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There's an argument that says Maryland/DC are so by tranplants that it has ceased to be Southern. I can see the argument. But how does a large transplant population and lots of new suburbs "transfer" it to the Northeast when the Northeast isn't characterized by these things?
So, the New York metro area is not characterized by a huge transplant population and lots of suburban growth?
It is for sure southern... people on here only think of the south as Georgia, Mississippi and Alabama... there is way more to the south than those 3 states.
This made no sense. I'm pretty sure people still consider the Carolinas to be the south because they are still southern as hell. Same with Virginia, even though its less southern. The only states that people don't see as really being southern is Maryland and Deleware. DC isn't a state, but also that included.
Usually, people from up north say DC and Md is down south, but people from down south say DC and Md is up north, so I guess it is best to ask people from DC and Md what they think. They will probably say neither tho.
Usually, people from up north say DC and Md is down south, but people from down south say DC and Md is up north, so I guess it is best to ask people from DC and Md what they think. They will probably say neither tho.
Not everyone from up north says DC and MD is the south. Same with Deleware, my ex from Jersey didn't think MD or DC was the south. Neither did another guy I dated back in high school who went to boarding school in Massachusetts too. Although Virginia for all of them was without question the south.
^ Yeah I know. That's why I said usually. You have to be farther north than Delaware or certain parts of New Jersey to notice the change. None of this means anyone is saying DC and MD is Dixie, just a little south of the northeastern states.
????
DC is not even at historical population peak, unlike NYC for example. What other major Southern city is not anyway? Just so you know, DC actually lost population up until the latest census, and is like 150,000 people away from 1950s population.
Here is some stats for you:
1980
Washington DC 638,000
Boston 562,000
2014:
Washington DC 658,000
Boston 646,000
Nevermind comparing it to NYC (one of the few Northern cities above peak pop), DC would probably need 900,000 people within city limits to have comparable rates peak vs current population.
Yes, DC is growing very fast, but its a fairly recent phenomenon.
Interesting that Boston is 646K when DC was the same population back in 2013. Boston's definitely catching up with DC it seems, both cities are practically similar in geographic and population size.
Yes, it absolutely WAS very Southern until pretty recently. The SE portion of the District and the farther out suburbs/exurbs remain so. Metro D.C. has commuters from the Panhandle of WV.
You need to brush up a little on your history, and perhaps dispense with your pre-conceived anti-Southern biases.
DC never really was THAT Southern to begin with. It's history and demographic patterns are too complicated to pinpoint to a specific region. There was always a large Black population (both freed and slaves) since even before DC's inception (Georgetown had a decent Black presence) and well as before the Great Migration when DC as well as cities to our north got even Blacker (Baltimore, Wilmington, and Philadelphia for example). Also, unknown to most people not from the DMV, ethnic enclaves are definitely not a recent phenomenon to DC. Prior to some of the Horn of African, Caribbean, and Latino enclaves that are common in DC now, there used to be a significant plethora of ethnic European enclaves in the City from the 1840s to as recent as the 1960s and a few holdovers during the 1970s with neighborhoods that were Irish, Welsh, German, European Jewish, Italian, Polish, Greek, Czech, etc. or a mix of all of the aforementioned (Southwest DC for example). Outside of New Orleans, hardly any Southern cities come to mind when I think of ethnic European enclaves. Sure, nowadays some Southern cities are receiving immigrants from Africa, the Middle East/West Asia, East Asia, South Asia, and Latin America and they're establishing their own enclaves in those cities, but that's not really a Southern phenomenon as the same thing is going on non-Southern cities/metro areas like New York, LA, Philly, DC, Boston, Oakland, Chicago, Minneapolis, Baltimore, San Francisco, etc.
Some might say DC's "lack of industry" automatically makes it Southern, but that's not necessarily true. Particularly since DC did had and still has some industrial areas and neighborhoods that have somewhat of an industrial character (for example, the Mayfair, NoMa, Carver-Langston, Kenilworth, Gateway, and Ivy City neighborhoods in Northeast or Navy Yard and the southern fringes of Capitol Hill in Southeast) and also, some Southern cities had and still have industry as well such as Atlanta, Birmingham, Jacksonville, Richmond, Mobile, Biloxi, Houston, Norfolk, etc. So industry isn't necessarily a Northern phenomenon either.
A majority of DC's built environment wouldn't really leave a lot of people with the impression that it looks like a typical Southern city. Southeast on both sides of the Anacostia has some of those elements but it's hardly overpowering. It's country somewhat but you'll find country parts in Northeastern, Midwestern, Southern, and Western cities as well. DC's overall built environment to me is like an amalgamation of Philadelphia, Chicago, Baltimore, Richmond, and a small touch of Boston.
I haven't even gotten to linguistics, mentality, culture, metro area, etc. yet or the rest of Maryland in general but I have things to take care of right now. Suffice it to say, there is a Southern undercurrent here in the DMV but there's also a potent Northern embodiment as well. Always has been, which shouldn't be surprising to either you or other posters on here regardless of what they think of the region's geographic affiliation.
100% New York it is not (few similarities I can think of are both are apartment cities but got a helluva lot of rowhouses, eccentric street fashion, cocky attitude, had their share of European immigrants, competitive job market, high COL, extensive public transit, uneasy relationship with gentrification, very diverse metro areas, love to jaywalk and yes, I'm guilty of that too lol, and we love our car horns)....But 100% ATL it is not either (few similarities that come to mind are both have been heavily instrumental to Black American History from music and literature to art and science to politics and architecture, both have the best Black nightlife experiences in the country if not the whole continent, both overall metro areas are abundant in HBCUs, flamboyant character among the born and bred locals, decently diverse in the inner city but even more diverse in the suburbs, and we still get stigmatized every now and then on being very "dangerous" cities). Regardless of whatever region it's grouped in with other than the Mid-Atlantic (which can be deemed more or less as a subregion of the Northeast like New England), the DMV has always done its own thing. I really wouldn't wholeheartedly call this cultural shift "recent" at all.
My personal observation from the several times I've been there ...Maryland has never seemed "south". Baltimore and Annapolis (both old cities) don't feel southern to me and the state seems to culturally be more eastern coastal seaboard than southern -- probably because of the Chesapeake Bay. Crossing from Pennsylvania is not that noticeable and Philadelphia has a pretty dominant metro influence. Crossing into Virginia seems more obviously southern but still not like the deep south.
This. Around here, "The South" is at least 30 miles south of Fredericksburg, VA. I personally find it exciting that another different region of the country is practically near our backyard
While a lot of Northern segregation was de facto (if not outright illegal, but still happened regardless), that wasn't always the case. States like Kansas and Wyoming had de jure segregation laws regarding education well into the 20th century (if I remember correctly, Wyoming's law was any school district that had fifteen or more non-white students had to open their own separate school)
Because there is no accent there I guess, plus everyone continues to forget the history, besides the footprint of the central government, in the DC/MD area. Everyone knows it is a border area between the north and south, or at least should.
Some people can't tell if they are north or south or feel like they are in both, or just feel like it is a unique area unto itself.
Why do we continue to have threads about DC and Maryland so much on here? Get off their tip already.
Why do people continue to think both DC and all of Maryland don't have accents? There's a lot of transplants living in New York, Boston, Houston, and Atlanta but you can still hear local accents in those cities.
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