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Old 06-06-2013, 03:43 PM
 
249 posts, read 374,024 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
First thing I will say is the typical things young people look for in a city like public transportation and safe, walkable, cool neighborhoods are going to be lacking in a city that experiences heavy brain drain.

Second, if you choose the right city, it can be a lot easier to find a job due to lower competition.

I would recommend the following cities: Little Rock, Oklahoma City, Tulsa, Wichita, or Omaha. Those cities are economies that are humming along nicely yet are relatively unpopular for relocating young professionals due to desirability issues i.e. they are not hip. Many educated people who grew up in them end up moving away after college. They also are a fair compromise in terms of quality of life vs the cities of the Rust Belt.

Good post, and thanks for the input.

Re the transportation issues, I don't need anything like SF or NY or CHI, just enough to get around if I don't want to fight traffic and the like. I mention the transportation because to my mind, there is no point in living in a larger city if you have to drive everywhere. It just becomes exponentially more inconvenient.
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Old 06-06-2013, 03:46 PM
 
249 posts, read 374,024 times
Reputation: 230
Quote:
Originally Posted by annie_himself View Post
Shreveport, Louisiana is a perfect choice.


Penny for your thoughts Annie? Curious as to what it is about Shreveport that causes you to make such a claim.


As for everyone else, I appeal to you all to please list a bit of an explanation(subjective or objective are both perfectly fine) with your suggestion if you decide to contribute a city.

I'm really looking for answers based on personal experiences in relevant cities here, but I know they will be harder to come by.
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Old 06-06-2013, 04:16 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC (in my mind)
7,946 posts, read 15,053,596 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago60614 View Post
I wouldn't put Omaha in that boat. Omaha and Des Moines (about 120 miles east) are basically brain draining the educated people from Iowa and Nebraska - those who don't go to regional hubs like Chicago, Minneapolis, Kansas City.

With such a strong emphasis on education in those states you have a ton of qualified kids who are flocking away from all the small cities/towns/rural areas. It's a huge problem for those Midwestern states. Everyone is leaving hundreds of dying towns aside and moving to the major US cities, or concentrating in areas like Omaha, Lincoln, Des Moines or Iowa City.

I know for Iowa the populations of the Des Moines and Cedar Rapids/Iowa City metro areas alone gain more people than the entire state does as a whole, and it's just increasing. It's bleeding out into the urban areas at the expense of everything else. Since 1970 just the central counties of Des Moines, Cedar Rapids and Iowa City have gained 300,000, while the state as a whole only went up by 250,000.

As far as other Midwestern areas that probably see a lot of brain drain (just a guess):

Rockford, Illinois
Peoria, Illinois
Quad Cities
Waterloo, Iowa
Fort Wayne, Indiana
Kalamazoo, MI?
South Bend?
Toledo?
You are right. Omaha and Des Moines are more white collar and educated than I thought. They still aren't real young professional magnets. They may be regionally but nowhere near the level of a Portland or Austin.

I would recommend Oklahoma City to the OP. It's pretty much what he is asking for except its more livable than some of the declining Rust Belt cities. Great job market and low competition make it a great place to escape the recession, providing you can live with its negatives.
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Old 06-06-2013, 04:25 PM
 
3,514 posts, read 4,019,776 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the12ronin View Post
Penny for your thoughts Annie? Curious as to what it is about Shreveport that causes you to make such a claim.


As for everyone else, I appeal to you all to please list a bit of an explanation(subjective or objective are both perfectly fine) with your suggestion if you decide to contribute a city.

I'm really looking for answers based on personal experiences in relevant cities here, but I know they will be harder to come by.
OP, probably the most effective way to figure out a good answer to this question would be to take your top couple of cities of interest and post this question on their forums.

I'm a lifelong Daytonian, so I can tell you anything you need to know about the city - but I have biases just like anyone else. If you really want to know about a particular location, you are better off with multiple POV in the discussion that actually have perspective on the same subject.

For instance, I know nothing about Little Rock, AR at all. But it has seemed to come up a lot here, with some comments from people who know about it and others from people who don't. We aren't going to be able to decide the best city for you here, but individually we can help tell you what is good and what is not about very particular locations. Good luck!
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Old 06-06-2013, 08:35 PM
 
Location: Jersey City
6,489 posts, read 16,169,219 times
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The Norfolk, VA area has had a brain drain problem for decades. I haven't seen very recent statistics, but 10 years ago (when I lived there) they were among the fastest-draining metros in the country. I don't think much has happened to change that.

They have a new light rail line, but the bus system leaves a lot to be desired.
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Old 06-06-2013, 11:56 PM
 
Location: Miami-Jax
6,318 posts, read 6,981,922 times
Reputation: 3504
Interesting topic. I think you seek somewhat of a paradox, as neither a mid-major city nor a city struggling with brain drain will likely have decent public transit. There are maybe a dozen cities where you can use transit as a superior alternative to the "inconvenience of driving" (as you say you want), and all of those are brain magnets.

That said, answering this question is dependent on what level of city you're talking about. At the highest tier, some folks in cities like Boston and DC see brain drain as a concern and are proactively seeking to stave off such issues before they get worse. Of course, 99% of cities in America would like to have the brain drain "problems" that Boston and DC are seeing. I think we could break US cities into many different levels and highlight which ones are the "losers" for each category.

But I don't know enough about the relocation patterns of grads to attempt that, so I will speak only for the city I know best, Jacksonville, FL.

I think we definitely have struggled with a brain drain of sorts for many decades. I'm gonna look at this on three levels:
1) Retaining your homegrown talent
2) Retaining your local college grads
3) Attracting (and obviously retaining) college grads from other parts of the country. We can go one step further and call this a need to attract young professionals because they tend to be educated and by the time they phase out of the "young professional" label they are most likely not going to relocate.

As far as Jax goes:
1) Having grown up in Jax attending one of the top schools in the city (Ranked the #1 public school in the country for 3 of my 4 years haha) I know the mentality was always predominantly to get out of Jax and go far far away as soon as we could. Now that hasn't happened across the board and I am surprised to find that probably approx a third of my class is still in Jax, many happily so. But nevertheless, a majority of the really successful students/professionals from my childhood have left town.
2) Now, again I'm not using any statistics but rather drawing from personal experience and anecdotal evidence, but traditionally, Jacksonville's institutions of higher learning have been below average for a major metropolitan area. And the largest university we have (UNF) was always more of a commuter school back when I was a kid. So much of the student population were just local kids who were still waiting for their chance to leave town...whether that would be by transferring to UF or another more reputable state school, or graduating an taking a job somewhere else. But in the 10-15 years since, the university has grown tremendously, and I believe has more traditional students than commuters now. Meaning we are actually drawing college kids in from other parts of the state and country. Also, it definitely seems like more of those local grads are staying in the city. THAT SAID, we're still way below par for a city our size. eg, I believe the Jax population is a couple hundred thousand larger than Austin, TX. But just the University of Texas-Austin alone is double the size of all of our universities combined, and it's also obviously way more reputable as a research institution than our two small research universities. Bottom line, while I think it's possible that our retention of local college grads by percentage might be at or slightly below the national avg, im sure the absolute number is waaay below the average for metros our size.
3) Attracting young professionals...umm, to keep it simple...no, we don't. lol.

Some links of interest:
One Spark tries to reverse the brain drain of ambitious and creative from Jacksonville | jacksonville.com
‘We are facing a brain drain’
Quote:
“We are facing a brain drain,” he said. “The best and the brightest are using our resources and leaving,” said Ahmed.
Are Some Cities "Like Jacksonville" Doomed Never to Catch Up?
Do Millennials Want to Call Your City ?Home?? | Metro Jacksonville

BTW, our public transit sucks.
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Old 06-07-2013, 08:39 AM
 
11,177 posts, read 22,391,357 times
Reputation: 10924
Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
You are right. Omaha and Des Moines are more white collar and educated than I thought. They still aren't real young professional magnets. They may be regionally but nowhere near the level of a Portland or Austin.

I would recommend Oklahoma City to the OP. It's pretty much what he is asking for except its more livable than some of the declining Rust Belt cities. Great job market and low competition make it a great place to escape the recession, providing you can live with its negatives.
No no, nowhere near that level. I just meant they're a solid draw for young people within ~200 miles. I don't see people from Georgia or Utah flocking there as a magnet for young people.
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Old 06-07-2013, 02:07 PM
 
Location: Syracuse, New York
3,114 posts, read 2,527,355 times
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Fresno has had a longstanding problem with brain drain.
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Old 06-07-2013, 04:33 PM
 
Location: Somewhere extremely awesome
3,034 posts, read 2,466,639 times
Reputation: 2318
Quote:
Originally Posted by 313Weather View Post
Detroit.
Detroit's a great place to go, but the OP will need a car.

My recommendation is coming up the road 90 miles or so to Lansing. Almost the same brain drain with better public transportation.
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Old 06-08-2013, 12:05 AM
 
Location: Sault Ste. Marie, MI
302 posts, read 592,849 times
Reputation: 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago60614 View Post
I wouldn't put Omaha in that boat. Omaha and Des Moines (about 120 miles east) are basically brain draining the educated people from Iowa and Nebraska - those who don't go to regional hubs like Chicago, Minneapolis, Kansas City.

With such a strong emphasis on education in those states you have a ton of qualified kids who are flocking away from all the small cities/towns/rural areas. It's a huge problem for those Midwestern states. Everyone is leaving hundreds of dying towns aside and moving to the major US cities, or concentrating in areas like Omaha, Lincoln, Des Moines or Iowa City.

I know for Iowa the populations of the Des Moines and Cedar Rapids/Iowa City metro areas alone gain more people than the entire state does as a whole, and it's just increasing. It's bleeding out into the urban areas at the expense of everything else. Since 1970 just the central counties of Des Moines, Cedar Rapids and Iowa City have gained 300,000, while the state as a whole only went up by 250,000.

As far as other Midwestern areas that probably see a lot of brain drain (just a guess):

Rockford, Illinois
Peoria, Illinois
Quad Cities
Waterloo, Iowa
Fort Wayne, Indiana
Kalamazoo, MI?
South Bend?
Toledo?
Kalamazoo and South Bend are college towns. Is it considered Brain Drain when kids come in to go to college, finish college, and then leave?
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