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Old 09-24-2018, 03:17 PM
 
Location: On the Great South Bay
7,131 posts, read 9,898,127 times
Reputation: 6423

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tusco View Post
The reason the Census Bureau Mid-Atlantic gets lumped with the Northeast despite it specifically being called the Mid-Atlantic because it's in-between the North Atlantic (New England) and South Atlantic is so there wouldn't be two ridiculously small regions while the other three regions (Midwest, South, and West) are huge in comparison.
I have been here on City-Data since 2008 and we have been talking about the same issue for the last 10 years.

The Census Bureau knew what they were doing back around 1910 ((I forget the exact year) when they made New York, Pennsylvania and New Jersey, the former Middle States/Colonies, the Mid-Atlantic and yes even the Mason-Dixon Line made sense.

People do not realize this now but at one point, it seems Maryland was not part of the Mid-Atlantic states, she was Southern. It is hard to realize this now because if you look at more recent sources on the internet, Maryland more or less comes across as the heart of the Mid-Atlantic.

But if you look at older sources, such as books, you see that was not necessarily the case. For instance you have The Colonization of the Middle States and Maryland by Frederick Robertson Jones, originally published in 1904. Note the "and Maryland".

https://www.alibris.com/The-Coloniza.../book/10564542

What seems to have happened is that Maryland (and to a much lesser extent, Virginia) had something of an identity crisis and seems to have gradually identify less with the South, increasingly borrowing the term Mid-Atlantic from her northern neighbors and making it her own.
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Old 09-24-2018, 04:51 PM
 
Location: BMORE!
7,735 posts, read 6,132,233 times
Reputation: 3582
Quote:
Originally Posted by the resident09 View Post
A couple of things here, first let's keep in mind that this thread about Mid Atlantic being combined with the Northeast, not necessarily north vs south.

Second, you are not the only one of personal experiences and stories of people giving their take on what they feel in a certain region.

I dated a young lady from New Bedford, MA years ago and specifically asked her what she considered DC and if it was Southern, she replied "heck no the South is like Georgia etc". I've been in places like Michigan and locals who aren't too familiar with geography thought that Maryland was where Massachusetts is. Others also referenced how we're still similar and get cold weather/winters but just that Michigans is way worse. Not to mention the confederate flags I saw on my way through Upstate NY and made nothing of it. I have family from Ohio, Kansas City etc, and friends on the West Coast, they call this area simply "East Coast". People all over can have their own experiences but I stand on my point that the average person outside of CD wouldn't call a place like MD the South period.
It depends on where the "average person outside of CD" is from.
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Old 09-25-2018, 05:27 PM
 
Location: Appalachian New York, Formerly Louisiana
4,100 posts, read 4,729,281 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KodeBlue View Post
It depends on where the "average person outside of CD" is from.
More who they are than where they are from, in my experience.
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Old 09-25-2018, 05:30 PM
 
Location: Virginia Beach
4,205 posts, read 2,822,069 times
Reputation: 4490
Quote:
Originally Posted by the resident09 View Post
A couple of things here, first let's keep in mind that this thread about Mid Atlantic being combined with the Northeast, not necessarily north vs south.

Second, you are not the only one of personal experiences and stories of people giving their take on what they feel in a certain region.

I dated a young lady from New Bedford, MA years ago and specifically asked her what she considered DC and if it was Southern, she replied "heck no the South is like Georgia etc". I've been in places like Michigan and locals who aren't too familiar with geography thought that Maryland was where Massachusetts is. Others also referenced how we're still similar and get cold weather/winters but just that Michigans is way worse. Not to mention the confederate flags I saw on my way through Upstate NY and made nothing of it. I have family from Ohio, Kansas City etc, and friends on the West Coast, they call this area simply "East Coast". People all over can have their own experiences but I stand on my point that the average person outside of CD wouldn't call a place like MD the South period.
I agree with you, we all know different people who have varying opinions on seemingly simple or obvious things to us...
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Old 10-15-2018, 10:29 AM
 
Location: North Carolina
330 posts, read 104,944 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CookieSkoon View Post
Are you saying anybody who visits Maryland in real life would know it is southern or know it is northern?

Because I've been to Maryland. More than once. I've been to DC, I've been to Cumberland (I have a friend who was from there), and neither of them felt far removed from NY state or Pennsylvania. They did feel a world apart from Georgia, Louisiana and Tennessee though.

If it's any consolation, I don't feel Maryland has much in common with Minnesota.

The only part of Maryland I have never personally experienced is the lower coastal/bay region. However, I am willing to consider that part of the state southern based on other conversations I have had here. Even in appearance it has a southern flavor.

I've had people from Maryland tell me they don't think they are southern right to my face. I wasn't imagining it, so obviously the subject its not wholly decided even by Maryland's very own citizens.
Simlar to me. I have a friend from New Jersey and she thinks Maryland is Northern. I guess Maryland is a prime example of how a state becomes unsouthen overtime. Even people in New England consider it Northern which is shocking because Maryland is pretty far south of New England. It'll take at least 5 hours to get to MD to CT. People in NYC think anything south of Philadelphia is southern/country. I know NY'ers who think people in Jersey talk country lol. Most Americans aren't into geography and history so it make sense why most people don't think Maryland is southern, heck I didn't know it was southern until 8th grade history class. To top it all of a lot of Marylanders don't consider themselves Southern, so that tells you something. In ordered for a place to be conforted southern by most Americans is that it has to be in the Bible-Belt. Texas gets a pass on being southern despite bordering Mexico, all of the state being west of the Mississippi, and having western influences because of the state being repulican and have a strong evangelical culture.
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Old 10-15-2018, 02:06 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
3,293 posts, read 1,645,875 times
Reputation: 3538
Quote:
Originally Posted by mwalker96 View Post
Simlar to me. I have a friend from New Jersey and she thinks Maryland is Northern. I guess Maryland is a prime example of how a state becomes unsouthen overtime. Even people in New England consider it Northern which is shocking because Maryland is pretty far south of New England. It'll take at least 5 hours to get to MD to CT. People in NYC think anything south of Philadelphia is southern/country. I know NY'ers who think people in Jersey talk country lol. Most Americans aren't into geography and history so it make sense why most people don't think Maryland is southern, heck I didn't know it was southern until 8th grade history class. To top it all of a lot of Marylanders don't consider themselves Southern, so that tells you something. In ordered for a place to be conforted southern by most Americans is that it has to be in the Bible-Belt. Texas gets a pass on being southern despite bordering Mexico, all of the state being west of the Mississippi, and having western influences because of the state being repulican and have a strong evangelical culture.
I know several people from the Northeast who consider DC and Maryland Southern. They refer to the region as “down south.” Surprisingly, many people from the upper Midwest (Michigan and Illinois, where I have lived) also consider DC/Maryland southern. Although, at the same time, most people I know from the South don’t really consider DC/MD southern.

I am from Maryland, and many African Americans are very southern (speech). There are a lot of Southern rural whites. Unlike PA, NY, NJ, or New England where you can find historical blue collar, white more rural democratic voting blocs (the past election was an exception), in MD you will find that those types of areas are completely red/republican and their speech is much more southern. Comparing blacks in MD/DC to blacks in the Northeast, they sound extremely southern. That is probably why many in the northeast consider MD/DC southern. Again though, many from the Deep South consider it northern/northeast.
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Old 10-15-2018, 02:14 PM
 
Location: That star on your map in the middle of the East Coast, DMV
3,979 posts, read 3,448,313 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by personone View Post
I know several people from the Northeast who consider DC and Maryland Southern. They refer to the region as “down south.” Surprisingly, many people from the upper Midwest (Michigan and Illinois, where I have lived) also consider DC/Maryland southern. Although, at the same time, most people I know from the South don’t really consider DC/MD southern.

I am from Maryland, and many African Americans are very southern (speech). There are a lot of Southern rural whites. Unlike PA, NY, NJ, or New England where you can find historical blue collar, white more rural democratic voting blocs (the past election was an exception), in MD you will find that those types of areas are completely red/republican and their speech is much more southern. Comparing blacks in MD/DC to blacks in the Northeast, they sound extremely southern. That is probably why many in the northeast consider MD/DC southern. Again though, many from the Deep South consider it northern/northeast.
Blacks in DC or Maryland overall don't have Southern speech.

Blacks in Baltimore sound like Philly blacks they just say "tewww" and "duggg". Outside of that their accent is more Northern than Southern.

Most blacks in Maryland suburban areas sound very neutral and nothing close to Southern.

Gayle King is from Silver Spring, MD and doesn't talk with a Southern accent:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Jd-bNUx-3k


Could you point out a segment of the population that talks with a deeper drawl than others? Yes. But even then its not Southern speech. It's just not an NY or NE accent.
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Old 10-15-2018, 02:39 PM
 
Location: Baltimore - Richmond
500 posts, read 329,494 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the resident09 View Post
Blacks in DC or Maryland overall don't have Southern speech.

Blacks in Baltimore sound like Philly blacks they just say "tewww" and "duggg". Outside of that their accent is more Northern than Southern.

Most blacks in Maryland suburban areas sound very neutral and nothing close to Southern.

Gayle King is from Silver Spring, MD and doesn't talk with a Southern accent:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Jd-bNUx-3k


Could you point out a segment of the population that talks with a deeper drawl than others? Yes. But even then its not Southern speech. It's just not an NY or NE accent.
I think it is a mixed bag. There are blacks in the area that are neutral but there are also blacks in the area that speak at least as southern as blacks in the upper south. I wouldn't consider it a drawl like someone from Atlanta but it is there. I would point to Earthquake the comedian or Taraji Henson as examples. Dave Chappelle could work as well. If you look up the Washington DC accent tag there are definitely some accents represented that could be considered southern.
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Old 10-15-2018, 09:53 PM
 
Location: North Carolina
330 posts, read 104,944 times
Reputation: 325
Quote:
Originally Posted by the resident09 View Post
Blacks in DC or Maryland overall don't have Southern speech.

Blacks in Baltimore sound like Philly blacks they just say "tewww" and "duggg". Outside of that their accent is more Northern than Southern.

Most blacks in Maryland suburban areas sound very neutral and nothing close to Southern.

Gayle King is from Silver Spring, MD and doesn't talk with a Southern accent:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Jd-bNUx-3k


Could you point out a segment of the population that talks with a deeper drawl than others? Yes. But even then its not Southern speech. It's just not an NY or NE accent.
Black Marylanders do have a southern drawl. I watched many black Youtubers from Maryland and they all have that southern drawl. Baltimore does have phily traits but unlike Philadelphia people outside the mid-alantic confuse it with a New York accent. With Baltimore nobody say it sounds like a New York accent. A kid I know online from the Baltimore area wants to speak like a NY'er lol. Eastern Maryland was apart of the cotton belt so the Blacks there ought to sound Southern considering Harriet Tubman grew up in that area.
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Old 10-15-2018, 11:34 PM
 
Location: BMORE!
7,735 posts, read 6,132,233 times
Reputation: 3582
Quote:
Originally Posted by mwalker96 View Post
Black Marylanders do have a southern drawl. I watched many black Youtubers from Maryland and they all have that southern drawl. Baltimore does have phily traits but unlike Philadelphia people outside the mid-alantic confuse it with a New York accent. With Baltimore nobody say it sounds like a New York accent. A kid I know online from the Baltimore area wants to speak like a NY'er lol. Eastern Maryland was apart of the cotton belt so the Blacks there ought to sound Southern considering Harriet Tubman grew up in that area.
We sound nothing like Philly or NYC. I don't hear traits from any other city in the Baltimore accent.

Baltimore accent is one of a kind and can't be mistaken for anywhere else, and far more recognizable than most accents. Of course the Baltimore accent is southern, as Baltimore is a southern city in a southern state. However, there are multiple accents in Maryland: the Baltimore accent, the DC accent, the Eastern Shore, Western Maryland are all distinct, not all southern nonetheless.
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