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Old 02-01-2016, 11:56 PM
 
2,253 posts, read 3,718,834 times
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Old 02-02-2016, 03:24 AM
 
Location: Bel Air, California
23,766 posts, read 29,034,674 times
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^hmmm....Canada huh? I always wondered what was up there.
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Old 02-02-2016, 07:25 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
32,087 posts, read 34,676,186 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jennifat View Post
Ugh. I actually love Roseanne for it's realistic depiction of a lower-middle class American family, but it kind of makes my stomach turn to think that show is the perception that people have of the Midwest. Roseanne was a depiction of blue collar small town life, which isn't quite the experience you'll get in a major metropolitan area.
Why does it make your stomach turn?

I think the Conners were intended to be your middle of the road family. Would it have made much of a difference if the show had been set in suburban Cleveland or Indianapolis?

I don't think the average family would be all that different today. The biggest differences would be that they'd have a nicer house that they'd be upside down on, they'd have $15-$20K in credit card debt, leased cars, DJ would be into hip hop and roll up with his friends after school, and Becky would get knocked up Bristol Palin style.
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Old 02-02-2016, 07:59 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
32,087 posts, read 34,676,186 times
Reputation: 15068
Quote:
Originally Posted by jennifat View Post
Ugh. I actually love Roseanne for it's realistic depiction of a lower-middle class American family, but it kind of makes my stomach turn to think that show is the perception that people have of the Midwest. Roseanne was a depiction of blue collar small town life, which isn't quite the experience you'll get in a major metropolitan area.
Speaking of families, here is non-Hispanic white family income by metro. Midwestern metros are in bold. I'm only doing MSAs that have a million people or more.

Washington - $133,842
San Jose - $128,398
San Francisco - $124,247
New York - $107,574
Boston - $104,750
Baltimore - $102,549
Los Angeles - $101,675
Hartford - $99,287
Philadelphia - $94,819
Austin - $94,076
Chicago - $93,365
Denver - $92,825
Minneapolis - $91,473
Seattle - $92,215
San Diego - $90,488
Raleigh - $90,348
Dallas - $90,920
Richmond - $88,024
Milwaukee - $84,285
Atlanta - $84,034
San Antonio - $83,863
Norfolk - $82,614
Sacramento - $82,014
Miami - $81,200
Providence - $80,519
Memphis - $79,838
Kansas City - $79,821
New Orleans - $78,854
St. Louis - $77,820
Salt Lake City - $77,496
Portland - $76,628
Detroit - $75,973
Columbus - $75,944
Cincinnati - $75,072

Charlotte - $74,901
Cleveland - $74,897
Phoenix - $74,703
Rochester - $74,240
Buffalo - $72,982
Indianapolis - $72,804
Jacksonville - $71,870
Nashville - $71,543
Birmingham - $71,363
Las Vegas - $71,726
Oklahoma City - $71,327
Pittsburgh - $71,194
Orlando - $70,127
Tucson - $69,230
Grand Rapids - $68,837
Louisville - $68,683
Tampa - $64,993
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Old 02-02-2016, 08:06 AM
 
2,598 posts, read 4,922,458 times
Reputation: 2275
Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
Speaking of families, here is non-Hispanic white family income by metro. Midwestern metros are in bold. I'm only doing MSAs that have a million people or more.

Washington - $133,842
San Jose - $128,398
San Francisco - $124,247
New York - $107,574
Boston - $104,750
Baltimore - $102,549
Los Angeles - $101,675
Hartford - $99,287
Philadelphia - $94,819
Austin - $94,076
Chicago - $93,365
Denver - $92,825
Minneapolis - $91,473
Seattle - $92,215
San Diego - $90,488
Raleigh - $90,348
Dallas - $90,920
Richmond - $88,024
Milwaukee - $84,285
Atlanta - $84,034
San Antonio - $83,863
Norfolk - $82,614
Sacramento - $82,014
Miami - $81,200
Providence - $80,519
Memphis - $79,838
Kansas City - $79,821
New Orleans - $78,854
St. Louis - $77,820
Salt Lake City - $77,496
Portland - $76,628
Detroit - $75,973
Columbus - $75,944
Cincinnati - $75,072

Charlotte - $74,901
Cleveland - $74,897
Phoenix - $74,703
Rochester - $74,240
Buffalo - $72,982
Indianapolis - $72,804
Jacksonville - $71,870
Nashville - $71,543
Birmingham - $71,363
Las Vegas - $71,726
Oklahoma City - $71,327
Pittsburgh - $71,194
Orlando - $70,127
Tucson - $69,230
Grand Rapids - $68,837
Louisville - $68,683
Tampa - $64,993
When you consider the COL differences, the Midwest numbers look about right.
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Old 02-02-2016, 08:17 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
32,087 posts, read 34,676,186 times
Reputation: 15068
Quote:
Originally Posted by NowInWI View Post
When you consider the COL differences, the Midwest numbers look about right.
Without the coastal metros.

Austin - $94,076
Chicago - $93,365
Denver - $92,825
Minneapolis - $91,473
Raleigh - $90,348
Dallas - $90,920
Richmond - $88,024
Milwaukee - $84,285
Atlanta - $84,034
San Antonio - $83,863
Norfolk - $82,614
Miami - $81,200
Memphis - $79,838
Kansas City - $79,821
New Orleans - $78,854
St. Louis - $77,820
Salt Lake City - $77,496
Detroit - $75,973
Columbus - $75,944
Cincinnati - $75,072

Charlotte - $74,901
Cleveland - $74,897
Phoenix - $74,703
Rochester - $74,240
Buffalo - $72,982
Indianapolis - $72,804
Jacksonville - $71,870
Nashville - $71,543
Birmingham - $71,363
Las Vegas - $71,726
Oklahoma City - $71,327
Pittsburgh - $71,194
Orlando - $70,127
Tucson - $69,230
Grand Rapids - $68,837
Louisville - $68,683
Tampa - $64,993

Last edited by BajanYankee; 02-02-2016 at 08:26 AM..
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Old 02-02-2016, 09:18 AM
 
Location: TN/NC
35,057 posts, read 31,258,424 times
Reputation: 47514
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kmanshouse View Post
As someone who has lived in Northern IL most of his life, and who went to college in Iowa, I see it like this.

1) Iowa, Indiana, Ohio, and non-Chicago Illinois are very similar and are = "General Midwest"
2) Wisconsin, Michigan and Minnesota = "Upper Midwest"
3) Chicago is just "Chicago", which can be lumped into "General Midwest" but has its own thing.
4) Kansas, Dakotas, Nebraska are GREAT PLAINS and NOT the midwest AT ALL
5) Missouri is a mix of general midwest, great plains, and the South. I think this state, not Iowa, has a lack of homogeneous identity.
Iowa and Indiana may have some similarities but they are also vastly different in terms of tree coverage and influence of Southern culture.
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Old 02-03-2016, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota
1,912 posts, read 2,087,543 times
Reputation: 4048
Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
Why does it make your stomach turn?

I think the Conners were intended to be your middle of the road family. Would it have made much of a difference if the show had been set in suburban Cleveland or Indianapolis?
The Conners were definitely not "middle of the road" in terms of income. They were almost always just barely breaking even, sometimes so broke they couldn't even afford to pay the electric bill. That's not middle class.
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Old 02-03-2016, 01:12 PM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
32,087 posts, read 34,676,186 times
Reputation: 15068
Quote:
Originally Posted by jennifat View Post
The Conners were definitely not "middle of the road" in terms of income. They were almost always just barely breaking even, sometimes so broke they couldn't even afford to pay the electric bill. That's not middle class.
Let's see what "middle of the road means."

Median Non-Hispanic White Family Income: $73,974
Bachelor's Degree or Higher: 32.7%

The "middle" in the U.S. for White families is around $74,000. That's a rather pedestrian salary for one educated professional in most big cities. Apparently having a college degree is not even that common among non-Hispanic Whites and the rates only get worse among other racial groups with the exception of Asians.

Everyone has their own idea of the "middle." I'm not sure if "middle" means "most" though. I'm sure two State U grads with a collective income of $125,000 would be considered "middle class" by most people, but they would technically be in the top quartile of non-Hispanic White income. It actually puts you within the Top 20% for all American families.

So while terms like "middle class" are subjective, the data isn't, and the "middle" is probably closer to the Conner family than it is to Modern Family.
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Old 02-03-2016, 01:30 PM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
32,087 posts, read 34,676,186 times
Reputation: 15068
Quote:
Originally Posted by jennifat View Post
The Conners were definitely not "middle of the road" in terms of income. They were almost always just barely breaking even, sometimes so broke they couldn't even afford to pay the electric bill. That's not middle class.
The Conners would never get their lights turned off in 2016. That's because Con Edison, PECO, Time Warner, etc. allow you to pay using your Mastercard. You can just throw your bills onto your credit card and let the interest pile up. That's what most Americans are doing.

American Household Credit Card Debt Statistics: 2015 - NerdWallet

The Conners of 1988 probably had to put stuff on layaway for D.J. and Becky. The Conners of 2016 would just charge it to the Mastercard.
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