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Old 09-29-2017, 07:32 PM
 
Location: BC Canada
831 posts, read 965,236 times
Reputation: 1123

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Quote:
Originally Posted by djesus007 View Post
I didn't read the whole thread, so excuse me if this was already mentioned. But besides U.S cities being car-centric, promote sprawl and not investing in transit infrastructure, I noticed when living in the states that people get looked down upon when using transit. So not only do we have urban planning failures, but also classist divides/attitudes of people who own cars v.s public transit users. Now with younger generations focusing more on transit/bike lanes, this point of view will decrease, but nonetheless, it's still a problem I find.
Agree completely and is similar to what I said earlier. In nearly all countries transit is viewed as an ESSENTIAL service while in the US, with very few exceptions, is viewed as a SOCIAL service. For most Americans taking transit is akin to be on welfare or food stamps because very few take transit because they want to but poverty has forced them into it. This also bears out in that blacks are far more likely to take transit than whites because they are not "choice" riders but rather dependent ones.

Transit in the US comes with a real social stigma in what is probably the West's most socially/economically/politically stratified country.
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Old 09-29-2017, 07:40 PM
 
4,961 posts, read 3,025,061 times
Reputation: 4552
Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4 View Post
Places like Pittsburgh, Hampton Roads, Denver, and Clevelands Mass Transit systems are like 80% publicly funded.
The vast majority of Public transit users ride the Bus on roads, 20% of Frieght miles (probably close to 100% of freight) is shipped by road.

Roads are not some suburban conspiracy.
That freight and transit could use 10% of the network.
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Old 09-29-2017, 07:46 PM
 
Location: Lone Mountain Las Vegas NV
14,216 posts, read 5,538,737 times
Reputation: 6379
Quote:
Originally Posted by mooguy View Post
Agree completely and is similar to what I said earlier. In nearly all countries transit is viewed as an ESSENTIAL service while in the US, with very few exceptions, is viewed as a SOCIAL service. For most Americans taking transit is akin to be on welfare or food stamps because very few take transit because they want to but poverty has forced them into it. This also bears out in that blacks are far more likely to take transit than whites because they are not "choice" riders but rather dependent ones.

Transit in the US comes with a real social stigma in what is probably the West's most socially/economically/politically stratified country.
Ahh comeon...basically silliness.

Everyone needs transit. The degree of utility and accessibility determines the usage. This is simple economics. Does the value equal or exceed the cost? I would love to have a chauffeured limousine awaiting me. Many decades ago I did that for real in Tokyo. Actually had a limo that followed us from place to place and was available at our whim. Very high value...but unworkable if you look at the cost.

So as the autonomous vehicles come on line the cost changes greatly. And therefore the things with a positive value will also change. And mostly rail goes away.
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Old 09-30-2017, 12:57 AM
 
Location: East Coast of the United States
18,352 posts, read 20,405,216 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mooguy View Post
Transit in the US comes with a real social stigma in what is probably the West's most socially/economically/politically stratified country.
It depends on where you live. In DC, NYC and other east coast cities, there is pretty much no stigma against using public transit - at least, not the subway/metro rail. People of all backgrounds use those, since they are often more convenient than driving.
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Old 09-30-2017, 07:46 AM
 
10,035 posts, read 10,072,342 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhays25 View Post
That freight and transit could use 10% of the network.
Any road with a buisness on it need freight. Roads are "last mile connectivity" is almost every supply chain.
On top of that heavy truck traffic by far does the most damage to roads so tacking on 100 camreys for every truck isn't a huge deal in terms of upkeep costs.
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Old 09-30-2017, 09:50 AM
 
Location: Montreal/Miami/Toronto
1,073 posts, read 729,100 times
Reputation: 1151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mooguy View Post
Agree completely and is similar to what I said earlier. In nearly all countries transit is viewed as an ESSENTIAL service while in the US, with very few exceptions, is viewed as a SOCIAL service. For most Americans taking transit is akin to be on welfare or food stamps because very few take transit because they want to but poverty has forced them into it. This also bears out in that blacks are far more likely to take transit than whites because they are not "choice" riders but rather dependent ones.

Transit in the US comes with a real social stigma in what is probably the West's most socially/economically/politically stratified country.

Not all cities have this stigma, but a good amount do honestly. When I was living in the states and would mention to others that I rely on transit, people always gave me that "oh he's poor" type of look. Keep in mind the city I used to reside in has one of the largest income gaps on the continent as well and has a GDPPC of $23K. So stigma amongst classes was very strong and noticeable. Another issue I have with this is how many major cities in the U.S hardly invest in transit, and reliability gets worse every year. Ironically, I went to a conference earlier this year on transit, and there were leaders from U.S cities and representation on behalf of governors, it was some sort of a think tank/ hybrid conference. Anyways, you see them preach X, Y, Z and in practise don't do a single thing they mentioned prior.
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Old 09-30-2017, 11:01 AM
 
Location: Earth
5,006 posts, read 3,387,924 times
Reputation: 3775
Quote:
Originally Posted by mooguy View Post
Agree completely and is similar to what I said earlier. In nearly all countries transit is viewed as an ESSENTIAL service while in the US, with very few exceptions, is viewed as a SOCIAL service. For most Americans taking transit is akin to be on welfare or food stamps because very few take transit because they want to but poverty has forced them into it. This also bears out in that blacks are far more likely to take transit than whites because they are not "choice" riders but rather dependent ones.

Transit in the US comes with a real social stigma in what is probably the West's most socially/economically/politically stratified country.
wtf?
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Old 09-30-2017, 04:09 PM
 
Location: SF, CA
1,673 posts, read 804,778 times
Reputation: 2658
Quote:
Originally Posted by mooguy View Post
Agree completely and is similar to what I said earlier. In nearly all countries transit is viewed as an ESSENTIAL service while in the US, with very few exceptions, is viewed as a SOCIAL service. For most Americans taking transit is akin to be on welfare or food stamps because very few take transit because they want to but poverty has forced them into it. This also bears out in that blacks are far more likely to take transit than whites because they are not "choice" riders but rather dependent ones.

Transit in the US comes with a real social stigma in what is probably the West's most socially/economically/politically stratified country.
You can also see stark race/class disparities within transit services in big metro areas. The SF area, where I live, is a prime example. The BART system, designed to carry suburbanites into downtown SF, gets the lion's share of funding, even though the major city bus systems actually carry more passengers. And over the decades, BART has spent billions extending its tracks further and further into the 'burbs, while doing nothing for residents of the urban core (SF/Oakland).
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Old 10-01-2017, 11:24 AM
 
Location: Chicago
300 posts, read 411,561 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by NW4me View Post
You can also see stark race/class disparities within transit services in big metro areas. The SF area, where I live, is a prime example. The BART system, designed to carry suburbanites into downtown SF, gets the lion's share of funding, even though the major city bus systems actually carry more passengers. And over the decades, BART has spent billions extending its tracks further and further into the 'burbs, while doing nothing for residents of the urban core (SF/Oakland).
In Chicago, the CTA/El which primarily serves the city, and the Metra, which primarily serves the suburbs, don't even connect. If I want to take the Metra out to the suburbs I have to take the el downtown, walk for a half mile (by the Sears/Willis tower) to get to the Metra system. And then, it's a second fare.
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Old 10-01-2017, 03:59 PM
 
Location: Greenville SC 'Waterfall City'
9,332 posts, read 4,635,813 times
Reputation: 3534
I don't think there is any stigma about riding a bus or a subway. Most people simply prefer to drive because it is more convenient.
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