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Old 10-09-2013, 11:28 AM
 
Location: Mid Atlantic USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
so you may want to take cover! LOL!).

Lol, why would I run for cover. I'm actually nice to Southerners when I meet them.

Truthfully what is weird to me is that I meet people from all over the country when I travel or at work. It seems only Southerners, when they come across a "yankee", love to bring up that old tired Civil War crap as if they want to re-fight it all over again. It gets tiresome. I'm not saying they bring it up right away, but if you are working with them for a couple days they always manage to weave it into a conversation. Boring and tiring. Of course not all do it, but a significant majority have done it to me. 150 years is more than enough time to let it go and move on and accept the outcome. If it isn't, and your unhappy with the outcome then get going on that secession movement and make it happen. I certainly didn't start out this way, and my family hardly ever talked about North/South differences. My great-grandfather was from Norfolk VA, so his family probably fought for the South anyway.

Last edited by tom77falcons; 10-09-2013 at 12:33 PM..
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Old 10-09-2013, 12:20 PM
 
3,152 posts, read 3,140,772 times
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It's not the Civil War.. it's the War of Northern Aggression
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Old 10-09-2013, 12:43 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
45,992 posts, read 42,048,502 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IsNull View Post
It's not the Civil War.. it's the War of Northern Aggression
And I can't get why [white] southerners care so much about something that happened over 150 years ago. Or even identify that much with the region they live in from so long ago. The North of the 1860s is a completely different place from the north today, I'd interested a bit more, but not have much identification with the north of the 1860s.

I wonder if ancestry must play a role. Most of the non-rural north is descended mostly not from the residents of the north in 1860s but mostly from later waves of immigrants. The northerners of the civil war era isn't quite them, either. Southerners didn't seem to realize that, from what I've read. Then there's this Mark Twain quote:

In the North one hears the war mentioned, in social conversation, once a month; sometimes as often as once a week; but as a distinct subject for talk, it has long ago been relieved of duty...The case is very different in the South. There, every man you meet was in the war; and every lady you meet saw the war… Mention of the war will wake up a dull company and set their tongues going, when nearly any other topic would fail. In the South, the war is what A.D. is elsewhere: they date from it.
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Old 10-09-2013, 12:54 PM
 
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Again, it's not the Civil War... it's the War of Northern Aggression

It may be because the war was fought in the South and not a simple discussion over the supper table. Maybe because the South dealt with the effects of the war for generations to come after it was over. Maybe the South sees northerners fleeing the north to move south as a continuation of the carpet baggers attempting to change their culture. Maybe because the Southerners are raised to be fiercely proud of being from the South and their state. Maybe that's why college football is bigger than pro football because it lends itself to geographical identity.

Maybe you missed the winkie eye.
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Old 10-09-2013, 01:00 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
45,081 posts, read 36,303,462 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom77falcons View Post
Lol, why would I run for cover. I'm actually nice to Southerners when I meet them.

Truthfully what is weird to me is that I meet people from all over the country when I travel or at work. It seems only Southerners, when they come across a "yankee", love to bring up that old tired Civil War crap as if they want to re-fight it all over again. It gets tiresome. I'm not saying they bring it up right away, but if you are working with them for a couple days they always manage to weave it into a conversation. Boring and tiring. Of course not all do it, but a significant majority have done it to me. 150 years is more than enough time to let it go and move on and accept the outcome. If it isn't, and your unhappy with the outcome then get going on that secession movement and make it happen. I certainly didn't start out this way, and my family hardly ever talked about North/South differences. My great-grandfather was from Norfolk VA, so his family probably fought for the South anyway.
The reason why I said that is because you consistently talk smack about the South in your posts. You say that Southerners bringing up the Civil War "constantly" is tiring - well, I know what you mean because your constant negativity toward the South is just as tiring. You may be nice to Southerners when you meet them, but I can't help but think that your deep prejudices toward their region manage to make themselves known if you're around them for very long. Hence the "tiresome conversations."

Anyway, that's my take on it. Oh well, I'm still looking forward to my trip to PA - I like every region of our country. Each region has it's charms and it's positive attributes. I am unabashedly patriotic about the entire United States!
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Old 10-09-2013, 01:05 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
45,992 posts, read 42,048,502 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IsNull View Post
Again, it's not the Civil War... it's the War of Northern Aggression

It may be because the war was fought in the South and not a simple discussion over the supper table. Maybe because the South dealt with the effects of the war for generations to come after it was over. Maybe the South sees northerners fleeing the north to move south as a continuation of the carpet baggers attempting to change their culture. Maybe because the Southerners are raised to be fiercely proud of being from the South and their state. Maybe that's why college football is bigger than pro football because it lends itself to geographical identity.

Maybe you missed the winkie eye.
I didn't miss the winkie eye, but I took it as a half-joke.

But as to the bolded, that's my kinda my point. I don't think northerners would feel as connected to the past, or even think it as much to do with themselves.
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Old 10-09-2013, 01:08 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
45,081 posts, read 36,303,462 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
And I can't get why [white] southerners care so much about something that happened over 150 years ago. Or even identify that much with the region they live in from so long ago. The North of the 1860s is a completely different place from the north today, I'd interested a bit more, but not have much identification with the north of the 1860s.

I wonder if ancestry must play a role. Most of the non-rural north is descended mostly not from the residents of the north in 1860s but mostly from later waves of immigrants. The northerners of the civil war era isn't quite them, either. Southerners didn't seem to realize that, from what I've read. Then there's this Mark Twain quote:

In the North one hears the war mentioned, in social conversation, once a month; sometimes as often as once a week; but as a distinct subject for talk, it has long ago been relieved of duty...The case is very different in the South. There, every man you meet was in the war; and every lady you meet saw the war… Mention of the war will wake up a dull company and set their tongues going, when nearly any other topic would fail. In the South, the war is what A.D. is elsewhere: they date from it.
You're right about the North being so heavily populated by later waves of immigrants and that therefore many Northerners are descendants not from Civil War era folks, but later immigrants. However, the same cannot be said for Southerners in general, many of whom ARE directly descended from people who have been living in the South since long before the Civil War, black and white alike. It's a totally different personal history. My ancestors fought in the Revolutionary War (both sides) and the Civil War (also both sides, but predominately the southern side). Many Southerners know their ancestry and who fought in which wars very well, and that plays into their interest in the Civil War. (For instance, family lore has it that one of my ancestors was shot through the jaw in the Civil War, and they soaked a rag in whiskey, ran it through the wound, and he lived another 40 or so years! His name was Lafayette. That's pretty cool. I also had a great great great great great grandmother and grandfather who were medics together and who treated the wounded of many major battles, traveling the tragic road to each bloody battlefield together.)

Maybe since many northerners DON'T have that connection to the Civil War, that's one reason why they're just not as interested.

And finally, many Southerners are skeptical of big government and the Federal government in particular (and the recent shenanigans of our elected representatives bear testimony to the validity of that skepticism!). This can be traced back to the Civil War and even before that, and has been handed down through the generations.
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Old 10-09-2013, 08:26 PM
 
Location: M I N N E S O T A
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I've actually never met Southerners who mention the Civil War, but they do talk about College Football a lot.
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Old 10-09-2013, 08:43 PM
 
Location: Mishawaka, Indiana
6,514 posts, read 9,075,418 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70 View Post
I really don't get why the South has a more "working class" image. Here's how I see it. Rural areas in general are working class, and in both the north and south the majority of folks actually live in cities and suburbs. Most of the Southern cities have a white collar reputation like Atlanta, Charlotte, Raleigh, Charleston, Savannah, Nashville, and Houston and Dallas if you consider Texas to be in the South completely. However many Northern cities have a blue collar reputation particularly Pittsburgh, Detroit, Cleveland, Newark and most of upstate New York. So wouldn't this make the South more educated and white collar in comparison??? I think the only truly sophisticated, white collar cities in the north are New York, Washington DC, Chicago, and Boston. In particular Southern cities are very graceful and classy while many northern cities are filled with crime and drugs, and many have very depressing architecture and landscapes and no charm. There is no place in the South as depressing as the Michigan Rust Belt for example.

The South has lower incomes but also a lower cost of living so the quality of life is actually quite comfortable. I live in West Virginia now which on paper is one of the poorest states but I do not see the level of abject poverty I've seen in Philadelphia. Southerners do see Northerners as liberal, and many areas in the South like Northern Virginia, parts of NC, and South Florida are seeing northerners change the culture. I find people from New York and New Jersey to be the rudest I have met anywhere in the nation. The only rural areas in the north I have been to is western Pennsylvania and people there were pretty nice and friendly.
If you're suggesting the south has more well to do cities with more of a white collar working class then you haven't really looked at all of the south. Take Jackson Mississippi, Birmingham, Mobile, or Montgomery Alabama, New Orleans, Shreveport, Little Rock, Memphis, Tampa, and actually large sections of inner city Atlanta are all ridden with crime and poverty.

The only reason the north has a few problematic cities that you mentioned is due to the Great Migration we had back in the 1930's and 1940's. People from the south, mostly blacks, moved to the north in droves, filling decent paying but low skilled factory jobs. Cities like Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Cincinnati, Chicago, Gary, Flint, Detroit, and others had a large role in this, and it's part of the reason that sections of them are suffering so today. Back in the 1940's and 1950's the south didn't have very many major cities, only in the last few decades have a lot of people really started clamoring for the sunbelt cities, filling them up.
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Old 10-09-2013, 10:33 PM
 
Location: Mid Atlantic USA
12,344 posts, read 10,332,895 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
And finally, many Southerners are skeptical of big government and the Federal government in particular (and the recent shenanigans of our elected representatives bear testimony to the validity of that skepticism!). This can be traced back to the Civil War and even before that, and has been handed down through the generations.

Funny that this distrust and hatred of the Fed Govt began in the late 50's and early 60's with the Civil Rights movement. There are many well written books by historians, plus backed by historical fact, that the South was hugely behind FDR and The New Deal. They were all for all those programs building dams, roads, rural electrification, TVA, etc. etc. They loved FDR including Strom Thurmond. It was only when the Fed Govt integrated the Army and started down the road of equal rights for African Americans that this hatred and distrust flourished anew after it had well subsided after the Civil War. It is a well known fact the classrooms throughout the South erupted into cheers upon hearing the news in their school classroom that Kennedy had been killed. How disgusting, and how so deeply patriotic of them.



Just one of many, many anecdotal stories from people living in the South at the time:

JFK and the Ku Klux Klan - JFK Assassination Debate - The Education Forum


'Terri Williams', on 08 Dec 2012 - 3:06 PM, said:
I'm not sure where my information fits in but I thought I would mention what I experienced on November 22, 1963. at the time I was in the sixth grade and only ten years old.


On that date I was living in my hometown, Terry, south of Jackson, in Mississippi. It was just after lunch when I heard the principal of our school going from door to door making an announcement. Although I could not hear what he was saying, a loud cheer came from each classroom in response.
So I was expecting good news when the principal of our school, a card carrying member of the KKK, stuck his red neck in the door and said, "The president's has been shot", to which every student, but me, jumped up and cheered.


How absolutely disgusting and typical of the hateful mindset among many Southerners at the time. And you wonder why we in the North sometimes feel the way we do.






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