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Old 09-26-2017, 07:03 PM
 
Location: BMORE!
7,750 posts, read 6,167,408 times
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I prefer MSAs as it seems to be the best indicator of the culture of a region. However, I do see why CSAs are used in certain instances, such as Raleigh-Durham, The Bay Area, Los Angeles-San Bernadino, Chicagoland, Hampton Roads, as they influence a broader area.
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Old 09-26-2017, 07:26 PM
 
Location: BMORE!
7,750 posts, read 6,167,408 times
Reputation: 3601
Quote:
Originally Posted by the resident09 View Post
There is no proof of what your premise of tacking on Baltimore for gain was. All you did was post quotes of me mentioning DC and Baltimore in the same sentence, while various metrics were being discussed. Give it a break bro.
That's exactly what I said that I was gonna do. Don't be on some "bu..but..but everybody was talking about CSAs"

You got what you asked for. If you didn't mention Baltimore so much, it wouldn't be an issue.
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Old 09-26-2017, 07:31 PM
 
Location: Downtown Phoenix, AZ
18,926 posts, read 6,911,653 times
Reputation: 5862
Quote:
Originally Posted by KodeBlue View Post
I prefer MSAs as it seems to be the best indicator of the culture of a region. However, I do see why CSAs are used in certain instances, such as Raleigh-Durham, The Bay Area, Los Angeles-San Bernadino, Chicagoland, Hampton Roads, as they influence a broader area.
Exactly, as Santa Clara County is clearly in the same urban area as San Mateo and Alameda Counties, and no one in the real world thinks that when you cross the city/county line between Pomona and Chino that you have left Greater Los Angeles
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Old 09-26-2017, 07:52 PM
 
311 posts, read 219,303 times
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To me, there are three main types of metros in the United States, with numerous subcategories. These groupings are not always clear-cut obviously and certain cities/metros may overlap among them, but here goes.
The first type of metro is headed and clearly anchored by a singular, large city. The metro may and often does include notable, historic, and charming suburbs, but there is a marked difference in style and form between city and suburb. Also, satellite cities do exist but none rival the might of the chief city in the metro. This is arguably the most common example of metro and includes cities such as New York, Chicago, and Philadelphia.
The second type of metro is the poly-centric variety. Here, a metro is comprised of two or more major or relatively major cities which rose up independently. In this scenario, the metro's premier city generally ends up representing the entire metro despite the fact that multiple cities play a significant role. These types of metros are sometimes best represented as mini regions and as such are often reflected in CSA rather than MSA calculations. Examples include San Francisco (San Jose, and to some extend Oakland), Boston (Providence), and the NC Research Triangle. Some might include the Washington D.C. connection with Baltimore in this category while others see them as separate cities simply located in close proximity. As the world grows smaller, New York and Philadelphia begin to move into this category in the eyes of some.
The third metro category is the regional city. The most famous example of this is the Los Angeles metro area. Here, the metro is difficult to define because it stretches for thousands of miles of relatively dense suburbia/un-dense urban form. These cities are not often lauded for bustling downtowns but remain near their core city's level of density for extensive expanses outside city limits. These cities often have scattered nodes of development and suburbs with large boundaries and fairly large populations as well. Other examples may include Atlanta and Houston.
These categorizations don't very articulately account for all variations but I see it as something of a start. What about twin cities like Minneapolis-St. Paul? What about Dallas with semi-peer city but not really, Fort Worth? What about Seattle with Tacoma in a Fort-Worth like situation plus a "boom-burg" like Bellevue? What about all the situations where certain counties can realistically go to two different metros?
Thoughts on my analysis?
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Old 09-26-2017, 08:02 PM
 
Location: Baltimore, MD
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Boston is the first type of metro, not second. Providence is nowhere close to the same level as Boston, at either the city or metro level. It maybe the weakest of the primary city metros, but it certainly isn't a polycentric one. That's like elevating Cleveland to polycentric status because it has Akron.
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Old 09-26-2017, 08:25 PM
 
311 posts, read 219,303 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qworldorder View Post
Boston is the first type of metro, not second. Providence is nowhere close to the same level as Boston, at either the city or metro level. It maybe the weakest of the primary city metros, but it certainly isn't a polycentric one. That's like elevating Cleveland to polycentric status because it has Akron.
I definitely feel you which is why I said there's some overlap between categories. Providence is actually a very under-the-radar city though. Its own metro area (MSA) (Boston-less) is top 40 in the US and has over 1.6 million people, more than Milwaukee, OKC, Memphis, New Orleans, Honolulu, and others, and in the same vicinity as Nashville. Boston's MSA is 4.6 million but its CSA jumps to over 8 million. That's a HUGE jump, due in good part to Providence and its surrounding area. I think one could make an argument for Boston being a primary city metro as well. Its own MSA definitely functions with it as by far the top dog. If one uses the CSA figure to boost Boston's standing though, it would be unfair to do so without noting Providence's significant contribution. Obviously Boston would clearly be the premier city but Providence is major in its own right. Providence is not like, say, Jersey City to New York or Gary to Chicago. Again, as I said before, none of this is an exact science.
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Old 09-27-2017, 07:49 AM
 
Location: Chicago
5,933 posts, read 6,566,066 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PerseusVeil View Post
Residents of the city of Chicago would not agree with you. So help you God if you're a suburbanite who claims to be from Chicago.

That being said, Chicago has crafted the image of Chicagoland with itself at the center. All the suburbs get caught up in its orbit. The city just happens to have contempt for all of those said suburbs.
Not sure about that one, Perseus. I think you might have a point for those within neighborhoods that are either downtown or relatively accessible to it.....Old Town, Gold Coast, Lincoln Park, River North, Bucktown, etc.

I'm not sure that people in places like Rogers Park, Edgewater, Edison Park, Jefferson Park would agree.

And, to a degree, there is even a feel that some suburban areas actually tick like the city does. I'm thinking more about Evanston than any place else which seems to have reached a point where there is an overlap feel to the place with various North Side lakefront neighborhoods.......Lake View, Lincoln Park, and the like.

I'm just of the belief that Chicago doesn't really end when you cross Howard into Evanston or Austin into Oak Park.

As for "Chicago has crafted the image of Chicagoland with itself at the center. All the suburbs get caught up in its orbit.", my spin on that one is this: Chicago is the ultimate concentric rings city emanating outward from the Loop and the greater downtown area. Chicago also is, the metro area most focuses on one core. Downtown Chicago, which I place from North Ave to Cermak Ave, from the lakefront to the United Center, is the single true core/critical mass in the metro area. Like Rome, all roads lead to Chicago in general and Chicago's downtown in particular. Our expressway system generally involves getting people from suburbia to downtown with few examples of routes that just serve suburban traffic. As for transit, our Metro system is a total spoke-and-whell system: all trains terminate downtown.

No metro area is so dominated by one core than Chicagoland is by downtown Chicago.
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Old 09-27-2017, 09:55 AM
 
29,962 posts, read 27,470,347 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KodeBlue View Post
I prefer MSAs as it seems to be the best indicator of the culture of a region. However, I do see why CSAs are used in certain instances, such as Raleigh-Durham, The Bay Area, Los Angeles-San Bernadino, Chicagoland, Hampton Roads, as they influence a broader area.
Hampton Roads doesn't have a CSA.
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Old 09-27-2017, 10:02 AM
 
Location: Baltimore, MD
3,512 posts, read 2,982,137 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
Hampton Roads doesn't have a CSA.
Actually, it does. It's the 32nd largest in the country and adds two micropolitan areas.
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Old 09-27-2017, 10:13 AM
 
909 posts, read 670,245 times
Reputation: 1205
Quote:
Originally Posted by KodeBlue View Post
Don't start tripping over your words now.

You wanted proof, you got proof, your own words no less. Lol
Only thing you have proven is how much you personally hate the idea of a DC-Baltimore CSA...the quotes you selected seem quite reasonable to me
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