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Who said anything about the importance of Maryland? What I think about Maryland is irrelevant to the thread at hand. I just find that people's best argument so far is "You think so and so state isn't Northeastern so therefore you have no credibility". What they forget is A) this thread is satire, and B) they don't know what I think about a particular state, they just assume I think a certain way because I see things they don't, but that's not the discussion.
The Northeast is agreed upon as not having a set culture or even standard of living, that's my point. If people want to argue for the NE status of certain states, that's on them but it is ironic when they get butthurt at someone else doing the same thing. They feel they're the only ones who get to redefine the region, apparently.
Apparently I'm not the only one who sees potential in Ohio being Northeastern. But hey, let's pretend there aren't people who are so keen on protecting their precious region from outsiders despite the fact that they are, in fact, probably about as Northeastern as Ohioans.
I think people on this site often interpret "The Northeast" or even the whole East Coast to mean the Bos-Wash megalopolis, which is not the case. Northeast probably would include a bigger region than what most people on this site say, but the Boston-NYC-Philadelphia-Baltimore-DC corridor is a relatively small region with not even all parts of their respective states included.
I think this is where the confusion lies when people start claiming that Ohio, West Virginia, etc. are "The Northeast".
I think people on this site often interpret "The Northeast" or even the whole East Coast to mean the Bos-Wash megalopolis, which is not the case. Northeast probably would include a bigger region than what most people on this site say, but the Boston-NYC-Philadelphia-Baltimore-DC corridor is a relatively small region with not even all parts of their respective states included.
I think this is where the confusion lies when people start claiming that Ohio, West Virginia, etc. are "The Northeast".
And that's fine, but the same people who love arguing FOR the Northeast status of whatever state/city are the same ones getting mad at the existence of this thread. The East Coast Megalopolis is united by one thing: a freaking train. Not culture, not demographics, not linguistics, not food, not income (look at Bmore for crying out loud), not religion, and if you were to argue for maybe one thing, it would be that all of these 5 cities are heavily Democrat, but find me a major city that isn't heavily Democrat. Their histories are all different, their architecture is different (triple deckers vs brownstones vs trinity houses/row houses), and their people are all different.
If someone's argument to define the Northeast is based on a train running through 5 major cities, this thread serves as a more thorough case for another state being included using more concrete data, not just "we're all close to each other lolz"
And that's fine, but the same people who love arguing FOR the Northeast status of whatever state/city are the same ones getting mad at the existence of this thread. The East Coast Megalopolis is united by one thing: a freaking train. Not culture, not demographics, not linguistics, not food, not income (look at Bmore for crying out loud), not religion, and if you were to argue for maybe one thing, it would be that all of these 5 cities are heavily Democrat, but find me a major city that isn't heavily Democrat. Their histories are all different, their architecture is different (triple deckers vs brownstones vs trinity houses/row houses), and their people are all different.
If someone's argument to define the Northeast is based on a train running through 5 major cities, this thread serves as a more thorough case for another state being included using more concrete data, not just "we're all close to each other lolz"
It's united by the fact that it's a megalopolis and the only true one in the country-not just "a train".
The Baltimore suburbs (and some parts of the city) are actually VERY wealthy, and is more expensive than most metros in the country.
Honestly, it seems this is what people are really trying to latch onto when they argue so extensively to be included in "The Northeast". Dismiss it as just "5 large cities close to one another", but it still is unique in this country.
The only thing that keeps Cleveland from being a true Northeastern city is rowhouses. If it had rowhouses, it would be a sure lock as a Northeastern city on City-Data (and a high COL, I suppose).
Demographically, it's more much more Northeastern than Baltimore and DC (Italian + Irish + Jewish + Polish).
Cleveland - 26.69% of MSA (37.01% of NHW population)
Baltimore - 19.98% of MSA (33.78% of NHW population)
Washington - 14.25% of MSA (30.42% of NHW population)
Not sure what more it has to do to be a part of Club Northeast. People are being hypocritical and saying that an arbitrary state line determines regional boundaries. The Ohio-Pennsylvania border is as arbitrary in determining "Northeasterness" as the Pennsylvania-Maryland border.
Honestly, it seems this is what people are really trying to latch onto when they argue so extensively to be included in "The Northeast". Dismiss it as just "5 large cities close to one another", but it still is unique in this country.
But many people would say it's only three large cities in the Northeast. Demographically, Cleveland has more in common with Philly, Pittsburgh and NYC than DC and Baltimore do. And unlike those latter cities, Cleveland was never, ever a part of the South.
There are clearly linguistic and cultural border zones between the North and the South, for example, the southernmost counties of Ohio, Indiana, and Illinois; northern West Virginia; southern Maryland and the Delmarva Peninsula; the Missouri Ozark region. Similarly, there are border zones between the Northeast and Midwest. Western New York, western Pennsylvania, and northeastern Ohio are transitional areas. Similarly, areas like eastern Colorado, western Nebraska, and the Black Hills of South Dakota represent transition zones between the Midwest and West.
There is a clear distinction between a border area and the predominant influence. The overwhelming influence in Ohio, whether one talks about dialect, historical settlement patterns, economics, and ethnic populations, is Midwestern. New York and Pennsylvania are dominated by their respective seaboard cities, which are clearly East Coast, Pennsylvania less so than New York. Dialect wise, Western New York closely resembles rest of the Great Lakes area, while Pennsylvania is a mixture of East Coast, Appalachian, and Midwest, plus some unique urban dialects in the two largest cities. Ohio speech is clearly Midwestern, with the areas around Lake Erie having a Great Lakes pattern, the north and middle a North Midland pattern, and the southernmost counties a South Midland dialect with ties to Appalachia. Agriculture is far more important in Ohio than in New York or Pennsylvania. Ohio is politically a "purple" state, while New York and Pennsylvania are Democratic in Presidential elections. White Protestants are more prevalent numerically in Ohio than anywhere in the Northeast. In fact, southwestern Ohio is something of a mini Bible Belt. Ohio is where the Appalachians end and the Plains begin.
The Northeast-Midwest boundary is far more "fuzzy" than the American-Canadian boundary. You know immediately whether you are in Hamilton, Ontario or Buffalo, New York by accent, culture, and attitude. However, Ohio is as Midwestern as Ontario is Canadian.
Great, but have you actually spent time in Cleveland? Feels way more like other Midwestern cities than the first several NE representatives that come to mind. Regardless of racial make-up or whatever other stats you want to go dig up.
Great, but have you actually spent time in Cleveland? Feels way more like other Midwestern cities than the first several NE representatives that come to mind. Regardless of racial make-up or whatever other stats you want to go dig up.
Have you spent time in Baltimore? Cleveland can't feel any less Northeastern than Baltimore.
Quote:
To give you some background on Baltimore: it is a southern city below the Mason-Dixon line. Although there may be traffic flitting in from the interstates, it now finds a city armed and dangerous, drugged out with hopelessness and mindlessness, backs against the wall, a pace still of the South—of heat and the bead of sweat making its molasses-like way down the brow.
Although one might quickly connect it to the other major cities located to its northeast (Philadelphia, New York City, etc.), Baltimore has always had much more of a southern "feel" to it.
If "fast pace" and "attitude" are two defining characteristics of the Northeast, then neither are to be found in Baltimore. Besides, I doubt Pittsburgh is "fast paced" like New York City, but it's still a Northeastern city.
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