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How about you post some sources and we will go from there.
If Atlanta actually does have more hotel rooms than Miami it's because the overwhelming vast majority of hotel rooms in the Miami area are outside of Miami city proper. The vast majority of hotel rooms in the Atlanta area are in the Atlanta city proper. Do you really think the Atlanta area has more hotel rooms than the Miami area? Do you you understand how crazy that sounds? Post some sources on both your claims and then we will see the truth.
Miami city proper did 4.8 million international visitors in 2014 and Atlanta did only 723 thousand. Even just the city of Ft. Lauderdale beat Atlanta with 792 thousand. You said Atlanta has 45 million visitors like it means 45 million tourists came to visit Atlanta. That's the craziest thing I've heard in a while. So Atlanta had under a million international visitors but had 44 million business travelers from around the U.S.?? Or is it you think that people from around the U.S. are coming to visit Atlanta as a tourist? That's ridiculous and the only reason why that number is so high is because they count the people who have layovers and transfers in the Atlanta airport. Me and you both know nowhere close to 45 million people are visiting Atlanta yearly.
The thread below shows the top airports for O&D passengers. It shows the passengers actually going to visit each city, without showing layovers and tranfers. Miami ranked 3rd, even higher than Chicago. Atlanta ranked 13th. Miami had 131 thousand passengers per day while Atlanta only had 61 thousand. That's sad for being the largest airport in the world. That's a huge difference and just proves my point that the majority of people going to Atlanta are just there for layovers and tranfers. Post the list that shows the supposed 45 million visitors last year and I guarantee it will rank Atlanta as high as places like NYC and L.A. The reason is the Atlanta airport is huge and beats those other cities airports in layover "visitors".
Did you even read the thread in your last link? Those O&D numbers are 4 years old, and are the totals for Miami, Fort Lauderdale and West Palm Beach COMBINED. Major fail, and totally dishonest as well. You just lost all credibility.
You're an idiot if you think that Atlanta counts connecting passengers as visitors, no place does that.
And the Hotel rooms are not all in the City Limits. Several of our major business districts are not in the City, including our largest. And I dare you to prove the visitor numbers or the fact that Metro Atlanta has more rooms wrong. You can't.
The Corporate (and Government) presence here dwarfs Miami's. It's why we have a higher GDP with a smaller population.
Did you even read the thread in your last link? Those O&D numbers are 4 years old, and are the totals for Miami, Fort Lauderdale and West Palm Beach COMBINED. Major fail, and totally dishonest as well. You just lost all credibility.
You're an idiot if you think that Atlanta counts connecting passengers as visitors, no place does that.
And the Hotel rooms are not all in the City Limits. Several of our major business districts are not in the City, including our largest. And I dare you to prove the visitor numbers or the fact that Metro Atlanta has more rooms wrong. You can't.
Of course I know it counts all three airports in the Miami metro area. Just because the Atlanta metro only has one major airport that means other places shouldn't be able to count all the major airports throughout their metro's when looking at total visitor numbers for the area? I thought you said you worked in the travel industry. Or is it you're just used to having only one airport.
Why would I have to disprove a claim you made? Is that what you usually do, make claims and have other people disprove them? I've posted numerous sources. You've posted nothing. I'm really interested in that 45 million visitor number you claimed. Please post that one, I cant wait. Ask anyone on here, they would laugh at you if you said the Atlanta metro has more hotels than the Miami metro. Have you ever been to South Florida?
The Corporate (and Government) presence here dwarfs Miami's. It's why we have a higher GDP with a smaller population.
You're right, I would think for a major "business" metro area like Atlanta it would dwarf a "vacation" area like Miami in GDP. I think it's actually closer than many people believe.
In 2015 the Miami metro had a population of 6,012,000 while the Atlanta metro had a population of 5,710,000. In 2015 the Atlanta metro had a GDP of 339 billion while Miami was 317 billion. Atlanta is supposed to be this huge economic powerhouse, while Miami's excuse is it's a "vacation area" right? So what's Atlanta's excuse? Take out all the inactive retirees from those population numbers and I think you will be quite surprised at how close it really becomes.
Here's a link saying Miami city proper has more hotel rooms than Atlanta city proper. But like I said before, the overwhelming vast majority of hotel rooms in South Florida are not in Miami city proper. I would say they are more spread out more than any other metro area, even L.A. What other major hotel areas does the Atlanta metro have? Do you want me to start naming all the hotel areas around South Florida?
Of course I know it counts all three airports in the Miami metro area. Just because the Atlanta metro only has one major airport that means other places shouldn't be able to count all the major airports throughout their metro's when looking at total visitor numbers for the area?
These Airports all serve distinctive markets. I deal with people that are married to either MIA or FLL - many are loathe to fly out of one versus the other. Miami is heavier for international traffic, Fort Lauderdale is much more domestically oriented. Nobody flies out of West Palm Beach unless they are a visitor, or live in Palm Beach County or points North.
Quote:
I thought you said you worked in the travel industry. Or is it you're just used to having only one airport.
I do work in the industry, thank you very much. And I also love having ATL as my home Airport as well. It's far superior to any of South Florida's Airports, and more globally connected. Get back to me when you have daily nonstops to Tokyo and Seoul. We also have a single seat train ride from inside the Airport to the four largest Business Districts between D.C and Texas.
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Why would I have to disprove a claim you made? Is that what you usually do, make claims and have other people disprove them? I've posted numerous sources. You've posted nothing. I'm really interested in that 45 million visitor number you claimed. Please post that one, I cant wait.
You made an idiotic claim right up front, that is simply 'fake news' - or an outright lie. You choose.
You're obviously obsessed with international numbers, which Miami excels at. That's why you keep posting links for that alone. In the grand scheme of things, that's a drop in the bucket.
When Atlanta Mayor Reed first announced these impressive numbers almost four years ago (42 million then), he was fact checked my the local media. The conclusion was that the numbers were accurate, and perhaps a little low. And yes, these are almost all domestic numbers. Atlanta serves as the 'Hub' of this entire region, Miami does not and never has.
This is detailed research provided by an independent firm that specializes in this kind of data, and was paid for by the Atlanta Convention and Visitors Bureau.
The Hotel room numbers are tracked and complied by STR, and are paid for by industry insiders. I refuse to divulge their detailed information. Let's just say say that Orlando & Vegas go back and forth for the #1 spot, and Atlanta is in the top 5. Miami isn't.
You're right, I would think for a major "business" metro area like Atlanta it would dwarf a "vacation" area like Miami in GDP. I think it's actually closer than many people believe.
In 2015 the Miami metro had a population of 6,012,000 while the Atlanta metro had a population of 5,710,000. In 2015 the Atlanta metro had a GDP of 339 billion while Miami was 317 billion. Atlanta is supposed to be this huge economic powerhouse, while Miami's excuse is it's a "vacation area" right? So what's Atlanta's excuse? Take out all the inactive retirees from those population numbers and I think you will be quite surprised at how close it really becomes.
Here's a link saying Miami city proper has more hotel rooms than Atlanta city proper. But like I said before, the overwhelming vast majority of hotel rooms in South Florida are not in Miami city proper. I would say they are more spread out more than any other metro area, even L.A. What other major hotel areas does the Atlanta metro have? Do you want me to start naming all the hotel areas around South Florida?
LOL! Now you're getting desperate. Take out all of the retirees and their locally deposited accounts to escape taxes up North and the foreigners 'parking' their money, and the South Florida economy would truly be exposed for what it has traditionally been - smoke and mirrors.
We still have something that has been fleeing Miami for years, a healthy and functioning Middle Class. Wages are higher here, the cost of living is lower and the quality of life for very many is better.
These Airports all serve distinctive markets. I deal with people that are married to either MIA or FLL - many are loathe to fly out of one versus the other. Miami is heavier for international traffic, Fort Lauderdale is much more domestically oriented. Nobody flies out of West Palm Beach unless they are a visitor, or live in Palm Beach County or points North.
I do work in the industry, thank you very much. And I also love having ATL as my home Airport as well. It's far superior to any of South Florida's Airports, and more globally connected. Get back to me when you have daily nonstops to Tokyo and Seoul. We also have a single seat train ride from inside the Airport to the four largest Business Districts between D.C and Texas.
You made an idiotic claim right up front, that is simply 'fake news' - or an outright lie. You choose.
You're obviously obsessed with international numbers, which Miami excels at. That's why you keep posting links for that alone. In the grand scheme of things, that's a drop in the bucket.
When Atlanta Mayor Reed first announced these impressive numbers almost four years ago (42 million then), he was fact checked my the local media. The conclusion was that the numbers were accurate, and perhaps a little low. And yes, these are almost all domestic numbers. Atlanta serves as the 'Hub' of this entire region, Miami does not and never has.
This is detailed research provided by an independent firm that specializes in this kind of data, and was paid for by the Atlanta Convention and Visitors Bureau.
The Hotel room numbers are tracked and complied by STR, and are paid for by industry insiders. I refuse to divulge their detailed information. Let's just say say that Orlando & Vegas go back and forth for the #1 spot, and Atlanta is in the top 5. Miami isn't.
Do a little research, you'll find some numbers.
Next.
You complain about me posting a city-data thread with 27 pages from 2013 and then you post a link from a no name source from 2012? That source reads like a travel brochure and the numbers it gives are crazy. It says Atlanta gets more visitors than Los Angeles and Las Vegas. It says Atlanta got 42 million visitors while NYC only got 52 million. You really don't understand how wrong that is do you? It even shows Orlando receiving a lot more tourists than NYC. Let me guess it's because they only counted JFK airport and not LaGuardia.. What a joke. Give me some time I'll post some real lists. You even said that study was announced by Atlanta's mayor and paid for by the Atlanta Visitors Bureau.
Are you really saying the three major airports in South Florida shouldn't be counted all together when discussing visitors to the metro area? Ask anyone on this forum and they will disagree with you. I suppose you think the Miami metro area should be split up too then? If Atlanta had more than one airport you can bet they would all be counted together when discussing the entire urban area. That's the standard everywhere in the world, and it's especially the standard on this forum.
LOL! Now you're getting desperate. Take out all of the retirees and their locally deposited accounts to escape taxes up North and the foreigners 'parking' their money, and the South Florida economy would truly be exposed for what it has traditionally been - smoke and mirrors.
We still have something that has been fleeing Miami for years, a healthy and functioning Middle Class. Wages are higher here, the cost of living is lower and the quality of life for very many is better.
So you think that the inactive retirees are not a drain on the economy and GDP? Have you not been paying attention to every economist of the past few decades warning us about this problem? A lot of them count toward the population number but contribute very little to the GDP compared to working age adults. Get a crash course on the subject below.
A lot of the reason why the cost of living is so high in Miami city proper compared to Atlanta is because the home prices in Downtown Miami, Brickell and the other areas on the coast make it skyrocket. Atlanta has nothing to compare to those areas when looking at high priced luxury homes. Those areas account for over 120k out of the 400k people in Miami city proper. They are all super expensive condos costing millions of dollars a lot of the time. When looking at the whole Miami metro area the prices are dramatically lower many places all around South Florida.
The wages in Atlanta city proper are more than Miami city proper, but when taking the whole metro into account things change drastically. Miami is only a city of 400k out of 6 million in the metro area. This link below from 2015 is from the census bureau and shows the Miami metro has a personal income of $49,000 and Atlanta metro is at $45,000. It also shows the Miami metro had higher income growth in both 2014 and 2015. The new numbers actually come out this year in the middle of June. Like I said before, take the retirees out of the equation and that number goes up. Do you really think the retirees raise the income and GDP numbers that much compared to working age adults? Heck, even social security payments are not counted toward GDP, and that's all the income many of them recieve. Read those links I posted earlier and you will see how wrong you are.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pinytr
A lot of the reason why the cost of living is so high in Miami city proper compared to Atlanta is because the home prices in Downtown Miami, Brickell and the other areas on the coast make it skyrocket. Atlanta has nothing to compare to those areas when looking at high priced luxury homes.
You complain about me posting a city-data thread with 27 pages from 2013 and then you post a link from a no name source from 2012? That source reads like a travel brochure and the numbers it gives are crazy. It says Atlanta gets more visitors than Los Angeles and Las Vegas. It says Atlanta got 42 million visitors while NYC only got 52 million. You really don't understand how wrong that is do you? It even shows Orlando receiving a lot more tourists than NYC. Let me guess it's because they only counted JFK airport and not LaGuardia.. What a joke. Give me some time I'll post some real lists. You even said that study was announced by Atlanta's mayor and paid for by the Atlanta Visitors Bureau.
Are you really saying the three major airports in South Florida shouldn't be counted all together when discussing visitors to the metro area? Ask anyone on this forum and they will disagree with you. I suppose you think the Miami metro area should be split up too then? If Atlanta had more than one airport you can bet they would all be counted together when discussing the entire urban area. That's the standard everywhere in the world, and it's especially the standard on this forum.
So you think that the inactive retirees are not a drain on the economy and GDP? Have you not been paying attention to every economist of the past few decades warning us about this problem? A lot of them count toward the population number but contribute very little to the GDP compared to working age adults. Get a crash course on the subject below.
A lot of the reason why the cost of living is so high in Miami city proper compared to Atlanta is because the home prices in Downtown Miami, Brickell and the other areas on the coast make it skyrocket. Atlanta has nothing to compare to those areas when looking at high priced luxury homes. Those areas account for over 120k out of the 400k people in Miami city proper. They are all super expensive condos costing millions of dollars a lot of the time. When looking at the whole Miami metro area the prices are dramatically lower many places all around South Florida.
The wages in Atlanta city proper are more than Miami city proper, but when taking the whole metro into account things change drastically. Miami is only a city of 400k out of 6 million in the metro area. This link below from 2015 is from the census bureau and shows the Miami metro has a personal income of $49,000 and Atlanta metro is at $45,000. It also shows the Miami metro had higher income growth in both 2014 and 2015. The new numbers actually come out this year in the middle of June. Like I said before, take the retirees out of the equation and that number goes up. Do you really think the retirees raise the income and GDP numbers that much compared to working age adults? Heck, even social security payments are not counted toward GDP, and that's all the income many of them recieve. Read those links I posted earlier and you will see how wrong you are.
How telling that you continue to move the goalposts to fit your desperate agenda. I've obviously struck a nerve with you.
By the way, just exactly when was the last major corporate relocation to South Florida?
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You just lost all credibility.
