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St. Louis isn't super dense like San Francisco or NYC but does have numerous walk-able neighborhoods for a city just under 5k ppsm.
St. Louis once had a density of nearly 14k ppsm, so areas that haven't been experienced a lot of tear downs and left vacant probably retained most of their original built environment.
Density and even income levels (or spending money levels) have big effects on what you can walk to. Countless factors are involved, like street width, the quality of sidewalks, real or perceived crime, and so on. You can have relatively dense areas (or formerly dense areas) that have great sidewalks but have very little retail in a half-mile radius. Even a relatively intact townhouse area will struggle to maintain much retail if there isn't much spending money around.
A mix of uses, income levels, and ethnic groups is useful so you have a mix of services at all times of day and at least evening, and at different price levels and different types. For example residents, office workers, tourists, and college students tend to fill different times of the day/week/year for a restaurant. It's good to have some dive bars and cheap takeout in addition to fancier places. And obviously the more cuisines the better.
Of course density matters. An area with 30,000 residents per square mile but not much daytime population will be pretty limited. Add 5,000 office workers in a 1/4-mile radius (1,000,000 sf office) and it'll typically do much better. Make the residential-dominated area 60,000 per square mile and that will be very different from the first scenario.
Many of the small/medium sized cities around here, like York, Lancaster, Harrisburg, PA, Wilmington,DE, Trenton, Passaic,NJ are highly walkable compared to similar sized cities in the south like Valdosta, GA, Gulfport, MS, Pensacola and Melbourne, FL, and Florence, SC.
The inner part of Reno (maybe west of I-580, south of the university, east of Keystone/Hunter Lake, north of Gentry/Moana) is pretty walkable. It's not like Manhattan but it's solid lower-density urban/upper-density suburban neighborhoods, mostly in the 5-8k ppsm range. The city becomes suburban outside that area pretty abruptly and the city limits include a large amount of undeveloped desert, hence the lower overall density.
Last edited by TheTimidBlueBars; 12-05-2018 at 10:13 AM..
Problem is that when I think about walkability of a city I think about and judge certain parts and not the city as a whole. If you are generalizing density numbers for the entire city then of course it might not jive with the walkability of the most desirable sections of that city.
Both Miami and LA have very walkable areas. And as I mentioned in another thread, Miami is actually far more walkable than people give it credit for. This is largely because many of its undesirable areas (poor neighborhoods) are very walkable...but obviously tourists and visitors aren't typically forming impressions from these areas.
But anyway, to play your game on walkable but not very dense cities:
Atlanta (in the 3 thousands/sq mile)
Charlotte, Austin and Indianapolis (in the 2 thousands)
Charleston, Savannah, Chattanooga, Nashville (all in the low 1000s)
I'd say Atlanta has many, large pockets of walkability.
Charlotte and Austin have very walkable small pockets. Indy has a very walkable downtown which is one factor in having secured the NFL combine for many many years.
Charleston, Savannah and Chattanooga have very walkable downtowns. Just wanted to include Nashville because it's notorious for having extremely low density sprawl which obviously offsets the handful of decent walkable neighborhoods.
I agree on Atlanta, Austin, Chattanooga and Savannah .
You kind of hit on this, but Im never sure why Nashville is listed in any kind of walkability related threads on these forums . It is probably the most low density city Ive ever seen, almost laughably so . There are maybe 2 neighborhoods that have any walkability whatsoever. But it is mostly limited to 1 or 2 streets.
Most of Nashville is like "30 minute drive to the grocery store" extreme sprawl .
I know these have changed since then, but here is the density by area size in 2010 for the top 15 largest Midwest cities. This excludes St. Paul given that it's part of the Minneapolis metro.
0.79 Square Miles (within 1 mile of the City Center)
Chicago: 30,475.0 Milwaukee: 14,414.9
Minneapolis: 12,833.1
Cincinnati: 9,365.5
Lincoln: 7,874.1
Detroit: 6,827.1
Omaha: 6,613.6
Toledo: 5,202.1
Indianapolis: 5,060.0
St Louis: 5,043.6
Cleveland: 4,965.0
Columbus: 4,826.9
Fort Wayne: 4,310.0
Kansas City: 4,214.1
Wichita: 3,602.9
3.14 Square Miles (2 miles from Center)
Chicago: 27,643.6 Milwaukee: 14,481.9
Minneapolis: 11,704.8
Cincinnati: 8,243.5
Detroit: 6,628.1
Columbus: 6,618.2
Lincoln: 6,577.6
Omaha: 6,124.2
St. Louis: 5,629.6
Cleveland: 5,443.8
Kansas City: 4,746.2
Indianapolis: 4,707.0
Toledo: 4,700.4
Fort Wayne: 3,975.7
Wichita: 3,845.2
7.07 Square Miles (3 miles from Center)
Chicago: 26,449.4 Milwaukee: 13,538.8
Minneapolis: 10,212.8
Cincinnati: 7,279.7
Columbus: 6,653.3
Detroit: 6,446.7
St. Louis: 6,217.4
Cleveland: 6,053.3
Lincoln: 6,003.8
Omaha: 5,676.0
Kansas City: 4,850.4
Toledo: 4,747.0
Indianapolis: 4,529.2
Wichita: 3,854.6
Fort Wayne: 3,786.9
12.57 Square Miles (4 miles from Center)
Chicago: 25,741.4 Milwaukee: 12,332.5
Minneapolis: 9,332.1
Cincinnati: 6,707.2
Detroit: 6,613.3
Cleveland: 6,592.0
Columbus: 6,254.2
St. Louis: 6,132.4
Omaha: 5,416.3
Lincoln: 5,343.9
Kansas City: 4,674.4
Toledo: 4,574.8
Indianapolis: 4,413.3
Wichita: 3,795.2
Fort Wayne: 3,475.6
19.63 Square Miles (5 miles from Center)
Chicago: 25,358.2 Milwaukee: 11,297.9
Minneapolis: 8,651.0
Cleveland: 6,700.1
Detroit: 6,568.9
Cincinnati: 6,290.1
St. Louis: 6,005.9
Columbus: 5,887.6
Lincoln: 5,044.8
Omaha: 4,985.0
Kansas City: 4,411.0
Toledo: 4,343.8
Indianapolis: 4,277.5
Wichita: 3,643.9
Fort Wayne: 3,185.2
28.27 Square Miles (6 miles from Center)
Chicago: 24,807.1 Milwaukee: 10,555.2
Minneapolis: 8,104.8
Cleveland: 6,675.8
Detroit: 6,577.2
St. Louis: 5,972.6
Cincinnati: 5,890.5
Columbus: 5,665.5
Omaha: 4,719.7
Lincoln: 4,472.1
Kansas City: 4,206.7
Toledo: 4,161.2
Indianapolis: 4,095.7
Wichita: 3,426.5
Fort Wayne: 2,994.1
38.48 Square Miles (7 miles from Center)
Chicago: 24,456.7 Milwaukee: 9,728.9
Minneapolis: 7,683.4
Detroit: 6,577.9
Cleveland: 6,552.8
St. Louis: 5,747.0
Cincinnati: 5,572.4
Columbus: 5,464.3
Omaha: 4,487.5
Kansas City: 4,039.7
Indianapolis: 3,962.9
Lincoln: 3,961.0
Toledo: 3,901.2
Wichita: 3,256.8
Fort Wayne: 2,788.4
50.27 Square Miles (8 miles from Center) Closest to Minneapolis' area size.
Chicago: 23,664.9 Milwaukee: 8,984.8
Minneapolis: 7,322.7
Detroit: 6,568.9
Cleveland: 6,385.3
St. Louis: 5,534.0
Cincinnati: 5,273.4
Columbus: 5,203.4
Omaha: 4,353.2
Lincoln: 3,961.0
Kansas City: 3,927.6
Indianapolis: 3,876.4
Toledo: 3,729.2
Wichita: 3,059.8
Fort Wayne: 2,547.6
63.62 Square Miles (9 miles from Center) Closest to Milwaukee and St. Louis' area size.
Chicago: 22,698.9 Milwaukee: 8,352.3
Minneapolis: 6,984.8
Detroit: 6,534.8
Cleveland: 6,164.8
St. Louis: 5,286.8
Columbus: 5,080.7
Cincinnati: 5,047.0
Omaha: 4,217.5
Indianapolis: 3,783.4
Kansas City: 3,769.7
Toledo: 3,583.6
Lincoln: 3,523.8
Wichita: 2,855.2
Fort Wayne: 2,342.8
78.54 Square Miles (10 miles from Center) Closest to Cleveland, Toledo and Cincinnati's area size.
Chicago: 21,489.8 Milwaukee: 7,799.5
Minneapolis: 6,649.8
Detroit: 6,461.6
Cleveland: 5,936.3
St. Louis: 5,065.9
Columbus: 4,879.2
Cincinnati: 4,820.6
Omaha: 4,099.6
Kansas City: 3,698.7
Indianapolis: 3,667.2
Lincoln: 3,523.8
Toledo: 3,396.9
Wichita: 2,661.0
Fort Wayne: 2,151.3
95.03 Square Miles (11 miles from Center) Closest to Milwaukee and Lincoln's area size.
Chicago: 20,365.6 Milwaukee: 7,287.0
Minneapolis: 6,387.7
Detroit: 6,362.1
Cleveland: 5,691.9
St. Louis: 4,924.1
Columbus: 4,692.9
Cincinnati: 4,565.8
Omaha: 4,061.0
Kansas City: 3,583.4
Indianapolis: 3,484.9
Lincoln: 3,174.5
Toledo: 3,158.3
Wichita: 2,719.7
Fort Wayne: 1,975.5
113.1 Square Miles (12 miles from Center) Closest to Fort Wayne's area size.
Chicago: 19,424.0 Milwaukee: 6,815.3
Detroit: 6,270.9
Minneapolis: 6,110.8
Cleveland: 5,483.0
St. Louis: 4,766.7
Columbus: 4,535.7
Cincinnati: 4,351.8
Omaha: 4,085.8
Kansas City: 3,481.1
Indianapolis: 3,352.4
Toledo: 2,928.2
Wichita: 2,535.9
Lincoln: 2,442.0
Fort Wayne: 1,837.6
132.73 Square Miles (13 miles from Center) Closest to Detroit's area size.
153.94 Square Miles (14 miles from Center) Closest to Wichita's area size.
Chicago: 17,627.3 Milwaukee: 6,090.1
Detroit: 6,018.2
Minneapolis: 5,635.1
Cleveland: 5,069.2
St. Louis: 4,442.3
Columbus: 4,143.6
Cincinnati: 3,988.2
Omaha: 3,766.8
Kansas City: 3,300.5
Indianapolis: 3,084.0
Toledo: 2,576.6
Wichita: 2,240.5
Lincoln: 2,119.4
Fort Wayne: 1,599.7
226.98 Square Miles (17 miles from Center) Closest to Chicago and Columbus' area size.
Chicago: 15,505.5
Detroit: 5,663.5 Milwaukee: 5,514.8
Minneapolis: 5,080.3
Cleveland: 4,598.0
St. Louis: 4,055.2
Cincinnati: 3,601.9
Columbus: 3,531.2
Omaha: 3,187.4
Kansas City: 3,177.4
Indianapolis: 2,893.5
Toledo: 2,180.3
Wichita: 1,885.9
Lincoln: 1,766.2
Fort Wayne: 1,346.3
314.16 Square Miles (20 miles from Center) Closest to Kansas City's area size.
Chicago: 13,934.8
Detroit: 5,300.7 Milwaukee: 4,869.6
Minneapolis: 4,580.9
Cleveland: 4,152.9
St. Louis: 3,801.4
Cincinnati: 3,323.3
Columbus: 3,061.7
Kansas City: 3,000.5
Omaha: 2,742.3
Indianapolis: 2,589.5
Toledo: 2,148.0
Wichita: 1,723.5
Lincoln: 1,515.0
Fort Wayne: 1,170.0
346.36 Square Miles (21 miles from Center) Closest to Indianapolis' area size.
Chicago: 13,443.9
Detroit: 5,194.8 Milwaukee: 4,715.9
Minneapolis: 4,417.2
Cleveland: 4,087.3
St. Louis: 3,695.0
Cincinnati: 3,266.1
Columbus: 2,929.6
Kansas City: 2,894.3
Omaha: 2,630.7
Indianapolis: 2,553.4
Toledo: 2,066.6
Wichita: 1,646.4
Lincoln: 1,476.6
Fort Wayne: 1,116.8
Considering it takes 17 miles from the city center to drop to #3 and Milwaukee is 1/3 the size of Detroit I'd say we're pretty dense. Overall, the Midwest has a lot of walkable cities.
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