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Old 10-19-2014, 01:41 AM
 
Location: Colorado
1,524 posts, read 2,261,726 times
Reputation: 2168

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Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieOlSkool View Post
I don't know, I always thought Manziel looked ambiguous. Jobs looked less and less Arab with age. Depends who you ask or where you are. In Western Michigan, Southern Europeans are not considered White, or at the very least the "same kind" of White that the Dutch are. Put a Spaniard or Portuguese person in Holland, Michigan and see how many people there take him as their own.

Look, race isn't even a thing. Arabs can be classified as "Mediterranean Caucasoids" (what I am) by outdated "science". I don't think White is a thing as Black isn't a thing or Asian isn't a thing. But if these "races" are categories, they sure are more accurate than "Hispanic". But you're right, don't get me started on "White" as that could mean anything to anyone at anytime.

In the East Coast, a dark and hairy olive skinned bearded fellow like me is White. In the South and the Midwest, forget it. Depending on who you ask I may or may not be White. I was raised believing White is only Northern European, that's it.
Since you are moving to Maryland, I can tell you it is alot like what you describe in the Midwest. I don't know how dark and olive skinned and hairy you are, but people from places like Portugal, Spain, and Sicily aren't really white for alot of people. If you are French or German looking "olive skinned" you are a regular white boy. But there is something about people from Spain/Portugal, etc that just looks very different about their facial features, build, etc that looks markedly different from the regular white northwestern European American. And people here that I know from the Portuguese community don't call themselves white, and will flat out tell you they are not white.

I remember meeting a white Mexican girl when I was working in Towson (a city north of Baltimore, south of Philly) who was actually "white" although clearly very foreign looking, as in clearly not your run of the mill American white person. She had reddish/orange hair, light eyes, etc, and was very friendly and quick to tell me and my grop of co-workers that her family is pure Spanish, and she asked us if we were surprised to see that she is a "white" Mexican.

Well one of us replied with something along the lines of, well we don't even really consider the Spanish white here. She seemed real confused (and actually very disappointed) to learn that many in America don't even consider Spaniards, Portuguese, etc to be really "White" people. I can pretty much guarantee you that in out of the way rural Maryland like the Eastern Shore where the population is much more "homogenous" and descended from the "original" colonials and the entire area is English/British/German (I mean all English/German names and Mc-somethings) and African American, here I guarantee you that a person from Spain wouldn't be white. I know one 40 year old Spaniard guy personally who immigrated when he was 15 or so and is totally assimilated with the last name Sanchez and I have seen people tell him :you aren't really white". It's like as soon as they know he is Spanish instead of English/German/French/Dutch, etc, he doesn't count as a white guy. So perhaps "white" also includes a cultural meaning for the north of Europe rather than than southern Mediterraneans.
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Old 10-19-2014, 04:57 PM
 
Location: One of the 13 original colonies.
10,156 posts, read 6,485,363 times
Reputation: 8019
Why do some Americans think "Hispanic" is a race?


Because so many Americans are ignorant. Look at the threads here. They can't tell North from South, much less anything else.
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Old 10-19-2014, 10:04 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
5,302 posts, read 8,088,556 times
Reputation: 2136
Quote:
Originally Posted by eschaton View Post
Again, exactly what percentage of European DNA does someone need to have before you can call them white? 50%? 66%? 75%? Please tell me. And if not based upon DNA, which is at least objective, how are we to determine who is white and who isn't?

Obama being considered to look black and not white when he's a 50/50 mix is mostly due to the history of one-droppism in the U.S. Look at some half white/half Asian people like Jennifer Tilly, Karen O, and Vanessa Hudgens. They certainly "pass" for white much easier than someone half (or arguably even a quarter) black does.
Vanessa Hudgens doesn't look White at all. I thought she was Latina, actually, until I found out she's Filipina.
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Old 10-19-2014, 10:16 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
5,302 posts, read 8,088,556 times
Reputation: 2136
Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieOlSkool View Post
I don't know how Mexico gets its race stats but I'm sure they are about as ****-poor as the USA's. In the US, a White man can be a Swede, but he can also be an Algerian or a Palestinian. So even if Mexico's "white" figures are overinflated, so are the USA's. Because it can mean whatever you want it to mean.
Yeah, I've always found it silly that the Census classifies West Asian/North African people as "White" when many don't see them that way. They're about as mixed up, if not more so, as Latin Americans. Latin Americans, generally, are mixed of European (Spanish or Portuguese, mainly), Native American, and/or Black. West Asian/North Africans are generally mixed from the indigenous peoples of those areas (Assyrians, Persians, Hittites, etc), Black Africans, and Asian & White conquerors of those regions (Mongols and Turks ruling much of the Middle East and the Caucusus region; French ruling over Morocco, Algeria and Lebanon, Portugal and Spain having land in Morocco as well, English ruling in Egypt, modern-day Israel and Sudan, Greeks and Romans ruling in what is now Turkey, Russians ruling in Georgia, Armenia, and Azerbaijan, Russian invasion in Afghanistan, etc etc).
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Old 10-19-2014, 10:21 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,651 posts, read 36,106,549 times
Reputation: 63187
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlajos View Post
If it is true that americans view hispanics/latinos as a "race" then they are down right stupid.
It's true that SOME Americans probably view Latinos as a "race," just as I am sure that SOME Spaniards believe that bullfighting is a noble sport. Both groups would qualify as "downright stupid" in my book.
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Old 10-19-2014, 10:28 PM
 
Location: Pittsburgh, PA (Morningside)
12,414 posts, read 11,910,584 times
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It really does boggle my mind that people in other parts of the country have such restrictive definitions of white. At least four of the Hispanics that hobbesdj showed pictures of look to clearly be "white" to me. Where I grew up in Connecticut, by the standards suggested, virtually no one was white, because over half the people were of Italian, Portuguese, or Jewish descent.

And in my own personal experience, yes, basically everyone from a European country is considered white. And also a lot of people from the Middle East (particularly Turkey, Lebanon, Syria, and Iran) provided they don't wear a hijab or something.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawaii4evr View Post
Yeah, I've always found it silly that the Census classifies West Asian/North African people as "White" when many don't see them that way. They're about as mixed up, if not more so, as Latin Americans. Latin Americans, generally, are mixed of European (Spanish or Portuguese, mainly), Native American, and/or Black. West Asian/North Africans are generally mixed from the indigenous peoples of those areas (Assyrians, Persians, Hittites, etc), Black Africans, and Asian & White conquerors of those regions (Mongols and Turks ruling much of the Middle East and the Caucusus region; French ruling over Morocco, Algeria and Lebanon, Portugal and Spain having land in Morocco as well, English ruling in Egypt, modern-day Israel and Sudan, Greeks and Romans ruling in what is now Turkey, Russians ruling in Georgia, Armenia, and Azerbaijan, Russian invasion in Afghanistan, etc etc).
Most really aren't anywhere near as mixed as Latinos honestly. Most Muslim Arabs have some black African ancestry, but it's on the order of 5%-20% depending upon the country. Until you get to Central Asia or Afghanistan, there really isn't a measurable proportion of Asian ancestry (except a few percent in the Turks). For the most part, peoples in the Near East are a mixture of different populations which geneticists call "West Eurasian" - which is the same population group as Europeans. The bottom line is genetically speaking everyone from Norway to Yemen really is pretty much the same race.
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Old 10-20-2014, 01:20 AM
 
29 posts, read 32,383 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieOlSkool View Post
I feel like this one should be easy to debunk. Just look at celebs like George Lopez, then look at Major League Baseball Players like Yasiel Puig or actors like Andy Garcia to maybe see that there probably isn't some mythical Hispanic race.

But then you have people who say "well those are just skin tone variations, but Hispanic is still a race". What makes people believe this nonsense? To be fair I think the concept of race is flawed to begin with but if it was to exist at least people would have a point in thinking Northern Europeans are the same "race" like West Africans are the same "race". But Hispanics?

Why does this Hispanic term even exist? They are not a monolithic group. Latin American countries are not homogeneous AT ALL (just look at Venezuela or Puerto Rico). The fact that they speak the same language is irrelevant, as no one believes in an "Anglian" race made up of people from Anglophone countries.

I think this term should be dropped.



More mindless politically correct splitting hairs.


I suppose then, under that rationale, we can ALSO -never- use the word "white" do describe Americans of the fairer, European sort eh?



Progressive liberal politics = Let's bleed our blue hearts dry for these poor poor impoverished foreign ethnicities, yet let us enjoy our hedonistic, self-serving vanilla lifestyle completely separate from said poor, unfortunate souls by aggregating in only the most expensive, cushy, excessive locales.



I'm as white as the freshly driven snow, and the current generations of white Americans make me sick in how little they worry about their own countrymen and how much time, energy and civil effort they can expend for people not born in this country.



This country is a sad, frightfully joke anymore. You can make book on those words folks.
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Old 10-20-2014, 06:20 AM
 
1,689 posts, read 2,222,826 times
Reputation: 1389
hispanic is actually about to disappear from the US census
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Old 10-20-2014, 09:38 AM
 
Location: USA
8,016 posts, read 9,476,913 times
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Because they don't classify themselves into races per se, so that is the best way
for america to describe them as a multicultural group of Spanish-speaking people.
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Old 10-20-2014, 12:03 PM
 
2,541 posts, read 2,152,853 times
Reputation: 3823
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbesdj View Post
Hispanics always say that. "My mother has green eyes and red hair, etc" and you actually see the person for yourself and they don't look like a white person. A Rubia in Latin America dentoes someone with even the slightest tinge of light hair, that wouldn't be considered even close to a blonde by actual white people in America, Britain or Australia, or Germany. And they can't wait to tell you about their Spanish grandmother.
That is so true. What they themselves consider "looking white" isn't necessarily what everyone else would consider white. Often times, Hispanics with light hair & eyes actually have non-white facial features. And yes, I have sometimes heard Hispanic people say "My grandmother is from Spain". That seems to be the go-to phrase in an attempt to prove one's "whiteness".

That said, the word "blond" is often used in a similar context here in the United States. It's often used to refer to people with light brown hair. Anybody with light brown hair is generally considered "blond" here.
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