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Many Scotch-Irish answer Irish in the census too because the term Scots-Irish isn't very known and I've the impression when people hear it, they only focus about the word "Irish" and not the word "Scots". Irish Catholics didn't immigrate in mass in the interior south so I'm always surprise when I see a town or a county with a high Irish percentage.
There was also the small town Greeley in Nebraska who had the highest percentage of Irish American (43 %) of any town/city with more than 500 people in 2000. But in 2010, the population was 466 so I think that doesn't count anymore.
I've been to the South numerous times and met my fair share of Southern "Irish". I've yet to meet one yet that wasn't "Scotch-Irish" once you scratch the surface. Sure there are a few Irish Catholics in the South, but really much, much fewer than east coast northern cities like Philly. You hit the nail on the head.
Irish Catholics are pretty rare in the South, for the most part. The largest population (both numerical and percentage) would historically be in New Orleans which has a good sized Irish Catholic population and heritage. The next cities would probably be Louisville, Savannah and Charleston (SC). Then you can add some of the recent transplants to Southern cities. New Orleans has had about 4 or 5 Irish Catholic mayors and ranked 4th in the 1850 census in Irish-born populations of US cities. I believe those other cities have had some prominent Irish Catholic mayors and politicians as well. I would also agree that many people in the South claiming Irish ancestry are not Irish Catholic, except in some of the cities mentioned above.
My point was that the German populations of Northeastern states (except Pennsylvania) is not high relative to the rest of the country. All of the New England states have a lower German % than Virginia and the Carolinas. And New York and New Jersey have German populations that are comparable to the Carolinas. These states all have below average (national average is 17%) German populations. It's only Pennsylvania that has a German percentage above the national average.
When I think of a "huge" German presence, I think of states like Wisconsin and Minnesota that are 40+% German. The German population in Northeastern states is not very different from lots of other states. And in some cases, the German percentage is even lower than what you'd find in many southern states.
I find it a bit odd that people are constantly bringing up the Germans in these discussions. The neighborhood I grew up in is considered one of the first (maybe even the first) German settlements in the United States and I can't tell you what the German influence is there (other than the name). And that goes for the rest of Philadelphia too.
My point was that the German populations of Northeastern states (except Pennsylvania) is not high relative to the rest of the country. All of the New England states have a lower German % than Virginia and the Carolinas. And New York and New Jersey have German populations that are comparable to the Carolinas. These states all have below average (national average is 17%) German populations. It's only Pennsylvania that has a German percentage above the national average.
Still, German is the most common ancestry in much of Upstate NY, especially the more rural sections. For example, a rural county I have family:
German: 23%
Irish: 18%
English: 17%
Italian: 10%
Not quite to Midwestern levels, but higher than the coastal Northeast and New England. Another small city/rural county to the north [Cayuga] has slightly German and slightly more Irish (26%), with Irish the most common. Italian is 15%, German 18%. Seems like German is the most common, with Irish #2. Italian has a greater change in urban/rural than Irish.
I've been to the South numerous times and met my fair share of Southern "Irish". I've yet to meet one yet that wasn't "Scotch-Irish" once you scratch the surface. Sure there are a few Irish Catholics in the South, but really much, much fewer than east coast northern cities like Philly. You hit the nail on the head.
Didn't you say the following?
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom77falcons
Personally I find Southern cities like Atlanta, Birmingham, Jackson, and even Charleston boring in comparison with their mostly Wasp and African American populations.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom77falcons
Catholic churches seemed pretty rare to me in Charleston County. Not so much in Baltimore County. Baltimore is much more like Philly than Charleston.
Soooo...I'm still waiting on the data showing that "Baltimore is much more like Philly than Charleston." Where is it? Even if we assumed that half of the people reporting "Irish" in the Charleston MSA were really "Scots-Irish," that still wouldn't make Baltimore more similar to Philly than Charleston (demographically speaking).
And again, it's silly to say that a city like Charleston is boring with its "mostly Wasp and African American populations" when Baltimore has way more blacks than Charleston on an absolute and percentage basis. Baltimore City is 64% African American and Charleston is 41% African American.
You said that Charleston was one of these cities that had "some, but not large white ethnic" populations. And I asked if the same could be said of Baltimore. Do you think 39% Catholic (Philadelphia) and 16% Catholic (Baltimore) are close? I mean, I don't really think of Cleveland as being the most "white ethnic" city around and it's significantly more Catholic than Baltimore. Demographically, Cleveland is more similar to Philly than Baltimore, no?
Last edited by BajanYankee; 09-27-2013 at 08:41 AM..
I'm sure the numbers are lower for the MSA as a whole (probably a good bit lower for Italians), but it doesn't really matter since NYC has such an overwhelming numerical advantage over every other metro in the country.
You think Long Island would be the most Irish/Italian part of the metro? Excluding Staten Island.
Still, German is the most common ancestry in much of Upstate NY, especially the more rural sections. For example, a rural county I have family:
German: 23%
Irish: 18%
English: 17%
Italian: 10%
Not quite to Midwestern levels, but higher than the coastal Northeast and New England. Another small city/rural county to the north [Cayuga] has slightly German and slightly more Irish (26%), with Irish the most common. Italian is 15%, German 18%. Seems like German is the most common, with Irish #2. Italian has a greater change in urban/rural than Irish.
And how does that county compare to a county in Oregon? Or South Dakota? "Germanness" is not something that's peculiar to the Northeast. Italian, yes. German, no. But people keep bringing it up like it is. Outside of the Midwest, Germans probably have the most even distribution of any Census reported ancestry.
You think Long Island would be the most Irish/Italian part of the metro? Excluding Staten Island.
Probably so. I'm not as familar with Long Island, but I associate Jersey with South Asians, Hispanics and Blacks in addition to Italians and Irish. What would be the Long Island equivalent of Newark for example?
Probably so. I'm not as familar with Long Island, but I associate Jersey with South Asians, Hispanics and Blacks in addition to Italians and Irish. What would be the Long Island equivalent of Newark for example?
Nassau County is a bit less diverse than Bergen County, NJ and way less diverse than Essex and Passaic. So to answer your question, yes, I think that Long Island is definitely the most Italian/Irish part of the Tri-State.
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