U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S.
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 04-20-2017, 12:56 AM
 
Location: BMORE!
7,735 posts, read 6,132,233 times
Reputation: 3582

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyNY View Post
I concur

His posts often use rhetoric that is simultaneously befuddling, provoking, and occasionally just wrong.

For example, the oft-repeated claim that Baltimore is a "quintessential" southern city.



The definition of quintessential?

"Representing the most perfect or typical example of a quality or class". A quintessential southern city would be a place like Atlanta, or Charlotte, or Birmingham. Baltimore is nowhere near the top of that list.

Or even better, the elevating of the south at the expense of the northeast, often referring to it as "backwards"(!?) and as the red-headed stepchild of the nation:









And that's in this thread alone!

I mean, hey, if you truly do believe what you say, that's fine. Just don't share it with others in such an obnoxious way.

It's whatever. The moderators will probably either lock this thread or delete the majority of replies within, and rightfully so; This subject has been beaten to death on this forum.

TL;DR: Don't feed the (possible) troll
I know the definition of quintessential, that's why I used it. Ironically, in your opinion, your examples of quintessential southern cities are the cities that northerners are running to. Let's​ take your logic even further into the deep end. Why isn't Miami considered a quintessential southern city? What reasons are there to omit the southernmost major city in the country?

I would also hope that you'll feel that same way about south being mislabeled as you do about the Northeast.

Also, can you please tell me what I'm wrong about? I understand that Baltimore may not be the first city one thinks of when someone says "the south," and the Mid-Atlantic technically doesn't include Maryland, and the fact that Baltimore hasn't seen northerners pouring in like ATL, Charlotte, Miami, etc., are seeing them, sooooo... where does leave us? It would be kind of crazy to say that Baltimore magically transformed from a southern city to a northern city without any real reason as to why and how.

With that being said, I agree that this topic has been beaten to death, and no one is gonna change anyone else's opinion on the matter.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 04-20-2017, 06:18 AM
 
Location: 304
5,092 posts, read 6,855,484 times
Reputation: 1697
I don't understand why people:

1> Use the Mason Dixon Line as their justification for what is southern vs what is northern. The line was created as a border between a few states (PA/MD/VA/DE/Later WV), not as a symbolic divide of the country. There are people far north of that line that would associate themselves with the south, and people far below that line that would associate themselves with the north.

2> Want to classify entire states within a particular region. My home state of WV being a prime example that a state can carry the makeup of multiple different regions. Along the Ohio Valley and even as far southeast as Charleston come across Midwestern to me. NCWV and the Eastern Panhandle are certainly more Mid-Atlantic than southern. South of Charleston is a toss up, but leans Southern. You cannot fit a society that has freedom of movement into neat little borders and regions. Naturally there will be overflow.

3> Think WV is southern. West Virginia has more in common with Ohio and Pennsylvania than it does with Virginia, North Carolina, Alabama, Texas, etc... WV is an industrial based state, whose resources have fueled the growth of the Midwest/Rust Belt. Pittsburgh would not have been as productive industrially if not for Southern WV metallurgical coalfields. WV also had a booming steel industry at one time, and Charleston, WV was a boom-town for the chemical industry. WV does share traits of southern hospitality, rural living, and "rednecks" (term which started in WV as a result of coal mine wars). However, WV shares traits with the north as well. So no, you cannot simply slide WV into the southern category.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-20-2017, 07:21 AM
Status: "RIP Solomon Tekah" (set 4 days ago)
 
1,223 posts, read 578,430 times
Reputation: 1183
Quote:
Originally Posted by CookieSkoon View Post
People do that everywhere. I never understood why muddin'/off-roading was considered southern. Hell even winter doesn't stop people up here! They just switch to snow-mobiles and jump snowbanks over roads.
The South is a large region and I'm sure that you'll find rural Whites in almost every Southern state who will go mudding and whatnot. The Northeast has the perception of infinite urbanism so those who go mudding up North aren't thought of. The South still has the image of rural and poor.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-20-2017, 07:32 AM
Status: "RIP Solomon Tekah" (set 4 days ago)
 
1,223 posts, read 578,430 times
Reputation: 1183
The Mason Dixon Line was certainly a divider of North and South back in slavery times. I thought it was common knowledge that a slave was safe once they hit PA.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-20-2017, 07:38 AM
 
Location: OKIE-Ville
5,412 posts, read 7,703,380 times
Reputation: 3054
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turnerbro View Post
I've often wondered about border states. Yes I'm from Maryland and don't think Maryland is in anyway considered southern. However no one seems to question that Kentucky and Virginia are southern. I wonder should all border states be treated the same way? Is it the state culture that determines whether or not it's southern?
Yes, because the overriding culture of these states (Kentucky definitely, West Virginia...yes, but to a lesser extent), much like Oklahoma, is Southern.

Kentucky can have more of a Midwest vibe in some places.
West Virginia can have more of a countrified Eastern vibe in some places.
Oklahoma has more of a strong Western vibe in some places.

All of these states (not as positive with WV as I've only been in a small portion), however, still have Southern culture which predominates in major portions of their respective states.

That's why Maryland is often excluded in comparison to Kentucky and West Virginia because it carries a strong mixture of Northeastern-MidAtlantic culture which is not generally considered Southern.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-20-2017, 07:49 AM
 
Location: 304
5,092 posts, read 6,855,484 times
Reputation: 1697
Quote:
Originally Posted by 80s_kid View Post
The Mason Dixon Line was certainly a divider of North and South back in slavery times. I thought it was common knowledge that a slave was safe once they hit PA.
Of course they were, because PA was a free state during the Civil War and the leading years up to it. Not because once you crossed over the line everything else magically changed. People in Northern Virginia have more in common with Philadelphia than they do with people in Greensboro. NOVA is below the Mason Dixon line. The "common knowledge" part doesn't mean that it is commonly correct information. People for decades thought that it was common knowledge that by eating carrots you'd get better eyesight. The truth however is that rumor was started during WW2 by British propaganda to hide the fact that they had radar.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-20-2017, 07:57 AM
 
Location: West Tennessee
2,081 posts, read 2,897,290 times
Reputation: 1331
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jandrew5 View Post
Well they go muddin' in West Virginia. Missouri does not strike me as that kind of place.
lmao trust me there is plenty of muddin going on in Missouri. Regardless, that happens in rural areas all over the country anyway so I'm not sure what that has to do with anything.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-20-2017, 08:09 AM
 
29,873 posts, read 27,324,185 times
Reputation: 18427
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chriscross309 View Post
Of course they were, because PA was a free state during the Civil War and the leading years up to it. Not because once you crossed over the line everything else magically changed. People in Northern Virginia have more in common with Philadelphia than they do with people in Greensboro. NOVA is below the Mason Dixon line. The "common knowledge" part doesn't mean that it is commonly correct information. People for decades thought that it was common knowledge that by eating carrots you'd get better eyesight. The truth however is that rumor was started during WW2 by British propaganda to hide the fact that they had radar.
Hmmm...how so, outside of the fact that NoVA and Philly are major metro areas and Greensboro isn't? I can probably think of just as many differences between NoVA and Philly and NoVA and Greensboro.

Now if you really mean *suburban* Philly (e.g., King of Prussia, Cherry Hill), then I would agree.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-20-2017, 08:22 AM
Status: "RIP Solomon Tekah" (set 4 days ago)
 
1,223 posts, read 578,430 times
Reputation: 1183
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chriscross309 View Post
Of course they were, because PA was a free state during the Civil War and the leading years up to it. Not because once you crossed over the line everything else magically changed. People in Northern Virginia have more in common with Philadelphia than they do with people in Greensboro. NOVA is below the Mason Dixon line. The "common knowledge" part doesn't mean that it is commonly correct information. People for decades thought that it was common knowledge that by eating carrots you'd get better eyesight. The truth however is that rumor was started during WW2 by British propaganda to hide the fact that they had radar.
No doubt that the culture doesn't magically change, never felt that way. I'm just pointing out that the Mason-Dixon line was the difference between slave and free or in other words Southern and Northern back then. Throw in colonial history and the history of a state after the US Civil War all the way to the 1960s. I realize that cultural overflow is real. People in NoVa may or may not have more in common with people in Philadelphia but what about the physical city? I mean, what is your city telling me? One has streets named after people on the losing end of the historic Civil War and the other doesn't. Of course, that isn't the end all be all and it doesn't automatically make one city Southern but it certainly strips any validation of being Northern.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-20-2017, 08:32 AM
 
2,504 posts, read 2,262,328 times
Reputation: 1820
Below are a few (very simple) cultural examples of how Nova, Maryland (including Bmore), Kentucky, WV and Missouri are all straddling the cultural line.




Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S.
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top