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View Poll Results: Next state to leave the South?
Virginia 37 48.05%
North Carolina 6 7.79%
Georgia 4 5.19%
Florida 20 25.97%
Texas 15 19.48%
Kentucky 2 2.60%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 77. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-27-2014, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,853 posts, read 36,203,761 times
Reputation: 63521

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
I'll keep it simple for you....was Maryland ever a southern state? If not, how do you explain the historical record confirming it was a southern state?
If the answer was so simple, Maryland wouldn't have contributed 60,000 troops to the Union Army and 25,000 to the Confederate Army during the Civil War. The Maryland Legislature voted against secession in 1861, but 1/3rd of the General Assembly of state legislators were arrested and imprisoned for their support of secession.

There's not a simple "yes or no" answer to your question. Not all topics are, or even should be, "simple." I have no problem discussing and researching and understanding complex issues and questions, so there's no need to "keep it simple" for me.
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:21 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
28,266 posts, read 26,252,873 times
Reputation: 11726
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
If the answer was so simple, Maryland wouldn't have contributed 60,000 troops to the Union Army and 25,000 to the Confederate Army during the Civil War. The Maryland Legislature voted against secession in 1861, but 1/3rd of the General Assembly of state legislators were arrested and imprisoned for their support of secession.

There's not a simple "yes or no" answer to your question. Not all topics are, or even should be, "simple." I have no problem discussing and researching and understanding complex issues and questions, so there's no need to "keep it simple" for me.
Still doesn't answer the question. It's not like the Civil War is the only relevant data point. Maryland was a founding member of the Southern Legislative Conference and the Southern Governors Association. That's a pretty clear southern identity if you ask me.

Quote:
Baltimore once was clearly a Southern city - with all of the pride of the South and all its prejudices.
So basically, you would disagree with the above assessment and say it was "unclear" whether it was in fact southern?
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:46 AM
 
Location: Tampa
734 posts, read 732,746 times
Reputation: 759
Quote:
Originally Posted by RosemaryT View Post
I voted "Virginia," just because it's what I really, really, really want.
As a Virginia native, I'd be more than happy if the state obliged your request.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotty011 View Post
Can you answer one question? Why would Virginia want to leave the South? This is what I am trying to understand. It absolutely makes no sense to me. And no, it is impossible for Virginia to "leave the South."
Anyone who knows anything about Virginia and its residents knows that when people there want to "leave" the south, what they really mean is people in Northern Virginia want to "leave" the south.

Northern Virginia, by most accounts, might as well be a completely separate state, and anyone who is from there will make sure to tell you they're from Northern Virginia, not Virginia. If they live really close inside the beltway, they might even identify themselves as living in DC.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UKWildcat1981 View Post
Florida is a state that is impossible to define thou. Nothern Florida and the Panhandle are in the Deep South. Miami/South Florida is a mix of northeasters, internationals and Latinos. Central Florida around Orlando is similar to Miami lots of transplants from the northeast just not as bad and tourists from all over the world. Tampa area is a mix of the south and northeastern. Daytona Beach is sort of redneck area and very southern. Tally and Gainesville felt like the south when I visited. Florida is still southern but its a state that is impossible to define because its do diverse and big.
Correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjlo View Post
I don't see how Maryland can be considered southern. I mean maybe back in 1860 it had more in common with the south. It doesn't really seem to have dick in common with the south now. But if we go on 1860 geography lets start refering to Michigan as the West and everything past St Louis as our manifest destiny full of savages.
Dude, Murrland has a lot of rednecks, especially on the eastern shore. And hey technically it's south of the Mason/Dixon line. Many residents will be happy to point that out as they cling desperately to what little southern heritage the state has left.
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:54 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,853 posts, read 36,203,761 times
Reputation: 63521
Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
Still doesn't answer the question. It's not like the Civil War is the only relevant data point. Maryland was a founding member of the Southern Legislative Conference and the Southern Governors Association. That's a pretty clear southern identity if you ask me.



So basically, you would disagree with the above assessment and say it was "unclear" whether it was in fact southern?
Baltimore doesn't represent the entire state.

Maryland is not a member state of the Southern Legislative Conference but it IS a member state of the Southern Governors Association. No surprise there.

States which are at the edges of regions, or which border other countries, have especially complex cultural identities.

By the way, Missouri, Oklahoma, and West Virginia are members of the Southern Legislative conference. Puerto Rico, the US Virgin Islands, West Virginia, and Kentucky are members of the Southern Governors Association. Does that make them "southern states?" And if they dropped their membership, would that mean they "seceded from the South?"

And Maryland was not a founding member of the Southern Legislative Conference by the way. The founding states were Arkansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Oklahoma, Tennessee and Texas.

This group was founded in 1947. Maryland joined in 1948 and dropped out (you might use the term "seceded" though I think that's overkill) some time after 2006, so MD was a member state for less than fifty years.

Missouri attended the conferences from the earliest days but only became a member in 1993. Does that mean that Missouri "became" a southern state in 1993? I mean, if being southern or not being southern depends on whether or not your state is a member of the Southern Legislative Conference, I guess that makes sense, right?

https://www.slcatlanta.org/staff_and...about_us.shtml
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:56 AM
 
Location: One of the 13 original colonies.
10,162 posts, read 6,495,020 times
Reputation: 8024
Quote:
Originally Posted by meat_popsicle View Post
As a Virginia native, I'd be more than happy if the state obliged your request.

Anyone who knows anything about Virginia and its residents knows that when people there want to "leave" the south, what they really mean is people in Northern Virginia want to "leave" the south.

Northern Virginia, by most accounts, might as well be a completely separate state, and anyone who is from there will make sure to tell you they're from Northern Virginia, not Virginia. If they live really close inside the beltway, they might even identify themselves as living in DC.

Correct.


Dude, Murrland has a lot of rednecks, especially on the eastern shore. And hey technically it's south of the Mason/Dixon line. Many residents will be happy to point that out as they cling desperately to what little southern heritage the state has left.


Dude, New York state and every other state in the union has rednecks. What's your point? Do you ass u me that rednecks only exists in the South?
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:59 AM
 
Location: Tampa
734 posts, read 732,746 times
Reputation: 759
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotty011 View Post
Dude, New York state and every other state in the union has rednecks. What's your point? Do you ass u me that rednecks only exists in the South?
Different kind of redneck up in NY. What's your point? Oh, you're trolling.

There are areas of MD that still identify more with the south than the north.
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Old 08-27-2014, 12:04 PM
 
Location: One of the 13 original colonies.
10,162 posts, read 6,495,020 times
Reputation: 8024
Quote:
Originally Posted by meat_popsicle View Post
Different kind of redneck up in NY. What's your point? Oh, you're trolling.

There are areas of MD that still identify more with the south than the north.

Not trolling at all. You mistakenly assume that rednecks are a southern thing and nothing is further from the truth. And no, the Northern rednecks are not a different kind.
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Old 08-27-2014, 12:09 PM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
28,266 posts, read 26,252,873 times
Reputation: 11726
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Maryland is not a member state of the Southern Legislative Conference but it IS a member state of the Southern Governors Association. No surprise there.
Good grief, woman. You're still talking about the present whereas I'm talking about history. Maryland was a member of the SLC and remained so for more than half a century.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
States which are at the edges of regions, or which border other countries, have especially complex cultural identities.
Not that complex. It was a southern state just like Kentucky. No amount of word-twisting can wipe out history. You're engaging in what's called revisionism.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
By the way, Missouri, Oklahoma, and West Virginia are members of the Southern Legislative conference.
Missouri joined in the mid 90s. Maryland joined in the 40s. Either way, this has nothing to do with how people thought of the state in 1948. You are literally incapable of distinguishing between present-day and historical conceptions of North/South.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Puerto Rico, the US Virgin Islands, West Virginia, and Kentucky are members of the Southern Governors Association. Does that make them "southern states?" And if they dropped their membership, would that mean they "seceded from the South?"
Kentucky is still clearly a southern state. West Virginia likely had a stronger southern identity 50 years ago than it has today. PR and VI joined in the late 1960s and would be outliers no matter what region they joined (as if they would be a better fit with Maine).

Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
And Maryland was not a founding member of the Southern Legislative Conference by the way. The founding states were Arkansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Oklahoma, Tennessee and Texas.
My bad. It joined a whole year later in 1948 along with South Carolina, Alabama, Georgia, Florida, Virginia and West Virginia. (you know, when Strom Thurmond, Robert Byrd and George Wallace were still around and kickin').

Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
This group was founded in 1947. Maryland joined in 1948 and dropped out (you might use the term "seceded" though I think that's overkill) some time after 2006, so MD was a member state for less than fifty years.
Only 50 years!!! (It actually left in 2011). That's only 63 of the 67 years that the organization has been in existence!

Last edited by BajanYankee; 08-27-2014 at 12:17 PM..
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Old 08-27-2014, 12:10 PM
 
Location: Tampa
734 posts, read 732,746 times
Reputation: 759
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotty011 View Post
Not trolling at all. You mistakenly assume that rednecks are a southern thing and nothing is further from the truth. And no, the Northern rednecks are not a different kind.
I'll let you believe that just so you stop talking.
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Old 08-27-2014, 12:14 PM
 
Location: One of the 13 original colonies.
10,162 posts, read 6,495,020 times
Reputation: 8024
Quote:
Originally Posted by meat_popsicle View Post
I'll let you believe that just so you stop talking.

Oh you are so very kind. Thank you. Mums the word. LMAO.

When the ignorant can't come up with an intelligent answer they either change the subject or end the conservation.
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