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Center City Philadelphia is definitely one of the most premier living locations in the city. Extremely walkable and for the most part clean. In a lot of cities residential buildings are only now becoming popular. In Center City there are rowhomes on tree covered cobble stone streets from the 1700's only a few blocks away from towering skyscrapers. This diversity of uses and scale in Center City give it a vibe that few cities can match. Rittenhouse has been one the most expensive neighborhoods for many years. Another thing that makes Center City unique is that it connects to the outlying neighborhoods well. You can walk in every direction from city hall and it is a pleasant experience. The only exception is the 676 highway cut but that gap is slowly being bridged.
Other cities that I can think of that I have been to that have a similar feel is Boston. I haven't been to Chicago so I can't speak for it and NYC is on a completely different level.
Downtown LA CBD area is one of the desirable areas within a 5 mile radius. It is where most of the nice luxury apartments and high rise condos are popping up with rental prices that can rival desirable westside neighborhoods like Beverly Hills, Santa Monica, West Hollywood. Also have a Whole Foods and urban Target and many upper business/lux hotels. Most of the areas 5 miles away are mostly working to lower middle class areas or industrial zoned areas. Beyond 5 miles you start to get enter nice neighborhoods like Los Feliz, Silver Lake, Hancock Park, South Pasadena and so on
Center City Philadelphia was first to come to mind while reading the OP.
I get a laugh when local suburbanites rave about their small towns and trash the city of Philadephia .Places like Doylestown,West Chester,Media,Haddonfield,Moorestown etc etc. They are great towns but they are like 2-3 sq miles and have 6 or 7 sq block downtowns.
Many years ago I had somebody tell me Oh you will be blown away by Princeton its unbelievable. And Princetons is a great little town but I had to laugh, I told this person that Princeton has about is about 1% the size and charm as Center City Philly,
You could combine all the local suburban mainstreet usa towns in suburban Philadlephia and they would still pale in comparison to Center City Philly.
Any healthy city has core districts where housing costs multiples of the regional average per square foot. Some of that is about convenience (it's absolute heaven to walk to work) but some is people liking where they live.
Yeah I live in downtown Raleigh, it really is fantastic and will be even better once the publix at Glenwood south is finished. A grocery store is really all that is missing and downtown hasn't become too crowded with residents yet. I can walk everywhere and the Restaurant scene is really improving.
That new Publix will be less than 2 blocks from my condo in Raleigh. I'm looking forward to that. With that new massive development, I suspect that the Publix is just the tip of the iceberg of the development's offerings. Already my Raleigh address's walkscore is similar to my other home in South Beach.
Given that DT Raleigh is compact, it's easy to walk to different parts of it from the turn of the century SFH districts/neighborhoods that flank it west and east. As the very core offers more and more options to its immediate residents, the adjacent neighborhoods will have the same advantages with just a few more blocks to walk. All of those immediately adjacent neighborhoods already command high dollars and are very desirable. The SE corner of DT was not considered desirable until just the last several years. It's now under rapid and large scale "re-build" with luxury apartments, million dollar townhouses, and ultra-modern infill homes on narrow lots that sit side by side with fully renovated bungalows, etc.
...oh, and there's a second grocer announced downtown: Harris Teeter
I don’t think there are a lot of cities were downtown or the CBD offers one of the better residential living experiences. Many downtowns are becoming more residential, but they still don’t match up with the premier urban neighborhoods. What cities can/should count downtown as their premier residential neighborhoods. For the sake of discussion, let’s try to place reasonable limits on what we call downtown. I don’t want this to devolve into another discussion where someone tries to claim that all of Manhattan or Northwest DC is “downtown”.
You didn't give specific parameters, but Santa Clara, CA's downtown area is one of the best neighborhoods and is right next to the university. Very nice area and quite walkable.
Center City Philadelphia is definitely one of the most premier living locations in the city. Extremely walkable and for the most part clean. In a lot of cities residential buildings are only now becoming popular. In Center City there are rowhomes on tree covered cobble stone streets from the 1700's only a few blocks away from towering skyscrapers. This diversity of uses and scale in Center City give it a vibe that few cities can match. Rittenhouse has been one the most expensive neighborhoods for many years. Another thing that makes Center City unique is that it connects to the outlying neighborhoods well. You can walk in every direction from city hall and it is a pleasant experience. The only exception is the 676 highway cut but that gap is slowly being bridged.
Other cities that I can think of that I have been to that have a similar feel is Boston. I haven't been to Chicago so I can't speak for it and NYC is on a completely different level.
I don't think the OP would say Center City counts. Center City isn't Philly's CBD after all. Sure, it contains the CBD, but no one anywhere else in the country would call neighborhoods like Fitler Square, Society Hill, or even Washington Square or Old City part of a CBD, considering they're dominated by rowhouses.
I don't think the OP would say Center City counts. Center City isn't Philly's CBD after all. Sure, it contains the CBD, but no one anywhere else in the country would call neighborhoods like Fitler Square, Society Hill, or even Washington Square or Old City part of a CBD, considering they're dominated by rowhouses.
I can't think of any city in the US where the CBD, if you define it this narrowly, is also a premier residence area.
OP was inconsistent in setting "reasonable" limits, saying all of Northwest Washington or all of Manhattan would be beyond "downtown". The DC case is very reasonable since NW is a huge chunk of the District. The Manhattan case is not so clear-- there's 'downtown manhattan' but that's only the Chambers St to Battery area. Midtown is the central business district but there's plenty of business from the Battery all the way up into the sixties and 70s. I think it's reasonable to consider New York's Upper East and Upper West Sides as elite intown neighborhoods. People who live there see them that way. In Washington, Dupont Circle is central if not strictly CBD. In Philadelphia, Rittenhouse Sq and all around there plus Society Hill are elite center city neighborhoods. Ditto Beacon Hill and Back Bay in Boston. People walk to work from all these neighborhoods and isn't that a fair measure of living downtown, so to speak? Traditionally, downtown Boston is limited to the area between harbor and Common, which doesn't include Beacon Hill or Back Bay but again, that seems too restrictive to have a useful discussion. Beacon Hill is not only a premier central neighborhood, it is also the wealthiest residential area in the whole city of Boston. Same for New York-- the outer boroughs have many good neighborhoods but Upper East and West, along with other choice Manhattan addresses, are much wealthier than anything in Staten Island, Queens, Bronx or Brooklyn. In Philly the premier central areas have only one rival for status within city limits, Chestnut Hill. San Fran is so wealthy that it has premier neighborhoods like Nob Hill and Russian Hill adjacent to its CBD and even more premier neighborhoods, like Pacific Heights, farther out. Other cities have no elite downtown or near-downtown neighborhoods, at least not any more. Cleveland and Detroit had them once--Euclid Ave in Cleveland was millionaire's row--but the areas have long since transitioned into indifferent mixed industrial commercial areas. Smaller cities like Hartford had wealthy neighborhoods all around the CBD in 1890 -- South Green, Asylum Hill -- but suburbanization dispersed the wealthy people out to the western edge of the city and into the suburbs after 1920.
OTOH, what's changed a lot in recent years is people living in CBDs, especially downtown Manhattan but all these other downtowns too. In Manhattan it's partly a post-9/11 effect; commercial demand for space in so many office buildings was so weak that many have been redeveloped as residential properties. Downtown Boston has a similar trend. But, while those areas are becoming somewhat residential, they're a long way from being premier residence areas.
Last edited by missionhill; 01-19-2018 at 07:58 AM..
I'm genuinely curious as to what the turnover is like. I know it's anecdotal, but when I lived in Chicago (with the exception of South Loop), no one I knew stayed downtown for more than 1-2 years. They either left Chicago or moved to a more traditional residential neighborhood. I'd rather live in the Loop or River North than, say, Midtown Manhattan, but there are nearly a dozen Chicago neighborhoods I'd choose before downtown. I don't want to live in a place that's overrun by tourists and commuters, and I like having actual local businesses in the neighborhood. I know it's going to sound strange, but living downtown doesn't feel like Chicago living, the same way that Old Town, Gold Coast, Lincoln Park, Lakeview, Wicker Park, Bucktown, Logan Square etc would.
Totally agree. Yes, while downtown Chicago (I'm defining as Loop and River North) has been greatly improving over the years as a place to live; to your original post, in most people's opinions, I don't think Chicago would fit the criteria of a city whose downtown is one of the better residential neighborhoods. Subjectively, I would guess that most people would consider several neighborhoods (such as the ones you listed) in Chicago to be better residential neighborhoods than downtown.
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