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Old 08-28-2014, 04:32 PM
 
Location: The canyon (with my pistols and knife)
13,217 posts, read 17,948,587 times
Reputation: 14655

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caesarstl View Post
Well here when we say cities we're generally referring to the metro area, and as a "city person" as well I'd still be concerned about the situation you outlined. I do prefer it to the inverse in a metro such as Detroit, but I digress... How much experience do you have with other "rust-belt" cities? You don't know any neighborhoods in other cities that are also some of their respective metro's most expensive? With gentrification happening around them? Is that the only criteria for the East End comparison? I don't agree with some of your other comments regarding demographics of neighborhoods in other cities either. You mentioned St. Louis, How many times have you actually been to St. Louis if you don't mind me asking? For example, it certainly can be on the more segregated side (and it makes lists for this), but it also comes up very highly when looking by blocks: there are a lot of city neighborhoods that are about an even split between black and white for example.

Sorry to just end here, I'll write more soon, but I'm a bit wiped out and have to finish things before a trip tomorrow.
One thing that hurts St. Louis is that everything north of downtown is in bad shape. I've driven I-70 many times and seen all the crumbling, boarded-up and burnt-down houses. There are bad neighborhoods in Pittsburgh too, but they're in small pockets in different parts of the city, and many of them are now on the bleeding edge of gentrification as well. Imagine all of Pittsburgh's East End or North Side being a blighted ghetto. That's basically what you're dealing with in North St. Louis.

With that said, I've also driven I-64 a couple of times, and I've noticed that the neighborhoods west of downtown are in much better shape. In fact, the wealth extends seamlessly out into the western suburbs as well. That's actually one interesting thing about St. Louis has, the way the wealth in the city and the suburbs both cluster near each other. In Pittsburgh, the East End is where most of the wealth is in the city, but most of the wealth in the suburbs is to the north.

I don't know much about South St. Louis, and the only time I ever entered St. Louis on I-55 was at night, but based on maps I've seen, I'm guessing that the condition of the neighborhoods there gets better the farther away you go from the Mississippi River, and worse the closer you get. Correct me if I'm wrong, though.
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Old 08-28-2014, 06:38 PM
 
Location: Jacksonville, FL
11,145 posts, read 14,113,945 times
Reputation: 7075
Quote:
Originally Posted by OptimusPrime69 View Post
I think the "rust belt" needs a re-branding of sorts.
Cities like Detroit, Cleveland, Pittsburgh, Cinnci just sound like crap....
Pittsburgh is the pitts! Cleveland, the mistake on the lake! etc etc...

they need to shake that "rust belt" feel and name, I hate it. The rust belt just sounds bombed and depleted and depressing, ugh never wanna live in any of those cities would hate living in "the rust belt" No thanks
Many of the rust belt areas are better than South FL. South FL is loaded with crime, illegal aliens, severe traffic congestion and tons of *stupid* and FAKE people. And the wages don't even pay in scale with the cost of living at all. I'd rather live the area known as the rust belt.
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Old 08-28-2014, 07:24 PM
 
Location: Miami-Jax
6,312 posts, read 6,962,789 times
Reputation: 3502
I'll throw out Jacksonville. As I do in all these threads that are quite similar.

Early 1900s were the glory days in Jax. By far the largest and most developed city in FL. Winter Wonderland for the rich and famous. Hollywood South (before there was a Hollywood) One of the largest private transit companies in the country. Very dense and urban infrastructure. Major shipping port and rail hub.

1970s-90s Jax was a sprawling wasteland of blandness. Miami, Orlando and Tampa not only caught up, but far surpassed Jax in population, attractions, commerce and notoriety. Jax was well-known for its terrible smell (paper mills) and not much else.

In 1995 the Jacksonville Jaguars kind of put the city on the map.
in the 2000s the metro sees 20% population growth, hosts a Super Bowl, and finally begins to develop a few urban, walkable neighborhoods.
Today Jax is home to One Spark, "the World's Crowdfunding Festival," the stadium with the largest Video Boards in the world, and a billionaire NFL owner who is doggedly determined to bring many more major corporate players to the city. Meanwhile, the FORMER NFL owners have settled into retirement and become among the top 20 most prolific philanthropists in the country, with the lion's share of their giving staying right here in the River City. There are still plenty of issues, but the future looks bright.
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Old 08-28-2014, 07:24 PM
 
Location: Pittsburgh, PA (Morningside)
12,416 posts, read 11,913,851 times
Reputation: 10533
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjlo View Post
I don't think you hear most residents from "rust belt" cities refer to them as such. It also sucks to live in a city from the "rust belt" that didn't suffer the same decline be lumped in with the "rust belt" based on Geography.
Rust belt has a fuzzy connotation, because it mostly means cities which used to have a heavy manufacturing base which has evaporated, but have yet to recover. New York City and Boston were once considered rust belt, but they are no longer. Indeed, the term isn't even used much for not particularly gentrified cities in the Northeast Corridor, like Philly or Baltimore, any longer. Chicago has managed to graduate out as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caesarstl View Post
Well here when we say cities we're generally referring to the metro area, and as a "city person" as well I'd still be concerned about the situation you outlined. I do prefer it to the inverse in a metro such as Detroit, but I digress... How much experience do you have with other "rust-belt" cities? You don't know any neighborhoods in other cities that are also some of their respective metro's most expensive? With gentrification happening around them? Is that the only criteria for the East End comparison? I don't agree with some of your other comments regarding demographics of neighborhoods in other cities either. You mentioned St. Louis, How many times have you actually been to St. Louis if you don't mind me asking? For example, it certainly can be on the more segregated side (and it makes lists for this), but it also comes up very highly when looking by blocks: there are a lot of city neighborhoods that are about an even split between black and white for example.
I know Cleveland the best, as I've spent the most time there. Ohio City has some interesting stuff going on, but a lot of it still seems very gritty. Tremont seemed like it had a fair amount going on, but was kinda meh in terms of infrastructure. University Circle was way on the edge of Cleveland, and seemed to be the only place which had any significant new development, and was separated from everything else by miles of ghetto and blight. I also found it weird the major museums were located all the way out there instead of closer to downtown.

I'm aware that there are pockets of wealth in all of these cities, like Mount Adams in Cincinnati. And there are gentrifying areas like Soulard in Saint Louis. That said in Pittsburgh there is new development of one sort or another going on in every neighborhood surrounding downtown now, along with virtually all of the East End. I don't have my finger on the pulse of each of these cities, but the comebacks, to the degree they're happening, seem to be concentrated in fewer neighborhoods, suggesting less demand overall.
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Old 08-28-2014, 07:32 PM
 
3,955 posts, read 3,487,388 times
Reputation: 6331
Quote:
Originally Posted by projectmaximus View Post
I'll throw out Jacksonville. As I do in all these threads that are quite similar.

Early 1900s were the glory days in Jax. By far the largest and most developed city in FL. Winter Wonderland for the rich and famous. Hollywood South (before there was a Hollywood) One of the largest private transit companies in the country. Very dense and urban infrastructure. Major shipping port and rail hub.

1970s-90s Jax was a sprawling wasteland of blandness. Miami, Orlando and Tampa not only caught up, but far surpassed Jax in population, attractions, commerce and notoriety. Jax was well-known for its terrible smell (paper mills) and not much else.

In 1995 the Jacksonville Jaguars kind of put the city on the map.
in the 2000s the metro sees 20% population growth, hosts a Super Bowl, and finally begins to develop a few urban, walkable neighborhoods.
Today Jax is home to One Spark, "the World's Crowdfunding Festival," the stadium with the largest Video Boards in the world, and a billionaire NFL owner who is doggedly determined to bring many more major corporate players to the city. Meanwhile, the FORMER NFL owners have settled into retirement and become among the top 20 most prolific philanthropists in the country, with the lion's share of their giving staying right here in the River City. There are still plenty of issues, but the future looks bright.
I have always felt Jacksonville was far underrated.
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Old 08-28-2014, 10:37 PM
 
Location: Mid Atlantic USA
12,332 posts, read 10,298,159 times
Reputation: 5394
Quote:
Originally Posted by Summersm343 View Post
You live in Philly and you don't know if any of these projects are under construction? So either you live in New Jersey or the Northeast and never come into Center City... gotcha. Yet you claim to be a pro on everything Philly? Makes sense now. Do yourself a favor, walk around a little bud.

The majority of these projects are well underway or are starting by the end of the year. I guess you don't see it because you don't come into Center City - ever.

New Comcast Tower over 1,000 feet tall and the tallest building in the US outside of NYC and Chicago is well underway
http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/...CC0BE6726C.jpg

FMC Tower at 730 feet tall has been underway for more than a month
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.n...6ce0b56e3dd50d

Evo has been under construction for two years and is nearly complete
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.n...88001693_n.jpg

Etc. etc. etc. The majority of these projects are well underway or definite to start within the next few months.

I live in the graduate hospital area, or the trendy name "southwest center city". So stuff it. I walk everyday to work up 19th or 20th street, turn right at Chestnut and walk down to Broad Street. And no, not all those projects on that list are being built.
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Old 08-28-2014, 10:40 PM
 
Location: Mid Atlantic USA
12,332 posts, read 10,298,159 times
Reputation: 5394
Quote:
Originally Posted by Summersm343 View Post
You live in Philly and you don't know if any of these projects are under construction? So either you live in New Jersey or the Northeast and never come into Center City... gotcha. Yet you claim to be a pro on everything Philly? Makes sense now. Do yourself a favor, walk around a little bud.

The majority of these projects are well underway or are starting by the end of the year. I guess you don't see it because you don't come into Center City - ever.

New Comcast Tower over 1,000 feet tall and the tallest building in the US outside of NYC and Chicago is well underway
http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/...CC0BE6726C.jpg

FMC Tower at 730 feet tall has been underway for more than a month
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.n...6ce0b56e3dd50d

Evo has been under construction for two years and is nearly complete
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.n...88001693_n.jpg

Etc. etc. etc. The majority of these projects are well underway or definite to start within the next few months.

Out of that whole list you came up with three. Are the others under construction yet or not? I don't care about "proposed". You are just a typical Philly is the greatest booster. Go down to DC or up to NYC if you want to see real booming construction going on. Philly does everything at a snails pace compared to Boston, DC, NYC, Chicago, Seattle, etc. etc.
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Old 08-29-2014, 08:36 AM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
8,702 posts, read 11,922,865 times
Reputation: 3574
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom77falcons View Post
I live in the graduate hospital area, or the trendy name "southwest center city". So stuff it. I walk everyday to work up 19th or 20th street, turn right at Chestnut and walk down to Broad Street. And no, not all those projects on that list are being built.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom77falcons View Post
Out of that whole list you came up with three. Are the others under construction yet or not? I don't care about "proposed". You are just a typical Philly is the greatest booster. Go down to DC or up to NYC if you want to see real booming construction going on. Philly does everything at a snails pace compared to Boston, DC, NYC, Chicago, Seattle, etc. etc.
First of all, aren't you from Atlanta? Second, so you walk down 19th and 20th and Chestnut... so you admit you never see any of these sites then so you really have no idea whats going on? Okay.

I don't think this thread is comparing cities to Boston, DC, NYC, etc. - so why are you bringing them up on this thread? The title of the thread is "Cities that are currently in a renaissance?" - and Philly is currently in a renaissance. Am I wrong in saying that? Why is it that anytime anyone brings up Philly on these forums, they are instantly attacked, told that Philly doesn't compare to NYC, San Fran, etc... and then called delusional boosters when Philadelphian's try to defend their city? Lol it's pretty funny

And lastly, there is a ton more going on then the three projects I listed. I was just too lazy to post them all. Here's more:

Lancaster Square
https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.n...479ff305d5240d

1919 Market- started site prep this week
https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5582/...055ecae8_b.jpg

Penn Medicine South Tower
https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.n...83604570_n.jpg

38 Chestnut
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.n...60672381_n.jpg

3601 Market
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.n...70906167_n.jpg

Children's Hospital of Philadelphia Ambulatory Care Center
https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...32&oe=5461710C

Philadelphia Family Court Building- nearly complete
https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/...97040201_n.jpg

Some other projects I didn't mention too like Penn's College House at Hill Square, 1900 Arch, Mormon Temple, Temple University Science Education & Research Center, AQ Rittenhouse, Rodin Square, the 1100 Block of Chestnut which is completely under construction, etc. which are all under construction as well. Expect to see W Hotel, SLS International, 1601 Vine, 700 Schuylkill, One Riverside, 500 Walnut, One Water Street, 205 Race, and some large Market East projects starting over the next few months.

Last edited by RightonWalnut; 08-29-2014 at 09:03 AM..
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Old 08-30-2014, 04:33 AM
 
Location: The canyon (with my pistols and knife)
13,217 posts, read 17,948,587 times
Reputation: 14655
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom77falcons View Post
Out of that whole list you came up with three. Are the others under construction yet or not? I don't care about "proposed". You are just a typical Philly is the greatest booster. Go down to DC or up to NYC if you want to see real booming construction going on. Philly does everything at a snails pace compared to Boston, DC, NYC, Chicago, Seattle, etc. etc.
Apparently this is what Philadelphia's skyline will look like by the end of the decade, based only on dirt that's already been moved.
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Old 08-30-2014, 08:04 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,689 posts, read 36,118,702 times
Reputation: 63246
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordHomunculus View Post
Pittsburgh
Cincinnati
Maybe New Orleans

DEFINITELY New Orleans.
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