U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S.
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 05-16-2013, 01:03 PM
 
Location: Marquette, Michigan
88 posts, read 75,986 times
Reputation: 95

Advertisements

KC, at least in my opinion, is a part of the middle midwest, if there were such a thing. Their peers within the region are Columbus and Indianapolis. All three of those cities have a very different feel to them than the Great Lakes cities, but are quintessentially midwest.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 05-16-2013, 05:54 PM
 
Location: IN
20,846 posts, read 35,937,611 times
Reputation: 13287
Quote:
Originally Posted by s.davis View Post
Of course, you could say that about different places in the Great Lakes region too. Linguistic and cultural differences exist between say, Duluth and Detroit which are more profound than those between KC and Cleveland.

And the same kind of vegetation/soil/biomes/ecoregions don't exist in Escanaba as in Eerie, PA either.

The flaw in your logic is obvious to everyone but you (or maybe including you).
The Great Lakes region tends to have far more similarities that it shares among its peer cities, and I wouldn't say Cleveland and Kansas City have a lot in common minus some demographic and built environment similarities. Natural vegetation, trees, and plantings also impact the built environment and you cannot grow a good number of trees further to the west near the periphery of the Midwest that do well in the Great Lakes region. Coniferous trees do very poorly in Kansas City due to the mediocre soil and extreme heat combined with drought cycles. In most of the central and northern Midwest coniferous trees grow much better and I think that does impact the feel and the built environment of cities and rural areas.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-16-2013, 05:56 PM
 
Location: IN
20,846 posts, read 35,937,611 times
Reputation: 13287
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomalak View Post
KC, at least in my opinion, is a part of the middle midwest, if there were such a thing. Their peers within the region are Columbus and Indianapolis. All three of those cities have a very different feel to them than the Great Lakes cities, but are quintessentially midwest.
The big difference is that Columbus and Indianapolis are centrally located and convenient to other large metro areas within the Midwest whilst KC is relatively isolated.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-16-2013, 06:07 PM
 
Location: IN
20,846 posts, read 35,937,611 times
Reputation: 13287
Quote:
Originally Posted by s.davis View Post
Oh, so now "where conifers grow" is your working definition of midwest? Jesus, your getting so thin with this line of argument its laughable. Maybe you should tell the entirety of the southeastern US that it part of the midwest now, because of the piney woods they have there...just like Michigan!!!

And your "assessment" of the soil types around the KC region is just flat wrong. Anyone who has ever turned dirt for a living would have a good guffaw at your idea that NE KS and MW MO have "poor soil". As would every agricultural scientist, agronomist, economist, and ecologist.

Just for your reference, here's a map of the showing concentration of the best growing soil type on earth, mollisol, by land area:


Maybe you should just make the argument that KC is not the "real" midwest because you are from there, and you didn't like it, but you want to be able to say you like "the midwest". Anyone who has read your screeds knows can divine that pretty easily. It would save everyone time.
What you don't understand is that even if soils are more favorable it doesn't constitute an excellent environment for growing crops and trees if the climate is not as favorable. The state of Kansas has a plentitude of mollisols and better ag soils, but the climate is far too hot and dry during the warmer months to be able to grow corn and soybeans like the Midwest without requiring costly and unsustainble irrigation derived water. Evapotranspiration of moisture from green plants becomes more extreme the further south in latitude you go and the best agricultural soils that contain "mass production" crops are in the central and north-central Midwest. A good amount of Midwest crops grown in Nebraska are irrigated.
WHEAT is grown on lands that cannot grow crops that turn a higher profit. Wheat is grown in Kansas because the climate there is unlike that of Iowa, but that would be obvious if you had the faintest understanding about climate and agriculture.

The Piney Woods of east Texas and the forest types of Michigan have nothing at all in common. Much of central and southern Michigan is a hybrid landscape filled with row crop farms, dairy farms, forests, and orchards, along with urban environments. The tree types in Michigan are mostly similar to what you would find in states to the east of it with a few exceptions.

"Anyone who has ever turned dirt for a living would have a good guffaw at your idea that NE KS and MW MO have "poor soil". As would every agricultural scientist, agronomist, economist, and ecologist."
River valleys will have the best soils, but the further southwest you go the worse the climate gets for reliable solid returns on anything other than crops that grow best in western environments like wheat, sorghum, alfalfa, etc.

"Maybe you should just make the argument that KC is not the "real" midwest because you are from there, and you didn't like it, but you want to be able to say you like "the midwest". Anyone who has read your screeds knows can divine that pretty easily. It would save everyone time"

I don't think I particularly care for places that are in geographic transition zones with a wide array of influences from other nearby regions.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-16-2013, 09:39 PM
 
6,127 posts, read 6,444,228 times
Reputation: 6543
Quote:
Originally Posted by greenbay33 View Post
Yep, totally. Just look at who they just elected Mayor Seriously Omaha is split down the middle. The West is mostly moderate Republicans, while East Omaha is mostly democratic, but hardly liberal.
Well, to be fair, the outgoing mayor is a total dbag.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-16-2013, 10:44 PM
 
Location: Milwaukee
1,999 posts, read 1,990,215 times
Reputation: 568
Quote:
Originally Posted by stlouisan View Post
Here's the difference...Dallas' Catholicism is likely due to a large Hispanic population, which is 42.4%, like much of Texas. KC's Catholicism comes primarily from its white population (KC is only 10% Hispanic). Boom. That is a HUGE difference. And it completely destroys your demographics.

If you want to believe KC and Dallas are two peas in a pod, believe that. KC and Chicago are more similar in terms of history, industy (meat-packing, blues, etc.) and culture than KC is to Dallas. If you told people in KC they were Southern like Dallas, you'd get stared at. So be a know-nothing and believe KC belongs in the same region as Dallas and not as Chicago. You are truly backwards if you believe that. What you are doing is essentially the same thing as saying that LA has more in common with Miami than with San Francisco, therefore they are more similar and should belong in the same region. Until you can overcome culture and linguistics, your argument of KC being more like Dallas is weak.
Could it be KC partly due to its regional location has a unique blend of Southern and Midwestern culture? Asking that by neither placing one culture above or below the other.

If KC does have that blend then that might be a unique quality to it that it should be proud of.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-16-2013, 11:23 PM
 
Location: The Pacific Northwest
6,015 posts, read 6,364,041 times
Reputation: 8281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supine View Post
Could it be KC partly due to its regional location has a unique blend of Southern and Midwestern culture? Asking that by neither placing one culture above or below the other.

If KC does have that blend then that might be a unique quality to it that it should be proud of.
I agree with that. It's not like the Midwest, South, East Coast, West Coast, etc. are different countries. The Midwest was defined by the Census Bureau, not the gospel. There are going to be cities that exhibit characteristics that may not fall completely in line with what people think are endemic to the region and I don't see anything inherently wrong with that.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-17-2013, 07:29 AM
 
Location: Sector 001
7,242 posts, read 6,462,681 times
Reputation: 8290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
^^My husband is from Omaha. I have asked him, many times, if he thinks Omaha is midwestern or Great Plains. His response? It's "Mid-Plains". Omaha seems very midwestern to me, a Pittsburgher currently living in metro Denver.

Omaha and Sioux Falls are both 'midwestern' ... the following map does a very good job defining the boundaries... with fairly good detail. There are some cities which have traits of the midwest but are in areas that are otherwise not midwestern, such as Oklahoma City.

American English Dialects
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-17-2013, 10:31 AM
 
499 posts, read 679,992 times
Reputation: 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by thefallensrvnge View Post
In terms of culture, they are slightly different. As most have mentioned they tend to be more conservative, and rural-minded. I am originally from the Great Plains, and after I moved to the Great Lakes, one thing I noticed was the Great Plains tends to have a greater emphasis on Native American culture, especially around Oklahoma and South Dakota. The people are also built to survive the most unimaginable weather.

It seems like some of the Great Lakers want to dump the Great Plains because it is the least fashionable part of the US. Whenever someone comes along to dismiss the Midwest as fly-over country, some Great Lakers will just point to the Great Plains and say "I think you mean these guys over here." It's not good to be seen with us. Sort of the old timer nobody wants around anymore. Agriculture just doesn't command the respect it once did, and the staunch conservatism ages us even more. I can understand some of the mentality of not liking the Great Plains, but having grown up there, I know there are a lot of good people on the plains.

That said, the Great Plains is more diverse (landscape and politically) than most would think. And I do find a lot of Midwesterners (especially within the older generation) view the two regions as a whole.
Humorous take on the Midwest I never thought of it in that way. The same can be said for the south with diversity.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-17-2013, 02:06 PM
 
363 posts, read 617,253 times
Reputation: 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBeagleLady View Post
Well, to be fair, the outgoing mayor is a total dbag.
Yep, Monty Burns wasn't that great. I actually think Strothert might be good for Omaha
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S.
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top