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Old 01-02-2015, 11:23 AM
 
19 posts, read 20,454 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccm123 View Post
Couple of suggestions (I also lived in South Pasadena for several years when I lived in SoCal). Nothing will ever be exactly like LA, as LA is very unique.

1/ Austin, Texas
2/ Houston, Texas
3/ San Jose, CA
4/ Denver, CO
5/ Portland, OR
6/ San Luis Obispo, CA
7/ Walnut Creek, CA (reminds me of Pasadena, CA)
Quote:
Originally Posted by denverian View Post
I don't think taxes are as high in Denver as LA (I moved here from Orange County), but it sounds like you'd be happier among "Tea Partiers". Denver is liberal, although more of a "live and let live" type of liberal (hence the legal weed in CO). I don't own guns, so really don't care what the gun laws are. You can own a gun in CO though.
I'm not a Tea Partier in the slightest. I'm fiscally conservative and not a big fan of taxes, but socially I don't care what people do at all. I like firearms but that's about it, I'm not the Fire and Brimstone type.
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Old 01-02-2015, 12:01 PM
 
Location: Prince George's County, Maryland
6,212 posts, read 7,401,553 times
Reputation: 2581
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeavinLA1989 View Post
Phooey, let's not get all into semantics here. You know EXACTLY what I mean. No, Los Angeles doesn't resemble Barcelona...it does however feel like one of the larger cities in Mexico (where I have been!).


Many people colloquially use the word "Spanish" to refer to all things Latino or Hispanic in this country. I might refer to Boyle Heights as a "Spanish neighborhood" even though it's actually a Mexican/Central American neighborhood. My parents are from New York, and they grew up in the little Italy section of the Bronx. If you asked them, they would tell you it's mostly Spanish people now, in reality it's mostly Puerto Ricans.

I am not writing an academic paper, you knew exactly what I mean...if you don't then I assume you haven't had much social interaction with Americans outside of your bubble. Because the colloquial use of Spanish to refer to all things Hispanic in America is widely used and almost never chastised unless it's by a Geography teacher or someone trying to be a smart*ss.


Btw, I have no problem living in a city with a lot of people speaking Spanish...at home, or with their friends. However I do have a big problem when people come to a country that is largely English speaking and then put the residents at a disadvantage by speaking English. My ancestors spoke Italian, in their homes and churches and all-Italian social events. But they learned English and would have never expected their fellow citizens to pander to their lack of English skills by asking them to learn Italian.
Sorry to nitpick but, people from Barcelona speak Catalan (it's like an interesting mix of Italian, French, and Spanish) not Spanish lol.
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Old 01-02-2015, 12:55 PM
 
19 posts, read 20,454 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by tcave360 View Post
Sorry to nitpick but, people from Barcelona speak Catalan (it's like an interesting mix of Italian, French, and Spanish) not Spanish lol.
Yea, but they are in Spain. If someone from Peru went there and spoke only Spanish they wouldn't have a problem.
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Old 01-02-2015, 01:20 PM
 
Location: sumter
8,622 posts, read 5,403,992 times
Reputation: 6621
Why not just try something new altogether, I mean like cities up and down the east coast. Also some places in the Midwest, most notably Chicago.
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Old 01-02-2015, 01:20 PM
 
Location: Buena Park, Orange County, California
1,426 posts, read 1,888,038 times
Reputation: 1494
Hey LeavinLA1989,

So I can sense the frustration in your posts. To be honest, though, it appears as if you've spent way too much time in Los Angeles (particularly East and Northeast) and not enough in other parts of California. If this weren't the case you wouldn't a) come off as a New York City transplant and b) be aware of several nuances within the Mexican/Mexican American/Latino experience in California.

For starters, the Aztlan/Chicano/semi-nationalistic nature (which for non-LA people, let me tell you...it is a real thing, and not an exaggeration by the OP necessarily) is a characteristic that is much more typical of Mexicans (especially those several generations in) from your part of L.A. than anywhere else, and it lessens the further you get away from Los Angeles. I won't go into it any further, but if you are curious, it is discussed to an extent on this thread: Hispanic Communities:Norcal vs Socal As a first generation (meaning I was born and partially raised in Mexico, but I am now a naturalized citizen) Mexican American who grew up between Long Beach and Orange County, let me tell you that terms like 'Aztlan' and 'Chicano' were not part of my vocabulary until later years of high school/early years of university. This is true for the majority of my family (most of which still probably have never heard nor would be able to tell you what Aztlan is).

Also, Mexicans, much like other Latinos, have some of the highest rates of inter-cultural (I use cultural instead of race, because we are already a multi-racial people) of marriage, especially with whites (Irish and Italians) and Asians (Filipinos overall, Vietnamese in OC). This is backed both by data and personal experience (I have friends of mixed Mexican heritage of just about every possible combination: blaxican (black-Mexican), Vietnamese-Mex, Korean-White-Mex, Japanese-Mexicans, Indian-Mex, Filipino-Mex (my cousins), Irish-German-Japanese-Mex (my niece), German-Mexicans (cousins), Italian-Mex, Colombian-Mex, etc, etc) So you're statement of racism against non-Spanish speakers doesn't add up (perhaps you've had very bad luck and have run into all the wrong types of Mexicans/Latinos, I don't know.)

Lastly, if what you say is true, it doesn't seem like your problem is Mexicans, but more the characteristic of people you've encountered in LA and the politics/policies/regulations of California. In that case, I think your best bet is definitely Denver, CO and/or Phoenix, AZ metros. Both, btw, have a strong Mexican/Latino presence, but they don't have the Chicano and nationalist/activist history of the communities in Los Angeles. The Phoenix metro is larger than Denver (Phoenix approaches 5 million, while Denver's is less than Orange County (3million) at around 2.5mil), which is something to consider since you seem to likely heavily populated areas. Your concerns about the gun laws/taxes in Colorado, feel exaggerated IMO (my best friend's boyfriend collects rifles and he is in no hurry to get out of CO), as Colorado is still much more laissez faire than California (though, not as crazy as Nevada). Colorado, overall, comes off to me as a marriage between Midwestern values and Western politics and tolerance. Someone in CD once described Denver as mix between Phoenix and Minneapolis, and I actually think that is pretty accurate.

Arizona, on the other hand, feels like a cultural/political island. Like, if it weren't for the geography/climate (both which I love...it is a beautiful place), I wouldn't hesitate calling it a Southern State in mindset, along with the typical Northern transplants you find in other sunbelt states. Then again...I hear Atlanta actually has a lot going for it culturally, and I'm not sure many can agree with that about Phoenix. Having spent time in both, the Denver metro (though smaller) feels slightly more hustle and bustle, more urban, than Phoenix.

I think in terms of lifestyle/quality of life, the main question I would ask myself if I were you is if you would rather deal with a Denver winter (it does sometimes get below 0) or a Phoenix Summer (often above 100F, though dry)? Personally, I choose Denver...but the microbrew beer and pro-weed culture are large motivators for me (lol). Otherwise, as you are a mountain man like myself, let me tell you that both have beautiful scenic surroundings worth exploring. I give a slight edge to Denver due to the extensiveness of the Rockies.

Another option to throw out there (if you can deal with some humidity) is Atlanta (http://www.atlantatrails.com/hiking-...avorite-hikes/). Atlanta, has nature, it is diverse and cosmopolitan (with a Southern flair) and it shares that LA feature of having large suburban tracts close to its urban core. Houston shouldn't even be in your radar. It is hella FLAT!

Best of luck!

P.S. This isn't about being PC, but just about liberating yourself from the shackles of ignorance: no one on the West Coast or Southwest would call Latinos/Mexicans/Central Americans 'Spanish' that is a typical East Coast thing to do. The only non-Spanish Latinos that refer to themselves as Spanish are Puerto-Ricans and, more rarely, Dominicans and Cubans. Again, these groups are pre-dominantly East Coast. The Southwest has a history of people of Spanish descent, and therefore to them Spanish means exactly that Spanish (European), not Latino, not Mexican. Also, no Mexican (unless they were proudly Criollo, which I have some great aunts/uncles who consider themselves that) would ever call themselves Spanish, anymore than any true American would call themselves English. Both Americans and Mexicans acknowledge the cultural and historical links to England and Spain, respectively, but both groups are too fiercely proud of their independence to associate themselves with their ex-colonizers in such a fashion (something Canadians wouldn't understand, LOL.)
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Old 01-02-2015, 02:51 PM
 
Location: LBC
4,155 posts, read 4,491,623 times
Reputation: 3543
Quote:
Originally Posted by ABQConvict View Post
Damn, that's a lot of words.

Where I live, Albuquerque, 'Spanish' is used to describe Americans of mainly Spanish heritage as opposed to Mexicans.

Oh, and I am from the Bronx, too. In fact I am sitting in a house in the Bronx right now. I call Spanish speakers around here 'Puerto Ricans' or 'Domincans'. I call their language 'Spanish'.

I wouldn't call you 'English' because you speak English.




You didn't have to tell me you have a chip on your shoulder, it was readilly inferrable from the rest of your posts.
Pretty much.
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Old 01-02-2015, 03:22 PM
Status: "Bye Bye Warriors" (set 22 days ago)
 
Location: where the good looking people are
3,571 posts, read 2,595,061 times
Reputation: 2992
El Segundo native here.

There is nothing like LA.

LA is LA, and everyone else is simply everyone else.
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Old 01-02-2015, 03:25 PM
 
29 posts, read 23,362 times
Reputation: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by RudyOD View Post
Hey LeavinLA1989,

So I can sense the frustration in your posts. To be honest, though, it appears as if you've spent way too much time in Los Angeles (particularly East and Northeast) and not enough in other parts of California. If this weren't the case you wouldn't a) come off as a New York City transplant and b) be aware of several nuances within the Mexican/Mexican American/Latino experience in California.

For starters, the Aztlan/Chicano/semi-nationalistic nature (which for non-LA people, let me tell you...it is a real thing, and not an exaggeration by the OP necessarily) is a characteristic that is much more typical of Mexicans (especially those several generations in) from your part of L.A. than anywhere else, and it lessens the further you get away from Los Angeles. I won't go into it any further, but if you are curious, it is discussed to an extent on this thread: Hispanic Communities:Norcal vs Socal As a first generation (meaning I was born and partially raised in Mexico, but I am now a naturalized citizen) Mexican American who grew up between Long Beach and Orange County, let me tell you that terms like 'Aztlan' and 'Chicano' were not part of my vocabulary until later years of high school/early years of university. This is true for the majority of my family (most of which still probably have never heard nor would be able to tell you what Aztlan is).

Also, Mexicans, much like other Latinos, have some of the highest rates of inter-cultural (I use cultural instead of race, because we are already a multi-racial people) of marriage, especially with whites (Irish and Italians) and Asians (Filipinos overall, Vietnamese in OC). This is backed both by data and personal experience (I have friends of mixed Mexican heritage of just about every possible combination: blaxican (black-Mexican), Vietnamese-Mex, Korean-White-Mex, Japanese-Mexicans, Indian-Mex, Filipino-Mex (my cousins), Irish-German-Japanese-Mex (my niece), German-Mexicans (cousins), Italian-Mex, Colombian-Mex, etc, etc) So you're statement of racism against non-Spanish speakers doesn't add up (perhaps you've had very bad luck and have run into all the wrong types of Mexicans/Latinos, I don't know.)

Lastly, if what you say is true, it doesn't seem like your problem is Mexicans, but more the characteristic of people you've encountered in LA and the politics/policies/regulations of California. In that case, I think your best bet is definitely Denver, CO and/or Phoenix, AZ metros. Both, btw, have a strong Mexican/Latino presence, but they don't have the Chicano and nationalist/activist history of the communities in Los Angeles. The Phoenix metro is larger than Denver (Phoenix approaches 5 million, while Denver's is less than Orange County (3million) at around 2.5mil), which is something to consider since you seem to likely heavily populated areas. Your concerns about the gun laws/taxes in Colorado, feel exaggerated IMO (my best friend's boyfriend collects rifles and he is in no hurry to get out of CO), as Colorado is still much more laissez faire than California (though, not as crazy as Nevada). Colorado, overall, comes off to me as a marriage between Midwestern values and Western politics and tolerance. Someone in CD once described Denver as mix between Phoenix and Minneapolis, and I actually think that is pretty accurate.

Arizona, on the other hand, feels like a cultural/political island. Like, if it weren't for the geography/climate (both which I love...it is a beautiful place), I wouldn't hesitate calling it a Southern State in mindset, along with the typical Northern transplants you find in other sunbelt states. Then again...I hear Atlanta actually has a lot going for it culturally, and I'm not sure many can agree with that about Phoenix. Having spent time in both, the Denver metro (though smaller) feels slightly more hustle and bustle, more urban, than Phoenix.

I think in terms of lifestyle/quality of life, the main question I would ask myself if I were you is if you would rather deal with a Denver winter (it does sometimes get below 0) or a Phoenix Summer (often above 100F, though dry)? Personally, I choose Denver...but the microbrew beer and pro-weed culture are large motivators for me (lol). Otherwise, as you are a mountain man like myself, let me tell you that both have beautiful scenic surroundings worth exploring. I give a slight edge to Denver due to the extensiveness of the Rockies.

Another option to throw out there (if you can deal with some humidity) is Atlanta (Atlanta's Best Hiking Trails - Our Top 10 Favorite Hikes). Atlanta, has nature, it is diverse and cosmopolitan (with a Southern flair) and it shares that LA feature of having large suburban tracts close to its urban core. Houston shouldn't even be in your radar. It is hella FLAT!

Best of luck!

P.S. This isn't about being PC, but just about liberating yourself from the shackles of ignorance: no one on the West Coast or Southwest would call Latinos/Mexicans/Central Americans 'Spanish' that is a typical East Coast thing to do. The only non-Spanish Latinos that refer to themselves as Spanish are Puerto-Ricans and, more rarely, Dominicans and Cubans. Again, these groups are pre-dominantly East Coast. The Southwest has a history of people of Spanish descent, and therefore to them Spanish means exactly that Spanish (European), not Latino, not Mexican. Also, no Mexican (unless they were proudly Criollo, which I have some great aunts/uncles who consider themselves that) would ever call themselves Spanish, anymore than any true American would call themselves English. Both Americans and Mexicans acknowledge the cultural and historical links to England and Spain, respectively, but both groups are too fiercely proud of their independence to associate themselves with their ex-colonizers in such a fashion (something Canadians wouldn't understand, LOL.)


I donīt understand why mexican and puerto rican people say that they are "spanish", and not puerto rican or mexican or colombian or brasilian,...or whatever. i am from spain and was very shocking that people tell me that i am spaniard not spanish


We are very different, race, culture, ....obviously they were our former colonies but they have developed their own culture, music, food..... now,

france and Portugal had colonies too ,and people from brazil or Senegal donīt call themselves portuguese or french

Puerto rican people have african and native roots too, and african culture is very important too, i mean, that your culture is african too, that this is puerto rico spanish+ african+native, only spain is spanish

the same with mexican people, that forget his indigenous roots, when they are full indigenous blood or have a very Little of spanish blood, mestizo race is when one parent is White and the other is amerindian, that is not the case of the mexican people and after 500 years the blood is diluting(disappiering- i do not know the exactly Word- sorry about my english)

please donīt mistake usa people
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Old 01-02-2015, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Buena Park, Orange County, California
1,426 posts, read 1,888,038 times
Reputation: 1494
Quote:
Originally Posted by Medieval ballad View Post
I donīt understand why mexican and puerto rican people say that they are "spanish", and not puerto rican or mexican or colombian or brasilian,...or whatever. i am from spain and was very shocking that people tell me that i am spaniard not spanish


We are very different, race, culture, ....obviously they were our former colonies but they have developed their own culture, music, food..... now,

france and Portugal had colonies too ,and people from brazil or Senegal donīt call themselves portuguese or french

Puerto rican people have african and native roots too, and african culture is very important too, i mean, that your culture is african too, that this is puerto rico spanish+ african+native, only spain is spanish

the same with mexican people, that forget his indigenous roots, when they are full indigenous blood or have a very Little of spanish blood, mestizo race is when one parent is White and the other is amerindian, that is not the case of the mexican people and after 500 years the blood is diluting(disappiering- i do not know the exactly Word- sorry about my english)

please donīt mistake usa people
Did you read my post, or are just quoting it for fun? I just went over how Mexicans (not one that I know of, and I know many) never call themselves or consider themselves Spanish people. If anything, it is the opposite, and a Mexican (read: mestizo) is more likely to ignore his/her Spanish (European) ancestry, and consider themselves Native American. It is exactly because of this that California had the growth of Chicano nationalist movements (RAZA/MECHA etc) that linked themselves to local Native Americans (like the Gabrielenos, whose language is actually from the Uto-Aztecan family) and Aztlan (the imagined homeland of the Mexica/Aztecs before they migrated south to Teotihuacan (now Mexico City)). Even within Mexico, the Mexican is a prideful one (I don't do nationalism, so isn't a characteristic I share), and to them Spanish = oppressor, the conquistador, etc...not something or someone you want to be. If we did, do you think personalities like Hidalgo, Emiliano Zapata and Benito Juarez would be as widely celebrated as they are? Or even just look at the national symbol, la virgen of Guadalupe. She is brown and represents the people, the mestizo...not the Spanish, or the indigenous, but the mixed, la raza cosmica.

As to Puerto Ricans? I'm not sure why they call themselves 'Spanish'. You should ask one.
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Old 01-02-2015, 04:02 PM
 
Location: Houston, Texas
368 posts, read 400,523 times
Reputation: 463
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeavinLA1989 View Post
I am thinking Phoenix (and Scottsdale, Mesa, Tempe etc.), and perhaps DFW and Houston. I don't mind heat but hate crazy humidity.
I'm a native of Houston, but I did live in Phoenix for several years. I prefer Houston in most ways. With that being said, I don't mind humidity; it is the extreme heat of Phoenix that truly bothered me. As a Californian, you may be more comfortable in Phoenix, provided you can tolerate the summers. In addition, we don't have anything resembling mountains in Houston. However, if you prefer lush greenery, then Houston would be the better option.

Both cities have their own similarities to LA. All three cities are located in subtropical climates, and can grow palm trees. Houston's diversity is very similar to that of Los Angeles. Also, Houston and LA's downtown skylines are astonishingly similar in size. Both cities have mild temperatures, being located near coasts.

Phoenix shares a more similar topography to LA, with mountains. The architecture in both Phoenix and LA are more similar as well (stucco and red tile roofs). Culturally, I would say that Arizona is pretty similar to California. However, Phoenix is arguably the least urban large city in the United States. It is kind of like a random grid of suburbs in the middle of the Sonoran Desert. It is generally not as humid as states located further east, however, there is some humidity during the summer monsoon season.
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