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Old 06-22-2015, 06:48 PM
 
Location: Bellingham, WA
9,745 posts, read 14,193,918 times
Reputation: 14796

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I've seen several posters mention that liberals want to live in predominantly liberal areas because they're unable to tolerate the viewpoints of others. I don't doubt that's true in some cases, but in my case it's hilariously inaccurate. The reason I kept my political views to myself in Tennessee was because I had seen how the conservatives there reacted when presented with an idea that wasn't in perfect agreement to their own. They absolutely could not handle it, and the offending person would be ostracized and mercilessly belittled whenever possible. There was absolutely zero respect for the viewpoints of others, and these were some of the most easily offended people I've ever met. I spent a solid decade tolerating the views of everyone around me, while also having no one with whom I could discuss my own beliefs. I was fully capable of discussing the issues rationally, but the others clearly could not do so without becoming extremely angry and hurt. At my current job, politics and social issues are discussed occasionally and I have never once witnessed any hurt feelings, anger, raised voices, etc. And these aren't all liberal people; several are both conservative and religious (not to mention a wide variety of other beliefs). But for whatever reason those things can actually be discussed here like adults. Quite the opposite of my experience in the South.

But that aside, why would anyone want to live in a place where they will always be shunned for their beliefs? Who would want to be faced with the choice of being oneself and shunned or faking it to fit in with people you know wouldn't respect you if they knew the truth? I mean, if that's what you want, more power to you, I just don't understand it myself.

And again, as others have mentioned, this sort of thing is far less likely in the larger cities.
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Old 06-22-2015, 07:07 PM
 
Location: Caverns measureless to man...
7,248 posts, read 4,681,608 times
Reputation: 16403
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
The vast majority of counties throughout the south are either "moist" though or have no alcohol sales restrictions whatsoever. "Dry" counties are very uncommon in most southern states.

OK, fine. Then I'll just go back to my original point, and stick with that and that alone. The vast majority of dry counties in the United States are found in the South, specifically in the Bible Belt where I live - the most ignorant, primitive, backwards backwater region of the entire United States. Now run along and find a map that disproves that. Or tries to deflect from it; whichever you prefer.
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Old 06-22-2015, 07:49 PM
 
Location: Caverns measureless to man...
7,248 posts, read 4,681,608 times
Reputation: 16403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lamplight View Post
I've seen several posters mention that liberals want to live in predominantly liberal areas because they're unable to tolerate the viewpoints of others. I don't doubt that's true in some cases, but in my case it's hilariously inaccurate.
Ah, that's just a standard conservative meme. Rush repeats it several times a day, and they think Rush is an incredibly smart guy, so they figure if they repeat it then they'll sound smart too. Best to just pat them on their heads for their cleverness and ignore them while they cackle.

For me, it's not a question of "viewpoints," because I rarely talk politics with anyone - people with whom I agree, or people with whom I disagree. It's pointless. The people I agree with already agree with me, and the people I don't agree with never will, so why waste the time? And anyway, people who do like talking about politics usually annoy me, because they tend to somehow be all frantically agitated and crushingly boring at the same time.

No... it's not about viewpoints; it's about policy - it's about what kind of a culture you live in (and raise your children in), and that is a reflection of the liberal/conservative ideological balance of the area where you live. I don't want to discuss politics with liberals any more than I do conservatives, but I do prefer to live in a state with a more liberal government, because their public policy priorities are generally more closely aligned with mine. Both parties want to either spend as much of my tax money as possible or give away as much of it as possible to their friends, and I tend to prefer the things that liberal governments spend the money on. Living in the south for 3 years has, for instance, hammered home to me the truly stunning difference between a state that considers education an investment in everyone's future as opposed to a state that considers education a waste of money, because you don't need no diploma to drive a tractor or dig coal.

So... yeah... if I "can't tolerate" living in a state where the high school graduates are some of the most poorly educated in the entire developed world, and where the adult illiteracy rate is higher than Zimbabwe or Bolivia, and most people here are not only OK with that but proud to live here, then OK. Call me "intolerant of other viewpoints," because you're damned right I'm not in agreement with those public policy priorities. And I'm damned proud not to "tolerate" that.

So if you're talking about the differences between north and south (as this thread is), that's got to be part of the conversation. Because if people are thinking of moving to a southern state, they need to be aware of what they might be getting themselves into. This... slowness... just permeates every aspect of your life down here, and you can't get away from it. If that, and some of the other differences that we've been discussing, are important to you, then no - perhaps you don't want to move here. People need to consider these issues in order to make an informed decision on where they're going to live.
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Old 06-22-2015, 09:08 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,930 posts, read 36,237,009 times
Reputation: 63576
Quote:
Originally Posted by Albert_The_Crocodile View Post
OK, fine. Then I'll just go back to my original point, and stick with that and that alone. The vast majority of dry counties in the United States are found in the South, specifically in the Bible Belt where I live - the most ignorant, primitive, backwards backwater region of the entire United States. Now run along and find a map that disproves that. Or tries to deflect from it; whichever you prefer.
Well, since I can't find any credible sources which pinpoint " ignorant, primitive, backwards backwater regions of the entire United States," I guess I'll leave that to you to prove. That's your claim, not mine.
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Old 06-22-2015, 10:18 PM
Status: "could've~would've~should've used 'have', not 'of'" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: A Yankee in northeast TN
10,507 posts, read 14,339,746 times
Reputation: 23369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lamplight View Post
I've seen several posters mention that liberals want to live in predominantly liberal areas because they're unable to tolerate the viewpoints of others. I don't doubt that's true in some cases, but in my case it's hilariously inaccurate. The reason I kept my political views to myself in Tennessee was because I had seen how the conservatives there reacted when presented with an idea that wasn't in perfect agreement to their own. They absolutely could not handle it, and the offending person would be ostracized and mercilessly belittled whenever possible. There was absolutely zero respect for the viewpoints of others, and these were some of the most easily offended people I've ever met. I spent a solid decade tolerating the views of everyone around me, while also having no one with whom I could discuss my own beliefs. I was fully capable of discussing the issues rationally, but the others clearly could not do so without becoming extremely angry and hurt. At my current job, politics and social issues are discussed occasionally and I have never once witnessed any hurt feelings, anger, raised voices, etc. And these aren't all liberal people; several are both conservative and religious (not to mention a wide variety of other beliefs). But for whatever reason those things can actually be discussed here like adults. Quite the opposite of my experience in the South.

But that aside, why would anyone want to live in a place where they will always be shunned for their beliefs? Who would want to be faced with the choice of being oneself and shunned or faking it to fit in with people you know wouldn't respect you if they knew the truth? I mean, if that's what you want, more power to you, I just don't understand it myself.

And again, as others have mentioned, this sort of thing is far less likely in the larger cities.
I really do question the type of people you must have spent time with.
I'm sorry but I don't see very much of that here where I am in TN. There is some intolerance, but I have also seen that in the midwest states I live in so I don't think that the south, or TN in particular, has more of a problem with this than many other places. I'm not exactly a traditional southern conservative type and I know my viewpoints are often in direct contrast to those of some of the people around me but it has NEVER caused issues like you describe. I get the feeling it 's not so much the place as it is the kinds of people you are around.
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Old 06-22-2015, 10:47 PM
 
Location: Bellingham, WA
9,745 posts, read 14,193,918 times
Reputation: 14796
Quote:
Originally Posted by DubbleT View Post
I really do question the type of people you must have spent time with.
I'm sorry but I don't see very much of that here where I am in TN. There is some intolerance, but I have also seen that in the midwest states I live in so I don't think that the south, or TN in particular, has more of a problem with this than many other places. I'm not exactly a traditional southern conservative type and I know my viewpoints are often in direct contrast to those of some of the people around me but it has NEVER caused issues like you describe. I get the feeling it 's not so much the place as it is the kinds of people you are around.
Maybe it's not as bad in eastern Tennessee? But yeah, I suppose it could have simply been the people I happened to work with, as well as most of our customers and most of the people I grew up with. Keep in mind it was very much a blue collar job, and often times people in those professions, when around their peers, are less likely to hide what they truly think. They held back quite a bit when strangers came around (until those strangers were out of earshot). Racial slurs were commonplace (I usually heard the 'n-word' at least a dozen times a day, from white people), and I once heard the owner of the company say, word for word, "I think all gays should be castrated". But those are simply my own anecdotes, and I've found a lot of folks refuse to believe people still act like that in the Southeast. And hey, if you like living there then you're probably better off not believing it. And yes, I'm quite sure things like that happen in every corner of the country, but they sure seemed to happen an awful lot where I lived in TN, and there seems to be a distinct lack of that sort of behavior where I live now. Oh I'm sure it happens in my current town, I just haven't yet witnessed it in the four years I've lived here. It was a daily occurrence in TN though.

Come to think of it, maybe those people just felt they could be themselves around me? That's actually something I've noticed; that people generally feel comfortable enough around me to drop whatever facade they may typically wear. Maybe that was the case and their 'true selves' were simply racist and homophobic.

Also, incidentally, this was all when I worked in my hometown, which was just outside of Nashville. When I worked in Nashville I never heard anything even remotely intolerant. It was like night and day.
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Old 06-23-2015, 10:44 AM
 
Location: Florida
5,927 posts, read 2,755,161 times
Reputation: 7164
Quote:
Originally Posted by Port Pitt Ash View Post
Pretty much this. Especially the fake it to fit in part.

As to the other poster listing Miami as part of the south I'd say most people don't consider FL part of the south. At least the southern part. Miami is easy if you're liberal, although there are other issues down there.

There are a lot of FL transplants here.
A lot of us in Florida don't consider ourselves "Southerners". It's not disrespect but it's a very different culture down here. We have a saying that says the farther south you go in Florida the more "Northern" it gets!
Go to a Miami Dolphins-NY Jets game and half of the fans will be rooting for the Jets. A lot of Florida was developed by Yankees in developers Henry Flagler & Henry Plant.
When I think of Southerners I think of grits, rednecks, trailer parks, Guns and the Confederate flag. As for Miami it is quite Liberal.
I remember visiting a relative in Orlando and we passed a town east of Orlando called Bithlo which was full of trailer parks and they commented "That is where the Rednecks live".
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Old 06-23-2015, 12:52 PM
 
5,694 posts, read 8,768,844 times
Reputation: 4923
Well that's a relief to realize this didn't happen in E TN - if it did I would ask you the name of the place so I could boycott it. I can't stand bullying wherever it comes from.
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Old 06-23-2015, 01:11 PM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
5,746 posts, read 3,210,620 times
Reputation: 7190
Absolutely a liberal can be happy in the South.

I'm definitely more left-leaning that right, and I love living in the South. I'm originally from Canada, which can be considered to be like a confederation of solidly blue states (various shades of blue, albeit, with some sprinkles of purple). I then lived in a Midwest state before moving to TN, and I found people there, though they mostly self-identified as liberal, more closed-minded and conservative in many ways than I find people in TN to be.

Liberals can be every bit as intolerant as conservatives can, so I no longer think that a so-called "liberal" place is a better fit. The South isn't perfect, but neither is anywhere else, and it suits me just fine.
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Old 06-23-2015, 01:33 PM
 
Location: Albany, NY
35 posts, read 48,695 times
Reputation: 41
I'm more conservative than most people and I live in the Northeast. I'm pretty happy here. I'd assume a liberal could be happy in the South.
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