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Cleveland's defined MSA not (CSA) was bypassed by Cincinnati
and now Columbus is on track to bypass Cleveland and eventually Cincinnati if things stay the current track.
Love all three areas and I want them all to grow and prosper. Just curious if this is unique to Ohio since it has so many areas that are close in population? Thanks
Question for you; is it really a foregone conclusion among all Ohioans that Cleveland is the state's top metropolis/city?
Don't know about you but I think there would be an even number of people outside of Ohio that view Cincinnati and Columbus as highly, perhaps some view either and/or both more highly than Cleveland. No?
At least in my lifetime, Cleveland has always been viewed as the top dog of the state. Recently though, Cincinnati has seemed to take the top spot for jobs and Columbus seems to be barreling ahead, to bypass both of them in terms of Jobs and population. Columbus is still called cowtown and has Ohio after it's name. Soon though cowtown will be larger than Cleveland and I am curious if this has happened in other states.
At least in my lifetime, Cleveland has always been viewed as the top dog of the state. Recently though, Cincinnati has seemed to take the top spot for jobs and Columbus seems to be barreling ahead, to bypass both of them in terms of Jobs and population. Columbus is still called cowtown and has Ohio after it's name. Soon though cowtown will be larger than Cleveland and I am curious if this has happened in other states.
Yeah California, Texas, and Florida.
In the 19th century (1800s) San Francisco was by large the premier city of California and by the 20th century (1900s) Los Angeles had supplanted it as California's premier city. In the 1800s San Antonio was by large the premier city of Texas and by the 20th century both Houston and Dallas supplanted it. In Florida, Miami wasn't even top two or three cities in the state in the 19th century and for at least half of the 20th century before supplanting the places ahead of it down the stretch in the 20th century and continuing onward into the 21st.
Question for you; is it really a foregone conclusion among all Ohioans that Cleveland is the state's top metropolis/city?
Don't know about you but I think there would be an even number of people outside of Ohio that view Cincinnati and Columbus as highly, perhaps some view either and/or both more highly than Cleveland. No?
Cool thread
I can't remember for sure, but I thought there was a point where Clevelands MSA included Akron and was close to 3 million. I know Akron is it's own MSA nowadays. I think when you add it's media market together (CSA) It's still the largest population center.
In terms of city influence at one point Cleveland had over 900k people (1950) Obviously Cleveland has been battling shrinkage for decades but back before suburbanization it was by far the largest city in the state. Columbus has sunbelt style growth and a land area almost triple the size of both Cincinnati and Cleveland. I do think Cleveland is still viewed by a lot of people as the states primary city.
I can't remember for sure, but I thought there was a point where Clevelands MSA included Akron and was close to 3 million. I know Akron is it's own MSA nowadays. I think when you add it's media market together (CSA) It's still the largest population center.
In terms of city influence at one point Cleveland had over 900k people (1950) Obviously Cleveland has been battling shrinkage for decades but back before suburbanization it was by far the largest city in the state. Columbus has sunbelt style growth and a land area almost triple the size of both Cincinnati and Cleveland. I do think Cleveland is still viewed by a lot of people as the states primary city.
You're right in that Cleveland's CSA is well ahead of the game as far as Ohio is concerned but I feel that is only temporary. We're moving closer to the 2023 census redefinition and by then the Cincinnati-Dayton corridor will be good for merger (now that the core county rule has been thrown out, this area is barely missing the official 15% link and will have it by 2023) unless something drastic happens and it begins declining.
The merger of Cincinnati and Dayton will put that combined CSA at 3.3 million, only a hair behind Cleveland's 3.5 million and Cincinnati is experiencing more robust growth conditions, so the gap will narrow and will pull them ahead under this case scenario over Cleveland.
On a CSA basis, Columbus is still quite a long way off. I believe Columbus CSA is something like 2.3 million people and Cleveland is at 3.5 million. Substantial gap but Columbus has the growth rates to keep chipping away at the gap and begin closing in. Maybe a few decades down the line it'll match or exceed.
For now though, in the present, Cleveland seems to be Ohio's top dog but that hold is not assuring to say the least.
In the 19th century (1800s) San Francisco was by large the premier city of California and by the 20th century (1900s) Los Angeles had supplanted it as California's premier city. In the 1800s San Antonio was by large the premier city of Texas and by the 20th century both Houston and Dallas supplanted it. In Florida, Miami wasn't even top two or three cities in the state in the 19th century and for at least half of the 20th century before supplanting the places ahead of it down the stretch in the 20th century and continuing onward into the 21st.
Cool, thanks. Seems like Ohio is now the 21st century state to join this club.
Cleveland's defined MSA not (CSA) was bypassed by Cincinnati
and now Columbus is on track to bypass Cleveland and eventually Cincinnati if things stay the current track.
Love all three areas and I want them all to grow and prosper. Just curious if this is unique to Ohio since it has so many areas that are close in population? Thanks
In addition to the other states mentioned, you're starting to see this in Missouri. St. Louis was traditionally the larger and more important city over Kansas City, but KC proper is now bigger than STL proper, although STL still has the larger MSA and CSA. KC is growing faster though.
In NC, The Triangle and its (now) two separate components: Raleigh & Durham MSAs had played third fiddle in the state to the Triad and its (now) two separate components: Greensboro & Winston-Salem MSAs. It's only in the last few decades that the Triangle and its components have surged past the Triad. While it would take some analysis to compare the two former MSAs and now CSAs over time because their designations changed, the shift has been quite dramatic and rather rapid.
Raleigh, in particular, has been the main driver of this change. Since 1950, Raleigh has moved from being the 5th largest city in NC to being solidly the second largest city in the state by quite a large margin. As late as 1980s, Raleigh was still the third largest city in the state. Now it leads NCs 3rd largest city (Greensboro) by more than 150,000 in municipal population alone and its core county (Wake) leads Greensboro's (Guilford) by over 486,000. To put that in context, consider that Guilford County had nearly 16,000 more residents than Wake County as recently as 1980.
Today the only way to compare apples to apples without calculating the pre-2003 MSA designations is to look at the CSAs. The Triangle was 2,075,126 as of last July while the Triad was 1,630,368. I'm guessing that the Triad was larger than the Triangle as recently as sometime in the 90s but I'm not certain.
**Actually....I just found this from the 2000 Census when the two metros were still singular MSAs. The Triad was still larger than the Triangle as of that Census. http://www.census.gov/population/cen...c-t3/tab03.txt
I always thought Columbus and Cincinnati were a lot smaller than they actually are and never realized how close they were in population to Cleveland.
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