more towards the coastal Northeast. But none of the larger midwestern cities have Jewish populations the size of the larger Northeastern cities.

American Jews - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 04-13-2014, 12:38 PM
Status: "Deep and Dark December" (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
88,545 posts, read 104,871,472 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
Not really. The % of Italian-Americans and Jews are much higher in Northeastern counties than elsewhere.

https://www.niaf.org/research/2000_census_2.asp

Only a handful of countries outside the Northeast reach even 10% Italian-American. Both the Pittsburgh and Buffalo have counties that have a sizeable Italian population, while not many counties elsewhere do. A couple of Ohio counties (Cleveland metro) do, as well as one or two suburban Chicago counties. The Northeast has rural and small city counties that make the list, that's not common elsewhere.

Jewish population is distributed differently, more towards the coastal Northeast. But none of the larger midwestern cities have Jewish populations the size of the larger Northeastern cities.

American Jews - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
True but. . . all the cities I noted have very visible Italian, Jewish and Catholic populations. It's not like the midwest/west is full of WASPs. Actually, WASP sounds more eastern. One thing the midwest/west does have is sizable Scandinavian populations, which you also don't see much back east.
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Old 04-13-2014, 02:47 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: NYC
46,042 posts, read 43,299,323 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
True but. . . all the cities I noted have very visible Italian, Jewish and Catholic populations. It's not like the midwest/west is full of WASPs. Actually, WASP sounds more eastern. One thing the midwest/west does have is sizable Scandinavian populations, which you also don't see much back east.
I haven't spent time in any of those cities (though visited Chicago for a short time), but judging from the numbers those ethnicites look generally less prominent than the Northeast (except for maybe Chicago). Certainly in few parts of the Midwest Italian or Jewish isn't among the most common ethnicities, which is true in much of the Northeast. I've seen the Northeast = WASP stereotype tossed around before on the forum, which is odd. Except for parts of New England, WASP as in White Anglo-Saxon Protestant is if anything less common than most of the country.
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