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Old 04-18-2016, 09:15 PM
 
Location: North County San Diego Area
786 posts, read 495,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
Don't live in So FL and , well, far less likely to be hit by a hurricane than SoCal by a major fire.
Florida get's wildfires too, when a drought hits or during the dry season. All that pine, palmetto and scrub is a instant fire starter, lighting is quite common to start them or people.

People are often killed by lighting, Central FL is the worst for that. A guy was killed in the West Palm Beach area a few days ago, when I lived there people playing golf would often get hit.
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Old 04-18-2016, 09:25 PM
 
Location: Dothan AL
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Florida is warmer, and that is all i care about; it never gets too hot for me. Winter nights in LA can be quite cold, not so much in southern Florida.
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Old 04-18-2016, 10:20 PM
 
Location: North County San Diego Area
786 posts, read 495,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OldDocKat View Post
Florida is warmer, and that is all i care about; it never gets too hot for me. Winter nights in LA can be quite cold, not so much in southern Florida.
It's not the heat, it's the humidity that many cannot handle. I never minded it and loved the weather in SoFla, but if you have to work outside in the summer months you will sweat buckets. I moved several months ago and it was unseasonably humid, 85% humidity on the last 2 days of packing, I was drenched and had to peel off my clothes from my body and hang them up in the shower. Since being in CA the weather has not be lower than 50F, humidity was high a few days and the past two days it was record heat in my area, albeit with 30% or less humidity.

A few days or weeks in Dec, Jan or Feb in SoFla you can expect cold temps, it got down to the high 30's a few times that I lived there. In SoFla anything under 60 is cold, once you acclimate to the warm weather it will hit you harder. I wore my jacket a few times here and some of my co-workers made jokes about it.
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Old 04-19-2016, 06:54 AM
 
17,570 posts, read 10,625,168 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aewan68 View Post
Florida get's wildfires too, when a drought hits or during the dry season. All that pine, palmetto and scrub is a instant fire starter, lighting is quite common to start them or people.

People are often killed by lighting, Central FL is the worst for that. A guy was killed in the West Palm Beach area a few days ago, when I lived there people playing golf would often get hit.
Wild fires can occur everywhere. However CA gets them virtually every year and not just in isolated areas. I watched several fires from my front porch in Riverside County and they were not that far from my home and many homes burned. Ditto in SD County. It is common while in FL it takes a special drought, etc. yes more lightening in FL, but still a very rare event. Then the mud slides .....
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Old 04-19-2016, 02:56 PM
 
1 posts, read 739 times
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Default Pros and Cons

Hi there- I couldn't help but weigh in on this question because it's one that I'm toying with myself!

Like the original poster, I'm also a remote worker (also from the northeast), so local economy doesn't matter when choosing where to live for me either. I'm currently enjoying sunny Miami Beach (1 bedroom apartment, two blocks to ocean on popular part of South Beach, $1700/mo.) and not paying income tax. Cost of living in the parts of Florida worth living in are still high-ish, but nothing like California (I also spent a year in San Diego -- which I LOVED, but since I hope to be a homeowner someday, it's just not realistic long-term). I wouldn't consider the heat to be a factor when you're thinking about moving-- yes, the heat and humidity will be a shock at first, but give it six months and you won't notice anymore (except maybe late Aus/early Sept). In fact, I'm always cold now where I go anywhere else Also, 'florida bugs' are not state-wide!! In Miami Beach, we have very few bugs (but some pretty cool wild iguanas) -- if you go into the everglades (2 hours from here), of course, that's a different story. If you're seriously considering Florida, I suggest narrowing it down to a specific area because the state varies wildly (the same can be said for California). My top picks would be Miami Beach (not Miami proper-- living on the mainland isn't much cheaper and is a huge step down in quality of life), Saint Petersburg/Tampa, Naples, and St. Augustine.

What really makes California a great place to be, in my view, is the outdoor lifestyle available to you there. While in San Diego, I really fell in love with hiking and spending time at high elevation. I also loved being about to visit the beach, the mountains, and the desert all in a day's drive! It's such a unique environment out there. In Florida, to spend time outdoors too often ends up being some Jimmy Buffet-style day-drinking and suntanning/fishing (granted, there are some cool state parks in Florida, too-- but nothing like California). Florida is flat as a pancake, so if you're a Northeasterner who likes the fall colors rolling hills, Cali may be more satisfying to you. That said, if all you're looking for is a relaxing sea breeze, you can't beat coastal Florida. California beaches are beautiful in a very natural, rustic kind of way (which I've grown to prefer, personally), but Florida beaches (especially south Florida) slap you in the face with their beauty-- white sand beaches and clear, blue water.

The original poster mentioned they don't have kids, but in case anyone wonders, schools in both Florida and California vary wildly from place to place. Overall, much better in California. Property taxes are comparable in both states, around .9-1% (but vary locally as well).

Anyway, I'm personally so torn on this issue (for me, Cali wins, but I'll be so broke living there it may not be worth it, and Florida is truly a great place to 'get stuck'!!) -- I'm starting to consider Chattanooga, Tennessee as well as an in-between option. Before you tell me I'm crazy, here's why: top outdoor destination as listed by Outdoors Magazine (like Cali), mild winters (2-5 inches of snow yearly, comparable to mountain towns in Cali that I'm considering), no income tax, great schools, great small business environment. But, I'd have to live in the south (shudder).

Working remotely is a blessing and a curse-- paralyzed by choice! Best of luck with your decision.
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Old 04-19-2016, 05:02 PM
 
Location: SoCal
359 posts, read 317,757 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bert_from_back_East View Post
California is very different from Florida.

Cities in California such as Los Angeles, Long Beach, San Francisco and Oakland are much older and more established than those in Florida, so they tend to be more urban, walkable, densely-populated and cosmopolitan by comparison.

Public transportation infrastructure is more comprehensive and utilization rates, higher in California than in Florida. There are also more collective efforts among legislators, citizens and special interest groups alike to expand public transportation infrastructure and increase utilization to reduce automobile dependency and, in the process, improve the general flow of traffic in the state's largest metropolitan areas.

California cities also have far more pre-WWII architecture compared to Florida, the latter of which wasn't really developed until the advent of air conditioning in the mid-to-late 20th century. Thatís not to mention that, from the 1970ís onward, Florida developers pretty much bulldozed what remained in terms of early-to-mid 20th century structures to make way for new development. Historical preservation is not one of Floridaís strong suits.

Overall, California has much more pleasant weather than Florida - much less humid and stormy; cooler, drier springs, summers, and autumns; significantly less potential for dangerous weather events such as thunderstorms, tornadoes, hurricanes and tropical depressions; and less potential for severe flooding. Not to mention thereís far more climatic variation in California, ranging from Mediterranean, oceanic, alpine, high and low desert, etc.

In Florida, it rains nearly every day for 8-9 months and the intense humidity lasts for 9-10 months, depending on the year. The "rainy season" in Florida, which starts in early-to-mid May and lasts until late October, can be very gloomy. "Clear" days, at least by California standards, are almost non-existent in Florida, especially in the summertime.

The nature and varied terrain of California - ocean, mountain, and desert vistas; canyons; forests; grasslands; wetlands; etc. - is much more spectacular than the flat, uninspiring swampy scrubland scenery of Florida. FWIW, snow-capped mountain vistas aren't visible from the beach in Florida, not that any type of mountain vistas exist in Florida to begin with.

For those of you arguing that beaches are "better" in Florida than those in California, name a beach in Florida that's more spectacular than Strands, Monarch, or Thousand Steps Beach or Abalone Cove in Southern California or Big Sur on the Central Coast. Ya, didn't think so.

The milder, less volatile weather and more varied terrain of coastal California encourage outdoor activity and recreation, helping California attain its status as one of the healthiest states in the country. Hiking, mountain biking and surfing among other outdoor recreational activities are much more popular in California. Although better than most Southern states in health metrics, Florida has higher incidences of smoking, obesity, and chronic illness such as diabetes and hypertension than California, partly due to more lower-income individuals and families and less emphasis on active, healthy lifestyles overall.

California has a stronger, more diversified economy than Florida. There's a larger corporate presence and more well-paying industry in California such as IT, biotech, nanotech, life sciences, and investment banking to name a few, so your average Californian tends to be higher earning and more gainfully employed than your average Floridian. Even low-wage, low-skill workers in the manufacturing, trade, and healthcare sectors in California enjoy higher comparative wages, more comprehensive non-wage benefits and better state-level rights and protections than their counterparts in Florida, which is a RTW state with very limited union participation rates. Compared to California, Florida has a service-oriented economy with a strong hospitality/tourism orientation, a sector that is notorious for low wages, limited non-wage benefits and non-existent upward economic mobility. Consistent with Arizona, the service-oriented economy of Florida neither breeds nor attracts highly ambitious youth, so a lot of younger people in Florida tend to be apathetic and complacent. The younger people who are educated and career-oriented tend to move to other states after college, up to and including California.

California is home to a much better educated, more talented workforce - and general populace, for that matter - than Florida, which is one of the reasons why so much modern innovation comes from California. In addition to a strong history of innovation, California has a more competitive ethos, entrepreneurial spirit and intellectual vibe than Florida. This, of course, is due to a multitude of factors, but primarily the greater abundance of well-paying industry as well as more prestigious institutions of higher learning in California.

Because Florida is less educated and cosmopolitan than California in general, you'll encounter much more intolerance and small-mindedness in Florida than in California, not to mention much less support for progressive ideals and movements such as hybrid and electric cars, the "green" movement (i.e., recycling, curbing emissions, etc.), medical marijuana, same-sex marriage, organic eating and living, farmers markets and community-supported agriculture, smoking bans, caps on land development and so forth.

People are a lot more open, tolerant, and accepting in California - no cares what religion you are, where you're from or who you sleep with. There's definitely more of a counterculture element in California compared to just about anywhere in Florida - more hippies, more nature-lovers, more spiritual folks, etc. There's also significantly less tolerance for aggression, shadiness and deviance. Overall, I find California to be a much more humane place than Florida.

In reality, living in Florida is like living in the South, but without the politeness, friendliness and hospitality. The general lack of civility and common courtesy in the major cities is frightening and is due in large part to "six degrees of separation." People are friendlier and more pleasant in California than in Florida, hands down, which is a far less transient, anonymous society.

Unlike California, Florida is loaded with miserable transplants from the Northeast, although mostly New York and New Jersey, who have that lousy "tough-guy" attitude that remains in place even after living in Florida for 20 years - constantly striving to be rude, argumentative, combative, ghetto, shrewd, "street-smart" or some other variant of "tough" while trying to deceive or "put one over" on you in any way possible.

Then, you have to contend with the shady transient element in Florida. IME, everyone down there has a story, and most of the time, it's not pretty. Lots of people in Florida are running from something in their past - a violent ex, a criminal record, an abusive childhood, a history of drug and/or alcohol abuse, a dysfunctional family of origin, a series of legal disputes, etc. People have a lot of "baggage" down there, for sure, which is why there's much more crime and many more drug and social issues in Florida than in California, generally speaking.

However, the worst part about Florida, IMO, is the transplants who move down from the Tri-State area and into shiny new tract homes in gated communities, thinking they've "arrived" like the second coming of the Messiah. Before long, these people think they're rich and, in their minds, "rich" people are rude, even though most people with family and long-term wealth are quite down-to-earth (as anyone who has spent any time at all in California knows). So now, these people begin looking down their noses at people in service industry jobs, treating them like crap. While living in South Florida, I witnessed absolutely horrid behavior among transplants, especially older ones, when talking to store clerks or restaurant servers. I never witnessed anything even remotely comparable in Southern California.

Believe it or not, most of the people who live in California were born in California, so there's a much stronger, more well-defined state culture, and civic pride and engagement levels tend to be higher. There's less in the way of voter apathy in California, and all of the professional sports teams have larger, more dedicated fan-bases than any team I can think of in Florida, where most sporting events draw larger away-team crowds than home-team crowds. To say that there's a stronger sense of community in your average California communities vs. your average Florida community is an understatement.

California is a lot less transient, too. In addition to many more natives - and very proud, dyed-in-the-wool natives, I might add - California is the type of place where people move to, assimilate to the local culture, and stay whereas Florida, OTOH, is more of a place where people come, complain and leave. People in California pledge their allegiance to California, even if they're from elsewhere originally, whereas people in Florida are more likely to pledge their allegiance to New York, Massachusetts, Illinois or whatever crap-hole Eastern state they crawled out of. That alone should speak volumes to anyone deciding between the two states.

I've lived in both, and without a doubt, the weather, scenery, culture, people and lifestyle among other facets of California are vastly superior to that of Florida. It's not even much of a contest, really.

California, FTW.
As a New England transplant to California considering relo to Florida, this is an interesting read for which I thank you...
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Old 04-19-2016, 06:27 PM
 
893 posts, read 555,977 times
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Couple points.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kcardonl View Post
I wouldn't consider the heat to be a factor when you're thinking about moving-- yes, the heat and humidity will be a shock at first, but give it six months and you won't notice anymore (except maybe late Aus/early Sept).
Yeah, I agree. The weather in Southern Florida is great, and can be argued to be better than Southern California if we did it month by month. It's certainly much fuss over nothing. As you mentioned, I'm now cold whenever I return to California to visit friends/family unless it's July-October.

Quote:
Also, 'florida bugs' are not state-wide!! In Miami Beach, we have very few bugs (but some pretty cool wild iguanas) -- if you go into the everglades (2 hours from here), of course, that's a different story.
Again, agreed. In urban areas of Miami, bugs are small to a non-issue. I leave my balcony doors open day and night, and there are no bugs in my place, granted I live on the 31st floor.

Quote:
Property taxes are comparable in both states, around .9-1% (but vary locally as well).
Property taxes are actually more than double in Florida, around 2%, compared to California. However, there is Homestead exemption which allows you to reduce the tax burden on your primary.

Quote:
Anyway, I'm personally so torn on this issue (for me, Cali wins, but I'll be so broke living there it may not be worth it, and Florida is truly a great place to 'get stuck'!!) -- I'm starting to consider Chattanooga, Tennessee as well as an in-between option. Before you tell me I'm crazy, here's why: top outdoor destination as listed by Outdoors Magazine (like Cali), mild winters (2-5 inches of snow yearly, comparable to mountain towns in Cali that I'm considering), no income tax, great schools, great small business environment. But, I'd have to live in the south (shudder).
It seems to me you want/crave mountains which is why you're considering Chattanooga. There are inexpensive areas in California near the mountains like Riverside, I'd suggest you look at them first. You can become a homeowner there with ease if you can become a homeowner in Miami.

But short of moving, I'd suggest you try and play to Miami's strong strengths.

Scuba Diving/Boating/Fishing/Jet Skiing/Swimming, basically anything in the water. The Florida Keys has the best diving in the USA, and Miami has some of the warmest year-round waters in all of the USA. They are filled with colorful fish, sharks, ship wrecks and coral reefs. Being active doesn't need to involve hiking through a mountain. Taking up scuba diving is not easy - there is an financial investment and a learning curve, but it will quickly pay off. You're literally in one of the best dive areas in the world. The reef that begins just south of Key Biscayne is the third longest in the world, after the one in Australia, and Belize.
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Old 04-19-2016, 07:25 PM
 
Location: North County San Diego Area
786 posts, read 495,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
Wild fires can occur everywhere. However CA gets them virtually every year and not just in isolated areas. I watched several fires from my front porch in Riverside County and they were not that far from my home and many homes burned. Ditto in SD County. It is common while in FL it takes a special drought, etc. yes more lightening in FL, but still a very rare event. Then the mud slides .....
Last one I remember was last summer just west of where I lived, no drought either but it was contained. A few burned near homes in the past few years. The few drought years we had, there were several in the state, one blew across the Fl Turnpike. It's like here though, the rain is a big deal as in SoFla it's not.

I'm not concerned about it, earthquakes, hurricanes, mudslides or anything else, of course I use to swim in the ocean off of Palm Beach and sharks were very common, never worried about it. Statistically I was more at risk driving to work everyday in SoFla than all the above here or there and I felt more stressed by my commute than all the hurricanes I went through.
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Old 04-19-2016, 07:43 PM
 
Location: North County San Diego Area
786 posts, read 495,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Majami View Post
Couple points.



Yeah, I agree. The weather in Southern Florida is great, and can be argued to be better than Southern California if we did it month by month. It's certainly much fuss over nothing. As you mentioned, I'm now cold whenever I return to California to visit friends/family unless it's July-October.

Again, agreed. In urban areas of Miami, bugs are small to a non-issue. I leave my balcony doors open day and night, and there are no bugs in my place, granted I live on the 31st floor.


Property taxes are actually more than double in Florida, around 2%, compared to California. However, there is Homestead exemption which allows you to reduce the tax burden on your primary.



It seems to me you want/crave mountains which is why you're considering Chattanooga. There are inexpensive areas in California near the mountains like Riverside, I'd suggest you look at them first. You can become a homeowner there with ease if you can become a homeowner in Miami.

But short of moving, I'd suggest you try and play to Miami's strong strengths.

Scuba Diving/Boating/Fishing/Jet Skiing/Swimming, basically anything in the water. The Florida Keys has the best diving in the USA, and Miami has some of the warmest year-round waters in all of the USA. They are filled with colorful fish, sharks, ship wrecks and coral reefs. Being active doesn't need to involve hiking through a mountain. Taking up scuba diving is not easy - there is an financial investment and a learning curve, but it will quickly pay off. You're literally in one of the best dive areas in the world. The reef that begins just south of Key Biscayne is the third longest in the world, after the one in Australia, and Belize.

Of course you are not going to have bugs living in a high rise, but I heard of ants, crazy and white footed in some high rises. Biggest issues I faces in SoFla when I lived there was Roaches and Ants, I did pest control and still had roaches get into the house and garage, no matter how clean it was and how well food was sealed in zip lock bags, I would see ants as well. Never had a roach infestation but ants a few times.

Fire ants are all over the place and if left untreated come back like nobody's business.

Spiders were also a problem, mosquitoes and no-see-ums were also an issue. Near the coast you will see less bugs, but near the ocean the bugs are less prevalent, I have seen fire ants on the beach a few times as well.

Taxes are high and even with the exemption it's becoming more expensive on top of having high homeowners insurance. My taxes went down then up, but I lived in Palm Beach County in an affluent/in demand area that had good schools and everyone wanted to live there.

SoFla is a Caribbean feel, and honestly I don't know why there is always comparisons to CA to FL, okay there's an ocean and some palm trees, that's about it. They are polar opposites from there on out in lot's of way's. The biggest thing that I would tell anyone who is thinking of moving to SoFla and has to work or works in a specialized field to do massive research on whether or not jobs exist and what the pay is, sub-standard salaries are very common in SoFla and the COL is not cheap, none of the positives were worth it to us to stay another year, so we left and moved to CA.

FL in general is often a dead end road for many people with respect to their careers, I met more people who moved to FL and left than any other area I have lived also a lot of people that live there and work at least in my line of work are miserable and complain all the time about the quality of opportunity and salaries. I have not heard the same talk from my co-workers here in CA since I started several months ago, even during lunch and social gatherings outside of work, the attitude is totally different.
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Old 04-19-2016, 08:02 PM
 
96 posts, read 80,586 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcardonl View Post
Hi there- I couldn't help but weigh in on this question because it's one that I'm toying with myself!

Like the original poster, I'm also a remote worker (also from the northeast), so local economy doesn't matter when choosing where to live for me either. I'm currently enjoying sunny Miami Beach (1 bedroom apartment, two blocks to ocean on popular part of South Beach, $1700/mo.) and not paying income tax. Cost of living in the parts of Florida worth living in are still high-ish, but nothing like California (I also spent a year in San Diego -- which I LOVED, but since I hope to be a homeowner someday, it's just not realistic long-term). I wouldn't consider the heat to be a factor when you're thinking about moving-- yes, the heat and humidity will be a shock at first, but give it six months and you won't notice anymore (except maybe late Aus/early Sept). In fact, I'm always cold now where I go anywhere else Also, 'florida bugs' are not state-wide!! In Miami Beach, we have very few bugs (but some pretty cool wild iguanas) -- if you go into the everglades (2 hours from here), of course, that's a different story. If you're seriously considering Florida, I suggest narrowing it down to a specific area because the state varies wildly (the same can be said for California). My top picks would be Miami Beach (not Miami proper-- living on the mainland isn't much cheaper and is a huge step down in quality of life), Saint Petersburg/Tampa, Naples, and St. Augustine.

What really makes California a great place to be, in my view, is the outdoor lifestyle available to you there. While in San Diego, I really fell in love with hiking and spending time at high elevation. I also loved being about to visit the beach, the mountains, and the desert all in a day's drive! It's such a unique environment out there. In Florida, to spend time outdoors too often ends up being some Jimmy Buffet-style day-drinking and suntanning/fishing (granted, there are some cool state parks in Florida, too-- but nothing like California). Florida is flat as a pancake, so if you're a Northeasterner who likes the fall colors rolling hills, Cali may be more satisfying to you. That said, if all you're looking for is a relaxing sea breeze, you can't beat coastal Florida. California beaches are beautiful in a very natural, rustic kind of way (which I've grown to prefer, personally), but Florida beaches (especially south Florida) slap you in the face with their beauty-- white sand beaches and clear, blue water.

The original poster mentioned they don't have kids, but in case anyone wonders, schools in both Florida and California vary wildly from place to place. Overall, much better in California. Property taxes are comparable in both states, around .9-1% (but vary locally as well).

Anyway, I'm personally so torn on this issue (for me, Cali wins, but I'll be so broke living there it may not be worth it, and Florida is truly a great place to 'get stuck'!!) -- I'm starting to consider Chattanooga, Tennessee as well as an in-between option. Before you tell me I'm crazy, here's why: top outdoor destination as listed by Outdoors Magazine (like Cali), mild winters (2-5 inches of snow yearly, comparable to mountain towns in Cali that I'm considering), no income tax, great schools, great small business environment. But, I'd have to live in the south (shudder).

Working remotely is a blessing and a curse-- paralyzed by choice! Best of luck with your decision.

It's nice to meet someone going through the same thing as I am. It is a big decision. Working remotely is wonderful, just knowing I can pick up and live anywhere but I would still have to work Eastern hours of
8-4:30. So if i moved to Cali my hours would be 5am - 1:30pm.

My reasons for wanting to live in California is the weather, more educated residents (as I read there is alot of low income rednecks and transients in Florida) . I love the landscapes of California.
The only thing keeping me from moving to California is the cost.

My reason for wanting to live in Florida is the beautiful beaches and a better chance of being able to live on or very close to the beach. Cheaper cost of living without having income tax being taken out of my paycheck.

What worries me about Florida is the high crime rate. I'm single so that is important to me. Florida tends to draw transients, which leads to a higher crime rate.
The humidity in Florida can really get bad and I would miss the 4 seasons. I don't mind it if it's warm in Winter without snow but to have the high heat and humidity for 9-10 months is a very long time without getting a reprieve from the heat.

So i'm thinking California would be better to move if only I can find a nice affordable place within driving distance, less than 45 min, to the beach.

What are your pros and cons to moving to each state
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