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View Poll Results: Is Southern the same as country
Yes - the two are synonymous and all country people are Southern, too 14 17.95%
No - they can exist independently of each other in any region 64 82.05%
Voters: 78. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-18-2014, 11:29 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michigan83 View Post
Michigan ranks near the top for production in a bunch of farming categories.
And by "a bunch of farming categories" you listed exactly two- blueberries and cherries. Michigan isn't a leading producer of any other crop. Blueberries and cherries are niche crops anyways.
Quote:
Originally Posted by michigan83 View Post
It is a farming state outside of Metro Detroit. Period.
Metro Detroit has most of the state's population, so even if this were true (and it isn't), then obviously Michigan isn't a farming state.

One could say "Tokyo is a farming state, because outside of Tokyo proper, it's mostly farming". Uh, yeah, and? No one lives there.
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Old 11-18-2014, 11:31 AM
 
Location: West Michigan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NOLA101 View Post
You don't even know what you're arguing.

The proportion of urbanization is based in the proportion of a state living in urban areas. It has nothing to do with characteristics of the geography.

Therefore, if a state's land area is "mostly rural in character" then obviously it's a highly urbanized state. Obviously if no one lives in most of the state, the population is highly urbanized, and not rural.

You completely switch the definition, and now define rural areas as those with the most people living in urban areas. So places like California, where the population is concentrated in a few urban centers, and most of the land is empty, would be very rural, according to you, while somewhere like Mississippi, where there is no dominant population center, and a large rural population, would be very urban, according to you.

Sorry, but no. California is a more urban state than Mississippi. It's population, not geography that obviously determines whether the state is urban or rural. Otherwise the definition is meaningless. and just a function of the state's relative size.
So according to your logic, Colorado is not a mountainous state? Most of the population lives on the high plains.
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Old 11-18-2014, 11:33 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michigan83 View Post
So according to your logic, Colorado is not a mountainous state? Most of the population lives on the high plains.
No, obviously Colorado is a very mountainous state. But it's also an urbanized state.

And it isn't "my logic". It's everyone's logic. It's how the Census bureau defines urbanization. Most states in the U.S. are fairly urbanized, including Michigan. The fact that most of the U.S. (and the world, for that matter) is empty is exactly the point. People congregate in urban areas these days, for the most part, esp. in the developed world.
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Old 11-18-2014, 11:34 AM
 
Location: West Michigan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NOLA101 View Post
No, obviously Colorado is a very mountainous state. But it's also an urbanized state.
Right. And Michigan is agricultural and also urbanized. Because the outlying geography also counts.
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Old 11-18-2014, 11:37 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michigan83 View Post
Right. And Michigan is agricultural and also urbanized. Because the outlying geography also counts.
Michigan has agriculture, obviously, like all non-arid states, but is not weighted towards agricultural production. It produces 2% of the nation's food.

It isn't like an Iowa or Indiana, where there is outsize agricultural production relative to population.
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Old 11-23-2014, 08:28 AM
 
Location: sumter
8,546 posts, read 5,369,214 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michigan83 View Post
Strangely enough, when I think of "country" I think of my surroundings here in the North, which are cornfields, red barns, white farm houses, dirt roads, small towns with grain elevators, etc. When I have traveled in the South, my notion of "country" actually seems harder to find, or I don't see it at all. But that's just me. I have a warped perspective.
That would pretty much be country here in the south as well. However, country and farming don't always go hand in hand. You can live the country life without having anything to do with farming. There are developments around here that are designed for country living with no nearby farming. Many people here just love the serenity of living out in the country and wide open spaces. I have many family and friends who choose to live way out and wont have it any other way.
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Old 11-29-2014, 04:36 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ipaper View Post
That would pretty much be country here in the south as well. However, country and farming don't always go hand in hand. You can live the country life without having anything to do with farming. There are developments around here that are designed for country living with no nearby farming. Many people here just love the serenity of living out in the country and wide open spaces. I have many family and friends who choose to live way out and wont have it any other way.
So I guess then the question is, do the Southern states have the most wide open space, AND is this wide open space populated?
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Old 11-30-2014, 12:39 PM
 
Location: One of the 13 original colonies.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieOlSkool View Post
So I guess then the question is, do the Southern states have the most wide open space, AND is this wide open space populated?


If you are looking for wide open spaces, I think you would find that mostly in the West and not the South.
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Old 11-30-2014, 04:42 PM
 
462 posts, read 582,278 times
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The "Southern" stereotypes are the same as the "Wild West" stereotypes. Similar accent, cowboy hats, horses, affinity for guns, etc. Scots-Irish culture is at the core of most of these stereotypes. It's the reason "country" music more correctly termed "country-western". They have historically been an ostracized, violent and rebellious people. British monarchs kicked them over to Northern Ireland, and then they moved to the United States, where the only place they fit in was the Appalachian highlands. They helped start and win the Revolutionary War and have been heavily involved in every major conflict since.

Clannishness led to incest stereotypes, self-sufficiency as a people led to being stereotyped as "racist". The "uneducated" stereotype comes from the fact that they lived in remote wilderness for the first two centuries of American history. It was hard to get enough people together to build a quality school or church, plus the rebellious nature often is opposed to changes coming from the outside. I really I don't know where the "illiterate" stereotype comes from, since so many writers have come from this culture. Even cowboys were well-read. The "drunk redneck" stereotypes, which from my experience are pretty accurate most of the time, are probably just a testament to how strong of a drink whiskey is. Ireland has famous drunks too. Whiskey replaced rum as the southern drink of choice around the late 1700s.

If left to the French and English planters, the south would probably only be known for balls and galas, nice houses, a caste system, tea and some quaint, but lively cities like New Orleans, Charleston, Mobile, and Savannah. It would probably be more Caribbean or Latin American in nature over time.
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Old 11-30-2014, 05:04 PM
 
4,802 posts, read 3,839,346 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamtonfordbury View Post
The "Southern" stereotypes are the same as the "Wild West" stereotypes. Similar accent, cowboy hats, horses, affinity for guns, etc. Scots-Irish culture is at the core of most of these stereotypes. It's the reason "country" music more correctly termed "country-western". They have historically been an ostracized, violent and rebellious people. British monarchs kicked them over to Northern Ireland, and then they moved to the United States, where the only place they fit in was the Appalachian highlands. They helped start and win the Revolutionary War and have been heavily involved in every major conflict since.

Clannishness led to incest stereotypes, self-sufficiency as a people led to being stereotyped as "racist". The "uneducated" stereotype comes from the fact that they lived in remote wilderness for the first two centuries of American history. It was hard to get enough people together to build a quality school or church, plus the rebellious nature often is opposed to changes coming from the outside. I really I don't know where the "illiterate" stereotype comes from, since so many writers have come from this culture. Even cowboys were well-read. The "drunk redneck" stereotypes, which from my experience are pretty accurate most of the time, are probably just a testament to how strong of a drink whiskey is. Ireland has famous drunks too. Whiskey replaced rum as the southern drink of choice around the late 1700s.

If left to the French and English planters, the south would probably only be known for balls and galas, nice houses, a caste system, tea and some quaint, but lively cities like New Orleans, Charleston, Mobile, and Savannah. It would probably be more Caribbean or Latin American in nature over time.
Great history lesson. However...

Why would it be more Caribbean or Latin American over time?

Also, it is known for tea. That Black tea brewed in sugar water is pretty much a Southern staple.
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