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Old 04-25-2015, 08:09 AM
 
Location: SC
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My question is, if independence is gained, would you still depend on Canada and/or America for, trade (and what does Quebec have to trade - that does not belong to Canada?), economic support, national defense, jobs, public health, any other things currently supplied by Canada or the US?

Here are a couple articles I found...

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repor...ticle17529502/
http://news.nationalpost.com/full-co...defence-policy

Last edited by blktoptrvl; 04-25-2015 at 08:38 AM..
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Old 04-25-2015, 08:18 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Desert_SW_77 View Post
Evidently, you cared enough about it to open the thread and post here.
ok.
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Old 04-25-2015, 11:40 AM
 
Location: M I N N E S O T A
14,800 posts, read 17,721,222 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonjour185 View Post
What do American people think about Québec independence.

Some background:

We were conquered by the empire of the British in the 1700's. They deported many who went to Louisiana and became called «Cajuns». They tried to wipe out the culture of the rest of, and this includes the Canadian government that inherited British empire lands in North America. In Québec we survived as the lower class (85% of the population) ruled by the British/English Canadians.

We want to be a republic like the USA. Canada is a monarchy with a European monarch at the head of state, the English Queen, and we do not want it. The USA is the land of the free and a strong model for success, this is something that enough credit is not given in to. I am interested in American thought because Americans are reputed for supporting free people and self determination. We desire to a closer alliance with the Americans and enjoy having such good neighbours. We also envision a Québec that is peaceful like a Norway or Switzerland. We have come far since the start of our movement in the 1960's but fell short of independence. In 1995 during our second indepandance vote (the first was in 1980, we lost 60-40), 61% of Québecois voted for independence, but of course the people who conquered us voted too and so this shifted the independence vote to 49.5% to 50.5%. An independent Québec will be the 29th largest economy in the world, 20th largest country in the world, and have a living standard similar to UK and Finland.
What makes a republic more better than a monarchy?

and don't Canadian provinces have more autonomy than American states?
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Old 04-25-2015, 11:46 AM
 
Location: Toronto
12,581 posts, read 11,141,644 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCityDreamer View Post
South Louisiana is much too American to ever be separated from the United States.

Quebec is like 100 times more different from the rest of Canada than south Louisiana is from the rest of the United States.
Oddly enough it was someone from South Louisiana who tabled 'liberation' from the U.S not me so perhaps you should take the comment up with that guy from New Orleans.. It is an interesting thought however, what if certain regions within the nation did develop into the 'like 100 times more different from the rest of the U.S' that is your requirement to be something distinct, it would be interesting to see how the U.S would approach and engage such an entity.

As for differences between Quebec and the rest of Canada - sure there are.. We value allowing differences within the union but to a certain extent of course (as pretty much every other nation would includind other western nations).. Doesn't mean separation is the best answer.. There are plenty of nations in the world where there are autonomous regions if you will even with autonomous powers, doesn't mean a hard split is the best option (Catalonia is a great example within Spain for instance with such distinction from the Rest of Spain yet is still a part of Spain).. Support for separation ebbs and flows but over the history of the movement since the 70's it has maintained a less than 50 percent support. There is the occasional spike but by and large it just isn't getting into consistent majority levels to even warrant a referendum let alone meet the criteria as defined by the Clarity Act.

The last referendum was 20 years ago.. there is far from being any push from Quebecers these days to even hold a referendum let alone enter negotiations with he R.O.C for separation. Essentially what I'm saying is - I wouldn't hold my breath for an independant Quebec anytime soon. You have at most 3.5 million people of 8 million people in Quebec actually wanting separation and this has and is always the biggest challenge of the movement - getting a good solid number of Quebecer in solid majority territory that actually want it on a consistent basis..

Last edited by fusion2; 04-25-2015 at 12:21 PM..
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Old 04-25-2015, 12:07 PM
 
Location: Toronto
12,581 posts, read 11,141,644 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iNviNciBL3 View Post
What makes a republic more better than a monarchy?

and don't Canadian provinces have more autonomy than American states?
This is a great point.. I can't think of any sub entity within the U.S or Canada that gets more autonomy than Quebec does (Puerto Rico perhaps)... If i'm wrong than i'm happy to be called out on it..

As for the monarch in Canada - the Queen is Canada's Head of State HOS which is vastly a ceremonial/figurehead role - she is about as weak a HOS in any system, the real power is our Head of Goverments in Canada includes the Prime Minister of the country and the Premiers (Governors) of our Provinces.. The Queens relation as HOS has only to do with Canada anyway - nothing to do with the UK.. Everything else is just history/tradition and nothing more in any practical sense. Canada shares far more in common in practically every way with the U.S than it does with the UK in 2015. The U.S holds far more influence over our nation than any other by a loong shot. Heck China is becoming more important to Canada in practical terms than The UK and even the Queen in her role as Canada's HOS.. Thats right, what Xi Xinping decides with respect to Canada is felt more than the Queens Christmas well wishes..

Last edited by fusion2; 04-25-2015 at 12:24 PM..
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Old 04-25-2015, 03:04 PM
 
Location: M I N N E S O T A
14,800 posts, read 17,721,222 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fusion2 View Post
This is a great point.. I can't think of any sub entity within the U.S or Canada that gets more autonomy than Quebec does (Puerto Rico perhaps)... If i'm wrong than i'm happy to be called out on it..

As for the monarch in Canada - the Queen is Canada's Head of State HOS which is vastly a ceremonial/figurehead role - she is about as weak a HOS in any system, the real power is our Head of Goverments in Canada includes the Prime Minister of the country and the Premiers (Governors) of our Provinces.. The Queens relation as HOS has only to do with Canada anyway - nothing to do with the UK.. Everything else is just history/tradition and nothing more in any practical sense. Canada shares far more in common in practically every way with the U.S than it does with the UK in 2015. The U.S holds far more influence over our nation than any other by a loong shot. Heck China is becoming more important to Canada in practical terms than The UK and even the Queen in her role as Canada's HOS.. Thats right, what Xi Xinping decides with respect to Canada is felt more than the Queens Christmas well wishes..
That would be the only legit reason i could think of, is an English Canadian government calling all the shots in Quebec but it seems like they have plenty of say of what goes on in their own province so i don't see the big deal, now it just falls on the culture/lifestyle and language thing... but what is wrong with living in the same country with people who might have a slightly different lifestyle and speak a different language? Seems kind of intolerant to want to live in a different country because you don't want to be part of some people because of their lifestyle and language.
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Old 04-25-2015, 08:38 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,947 posts, read 27,360,351 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fusion2 View Post
As for the monarch in Canada - the Queen is Canada's Head of State HOS which is vastly a ceremonial/figurehead role - she is about as weak a HOS in any system, the real power is our Head of Goverments in Canada includes the Prime Minister of the country and the Premiers (Governors) of our Provinces.. The Queens relation as HOS has only to do with Canada anyway - nothing to do with the UK.. Everything else is just history/tradition and nothing more in any practical sense. Canada shares far more in common in practically every way with the U.S than it does with the UK in 2015. The U.S holds far more influence over our nation than any other by a loong shot. Heck China is becoming more important to Canada in practical terms than The UK and even the Queen in her role as Canada's HOS.. Thats right, what Xi Xinping decides with respect to Canada is felt more than the Queens Christmas well wishes..
I broadly agree. Also in any event the monarchy is hardly a key issue in the whole Canada vs. Quebec debate anyway.
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Old 04-25-2015, 08:42 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,947 posts, read 27,360,351 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iNviNciBL3 View Post
.. but what is wrong with living in the same country with people who might have a slightly different lifestyle and speak a different language? Seems kind of intolerant to want to live in a different country because you don't want to be part of some people because of their lifestyle and language.
That question can actually be put to both sides though.

And taking it one step further, if anything there are certainly more people in the rest of Canada (Anglo-Canada if you will) opposed to a different lifestyle and language in Quebec, than there are people in Quebec who are opposed to the rest of Canada having a different lifestyle and language from them.

To be quite honest, nobody in Quebec gives a damn about how people live and what language they speak in Ontario or Alberta.

You couldn't draw flies to an online forum in French that discusses ''how people in Ontario are'' or ''how people in Alberta'' are, but open a thread on Quebec in English and tons of people from all over Canada will chime in with their views on Quebec, what it is, and what it should be.
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Old 04-26-2015, 09:14 PM
 
Location: Canada
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
That question can actually be put to both sides though.

And taking it one step further, if anything there are certainly more people in the rest of Canada (Anglo-Canada if you will) opposed to a different lifestyle and language in Quebec, than there are people in Quebec who are opposed to the rest of Canada having a different lifestyle and language from them.

To be quite honest, nobody in Quebec gives a damn about how people live and what language they speak in Ontario or Alberta.

You couldn't draw flies to an online forum in French that discusses ''how people in Ontario are'' or ''how people in Alberta'' are, but open a thread on Quebec in English and tons of people from all over Canada will chime in with their views on Quebec, what it is, and what it should be.
That said, people in the ROC (Rest of Canada) also do not oppose Quebec being Francophone and they don't want to assimilate it, quite honestly its distinctiveness is embraced and uncontroversial, as is the widespread belief that is indeed distinct. The real conflicts are between linguistic groups in the province, much less so between the province and other Canadian jurisdictions. I'd say that Anglos from other provinces think little of Quebec and are not opposed to it being different, but many have a negative impression as they understand little about it if from far away and often are only exposed to it through people like Gilles Duceppe, for whom driving wedges was a job description.
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Old 04-26-2015, 09:15 PM
 
2,326 posts, read 947,839 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonjour185 View Post
What do American people think about Québec independence.
We don't think about it.
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