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Old 04-02-2018, 04:41 PM
 
29,984 posts, read 27,517,120 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oobanks View Post
You can relax.Not saying its a good or a bad thing one way or another but if u visit Nashville you will see the level at which the city is changing and Jandrew is correct , it is at a much higher level than Charleston.. No one is trying to disclued Atlanta but its just not changing and Gentrifying as fast as Nashville. It seems to be really hard on it's older citizens and poor pushing them further out and not addressing the affordable housing issues fast enough..
The stats say Charleston is the fastest-gentrifying city in the South. If you disagree and think it's Nashville, then let me see your data or else specify that you're speaking in terms of raw numbers. Otherwise it's very much possible for gentrification to be occurring more extensively in Nashville yet more intensively in Charleston. Furthermore, since Charleston is a smaller city, it doesn't take as long for to get those demographic shifts as it does in a large consolidated city like Nashville. Also, the eye test that people rely on can be very deceiving as Charleston has height restrictions so it's not like Nashville where you can gawk at residential towers going up all over the place.

At any rate, the topic of the thread is CITIES (multiple) in the South gentrifying the fastest, so there's no need to minimize what's happening in another city by always tacking on "yeah but it's not like Nashville, it's not like Nashville, it's not like Nashville"--and yes, that is actually minimizing what's occurring in other cities. We can talk about the dynamics shaping development in each city without bringing Nashville into the discussion, which isn't even THE fastest. I'll stick with the stats on that, thank you very much.

Oh and if Nashville is having this big affordable housing crisis, why are you so enamored with it from a Black cultural perspective? We are mostly running *from* those cities, not *to* them. Whatever Black culture remains will only be artifacts of the past soooo...why are you so smitten with the place again?
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Old 04-02-2018, 05:40 PM
 
Location: ATLANTA
2,149 posts, read 1,444,279 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
The stats say Charleston is the fastest-gentrifying city in the South. If you disagree and think it's Nashville, then let me see your data or else specify that you're speaking in terms of raw numbers. Otherwise it's very much possible for gentrification to be occurring more extensively in Nashville yet more intensively in Charleston. Furthermore, since Charleston is a smaller city, it doesn't take as long for to get those demographic shifts as it does in a large consolidated city like Nashville. Also, the eye test that people rely on can be very deceiving as Charleston has height restrictions so it's not like Nashville where you can gawk at residential towers going up all over the place.

At any rate, the topic of the thread is CITIES (multiple) in the South gentrifying the fastest, so there's no need to minimize what's happening in another city by always tacking on "yeah but it's not like Nashville, it's not like Nashville, it's not like Nashville"--and yes, that is actually minimizing what's occurring in other cities. We can talk about the dynamics shaping development in each city without bringing Nashville into the discussion, which isn't even THE fastest. I'll stick with the stats on that, thank you very much.

Oh and if Nashville is having this big affordable housing crisis, why are you so enamored with it from a Black cultural perspective? We are mostly running *from* those cities, not *to* them. Whatever Black culture remains will only be artifacts of the past soooo...why are you so smitten with the place again?
What is your issue with blacks being fascinated or liking another city besides Atlanta, or the typical,,, are you serious right now. Not to mention why do we have to be obligated to put Atlanta on a pedestal on every conversation, especially all things black or we have to feel guilty if it's discluded?? I'm done babing u with the Atlanta pacifier..I was trying not to go there but you have been testing the waters for a min. We are getting off Subject here so I'm not going to let you take me there.. Peace my brother,
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Old 04-02-2018, 06:10 PM
 
29,984 posts, read 27,517,120 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oobanks View Post
What is your issue with blacks being fascinated or liking another city besides Atlanta, or the typical,,, are you serious right now. Not to mention why do we have to be obligated to put Atlanta on a pedestal on every conversation, especially all things black or we have to feel guilty if it's discluded?? I'm done babing u with the Atlanta pacifier..I was trying not to go there but you have been testing the waters for a min. We are getting off Subject here so I'm not going to let you take me there.. Peace my brother,
I didn't mention Atlanta ONE TIME in that post. You obviously missed it but my focus was primarily on Charleston as it is actually the fastest-growing city in the South right now. That is a statistical fact and if you dispute that, then let me see your data.

And I merely asked you a question about your obsession with Nashville; I never said anything about Atlanta or how you should only love Atlanta, etc. You're putting words in my mouth so obviously my question must have struck a nerve. You rant and rave about Nashville and how Black folks should give it a chance but then talk about how old and poor people are getting displaced, and we know those folks are primarily Black. So I'm just wondering what is it that you see in the place when Blacks are getting pushed out so fast? Of course Nashville isn't the only city experiencing rapid gentrification. Again, I'm primarily sticking up for Charleston here and you'd better believe it's Blacks getting the boot there too and while I love Charleston, I'm certainly not hyping it up as a hidden jewel for Black people. And then you have the "Black meccas" of DC and Atlanta with their gentrification issues but Black folks have a strong presence outside of the central cities in those metros. There are plenty of other cities with strong Black culture that are growing and developing without high levels of Black displacement (Charlotte, Raleigh/Durham, Houston, Dallas, etc) so I just asked what's so special about Nashville from a Black cultural perspective that makes up for gentrification running amok across the whole damn city? Before that tidbit was mentioned in this thread, when you would stan for Music City I would just be like "ok, he's infatuated with Nashville...more power to him." Now I'm like wait...what?!?!?! I get how a city that's developing and growing at such a brisk pace can be an exciting thing to witness, but if ALL the Black neighborhoods are being turned upside down, then why do you want Black folks to check it out and whatnot when it looks like the culture is finna be wiped out??? If I'm missing something, then tell me instead of getting defensive and falsely accusing me of coming at you sideways because you don't stan for the ATL. I damn near pissed my pants when I read that.
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Old 04-02-2018, 06:20 PM
 
Location: Atlanta metro (Cobb County)
1,575 posts, read 756,793 times
Reputation: 1679
Nashville is certainly experiencing gentrification, but my impression is that the lower economic status residents being displaced from the urban core are often moving to certain more outlying areas of the city, like Madison in the north and Antioch in the southeast. The city limits are very large as they are co-extensive with Davidson County (aside from a few independent enclaves). Much of outlying Nashville city is functionally suburban with a lot of multi-family housing from the '70s and '80s, and such communities are not typically gentrifying.

Moreover, most of the heavily developed suburban areas just outside of Nashville-Davidson are middle class to affluent so they wouldn't tend to draw those former urban residents looking for cheaper living. The one key exception is along the I-24 corridor in LaVergne and Smyrna on the southeast side.
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Old 04-02-2018, 06:25 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn the best borough in NYC!
1,991 posts, read 875,970 times
Reputation: 1111
Quote:
Originally Posted by oobanks View Post
What is your issue with blacks being fascinated or liking another city besides Atlanta, or the typical,,, are you serious right now. Not to mention why do we have to be obligated to put Atlanta on a pedestal on every conversation, especially all things black or we have to feel guilty if it's discluded?? I'm done babing u with the Atlanta pacifier..I was trying not to go there but you have been testing the waters for a min. We are getting off Subject here so I'm not going to let you take me there.. Peace my brother,
I see your point but the biggest culprit for this is actually Kodeblue! Not Mutiny77 lol!
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Old 04-02-2018, 06:36 PM
 
Location: ATLANTA
2,149 posts, read 1,444,279 times
Reputation: 1618
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
I didn't mention Atlanta ONE TIME in that post. You obviously missed it but my focus was primarily on Charleston as it is actually the fastest-growing city in the South right now. That is a statistical fact and if you dispute that, then let me see your data.

And I merely asked you a question about your obsession with Nashville; I never said anything about Atlanta or how you should only love Atlanta, etc. You're putting words in my mouth so obviously my question must have struck a nerve. You rant and rave about Nashville and how Black folks should give it a chance but then talk about how old and poor people are getting displaced, and we know those folks are primarily Black. So I'm just wondering what is it that you see in the place when Blacks are getting pushed out so fast? Of course Nashville isn't the only city experiencing rapid gentrification. Again, I'm primarily sticking up for Charleston here and you'd better believe it's Blacks getting the boot there too and while I love Charleston, I'm certainly not hyping it up as a hidden jewel for Black people. And then you have the "Black meccas" of DC and Atlanta with their gentrification issues but Black folks have a strong presence outside of the central cities in those metros. There are plenty of other cities with strong Black culture that are growing and developing without high levels of Black displacement (Charlotte, Raleigh/Durham, Houston, Dallas, etc) so I just asked what's so special about Nashville from a Black cultural perspective that makes up for gentrification running amok across the whole damn city? Before that tidbit was mentioned in this thread, when you would stan for Music City I would just be like "ok, he's infatuated with Nashville...more power to him." Now I'm like wait...what?!?!?! I get how a city that's developing and growing at such a brisk pace can be an exciting thing to witness, but if ALL the Black neighborhoods are being turned upside down, then why do you want Black folks to check it out and whatnot when it looks like the culture is finna be wiped out??? If I'm missing something, then tell me instead of getting defensive and falsely accusing me of coming at you sideways because you don't stan for the ATL. I damn near pissed my pants when I read that.
As u stated homeboy, the displacement is happening all over and not isolated to one particular city, in Atlanta, Nashville, Charleston or where ever.. Another thing, just because people are being displaced blacks are not leaving the city entirely, they are moving to other districts of the city, example Antioch or other areas of the metro like any other. I think you have jumped off topic to Attack me because of my view so I think it's time we get back on topic.. Ill let u run away with this on ur own because I know whats up..
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Old 04-02-2018, 06:42 PM
 
Location: ATLANTA
2,149 posts, read 1,444,279 times
Reputation: 1618
Quote:
Originally Posted by jas75 View Post
Nashville is certainly experiencing gentrification, but my impression is that the lower economic status residents being displaced from the urban core are often moving to certain more outlying areas of the city, like Madison in the north and Antioch in the southeast. The city limits are very large as they are co-extensive with Davidson County (aside from a few independent enclaves). Much of outlying Nashville city is functionally suburban with a lot of multi-family housing from the '70s and '80s, and such communities are not typically gentrifying.

Moreover, most of the heavily developed suburban areas just outside of Nashville-Davidson are middle class to affluent so they wouldn't tend to draw those former urban residents looking for cheaper living. The one key exception is along the I-24 corridor in LaVergne and Smyrna on the southeast side.
My point exactly, but we will let people be who they are by nature and take things to another level.. Just make sure u include my great city of Atlanta to keep the peace!!
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Old 04-02-2018, 07:47 PM
 
Location: 352
5,122 posts, read 3,904,644 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
Well the stats say Charleston is gentrifying the fastest, but again, gentrification simply doesn't look the same everywhere and you definitely have to take size differences into account.
What "stat" are you referring to. How do you objectively measure gentrification? Realtor named Charleston #1 a few years ago but if I recall, that was mainly measuring residential, and gentrification does not only refer to residential property values. And these kinds of rankings are subjective. I also don't know what all they were considering "Charleston" in the study. I promise you Charleston overall is not tops. Half of downtown can't even be gentrified. Of course that's my opinion, but by what I've seen, first hand, across the south the last few years, it's not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jas75 View Post
Nashville is certainly experiencing gentrification, but my impression is that the lower economic status residents being displaced from the urban core are often moving to certain more outlying areas of the city, like Madison in the north and Antioch in the southeast.
Apparently even Antioch is starting to slowly see a turnaround by what I've heard. That's where IKEA will be going in a few years and they're expecting a lot of new development with it. So those people may have to prepare to move down even more.
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Old 04-02-2018, 09:13 PM
 
29,984 posts, read 27,517,120 times
Reputation: 18578
Quote:
Originally Posted by oobanks View Post
As u stated homeboy, the displacement is happening all over and not isolated to one particular city, in Atlanta, Nashville, Charleston or where ever..
But as YOU stated, it's happening in Nashville the fastest...at warp speed, all over the city. You even talked about how a lot of Black folks were moving from Nashville to Atlanta because Atlanta is cheaper. Remember that?

Quote:
Another thing, just because people are being displaced blacks are not leaving the city entirely, they are moving to other districts of the city, example Antioch or other areas of the metro like any other. I think you have jumped off topic to Attack me because of my view so I think it's time we get back on topic.. Ill let u run away with this on ur own because I know whats up..
Your skin is pretty thin if you interpreted my inquiry as an attack. You could have easily just said "they are moving to a couple of suburbs" like two posts ago. There's absolutely no need to get in your feelings about being asked something that causes you to think a bit more.
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Old 04-02-2018, 09:54 PM
 
29,984 posts, read 27,517,120 times
Reputation: 18578
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jandrew5 View Post
What "stat" are you referring to. How do you objectively measure gentrification? Realtor named Charleston #1 a few years ago but if I recall, that was mainly measuring residential, and gentrification does not only refer to residential property values. And these kinds of rankings are subjective. I also don't know what all they were considering "Charleston" in the study. I promise you Charleston overall is not tops. Half of downtown can't even be gentrified. Of course that's my opinion, but by what I've seen, first hand, across the south the last few years, it's not.
Here's the summary of the methodology from the Realtor article from January of last year which proclaimed Charleston as the fastest-gentrifying city in the country:
So we looked at cities whose population was 50,000 or more between 2000 and 2015. Then we took a look at the U.S. Census Tracts—that's data-speak for neighborhoods of 1,200 to 8,000 people. We focused on lower-income areas with home values that had the potential for gentrification (excluding wealthier communities that had already arrived.) Then we compared home values as well as residents’ income and education levels in the years from 2000 to 2015, to assess which cities were seeing the biggest turnaround. (Want specifics on our methodology? Check 'em out at the end of the article).
https://www.realtor.com/news/trends/...g-the-fastest/

Now let's look at how gentrification is measured in a few other studies for the sake of comparison:
Gentrification is a highly charged issue, to say the least. Perhaps that's why a new analysis by Daniel Hartley, a research economist at the Cleveland Federal Reserve, has generated so much attention.

Hartley’s study used Census data to examine the extent of gentrification across America's 55 largest cities over the past decade. (His data track the change between the 2000 Census and the results of the 2005-9 American Community Survey, which he shorthands as 2007). He defines gentrification as a neighborhood (more precisely, a Census Tract) that moved from "the bottom half of the distribution of home prices in the metropolitan area to the top half between 2000 and 2007."
https://www.citylab.com/equity/2013/...e-others/7588/
The authors track gentrification in Philadelphia neighborhoods from 2002 to 2014—the period spanning the economic crisis—when gentrification and the back-to-the-city movement accelerated. (This timeline is important because most existing studies have only tracked gentrification up until 2000, when it was less widespread and housing pressures on urban neighborhoods were not as severe as today.) To measure gentrification, the study uses Census data for 1980, 1990, and 2000, along with the American Community Survey’s five-year estimates for Philadelphia census tracts from 2009-2013. Neighborhoods or tracts are considered “gentrifiable” if their median household income was below that of the city in 2000, while gentrifying tracts had a median household income and median increase in college-educated residents above that of the city between 2000 and 2013. The researchers include measures of violent crime and public school quality to gauge the effects on neighborhood quality of life.

Even more interestingly, the study employs unique data on the economic and financial situation of a random sample of more than 50,000 residents based on credit profiles collected by the Federal Reserve Bank of New York Consumer Credit Panel and Equifax (along with more detailed data from Philadelphia). This enables the researchers to closely track the economic and financial situation of people who move into and out of gentrifying neighborhoods, as well as the neighborhoods in which displaced residents end up.
https://www.citylab.com/equity/2015/...cement/413356/
In 2016, the city published the Los Angeles Index of Neighborhood Change, a map that allows users to explore the degree to which zip codes in Los Angeles experienced gentrification between 2000 and 2014. Using publicly-available data, pulled primarily from Census and American Community Survey (ACS) databases, the city calculated index scores for each zip code based on six demographic measures indicative of gentrification, including changes in income, education, race, rent, and household size.
https://datasmart.ash.harvard.edu/ne...your-city-1055
Tracts considered to have gentrified recorded increases in the top third percentile for both inflation-adjusted median home values and percentage of adults with bachelors’ degrees.
Washington, D.C., Gentrification Maps and Data
Housing price appreciation is also acknowledged as an indicator of
housing market activity (Ley 1986) associated with gentrification and has been
widely used in gentrification research (e.g. Covington & Taylor 1989, Freeman
2005). Hamnett (1984) states that gentrification will result in “significant price
appreciation in areas affected, both renovated and unrenovated.” Figueroa (1995)
exclusively utilizes housing prices to delineate gentrifying areas in Regina, Canada.
While an indicator of physical upgrading is not used in selecting gentrified areas,
median home value in gentrified areas in this study increased 167% from 1990-2000,
while in areas that did not gentrify it only increased 73%. Thus, the areas identified
as gentrifying by the criteria used appear to satisfy the physical upgrading criterion as
well.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...eHAGxQc8fci98x
In this article I consider a measure of gentrification based on neighborhood home values, and examine how this measure correlates with changes in credit scores and debt delinquency measures in gentrifying neighborhoods.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...YYUWEknjCDBhsQ

Seems to me the Realtor article uses three very important criteria to measure gentrification, and at least two of those same criteria are used in most other gentrification studies. The Realtor methodology appears sound to me and unless you're willing to crunch some numbers yourself, I'll take their word for it. I simply don't understand how you think your observations as a visitor to a couple of Southern cities trumps actual data analyzation. When you visit these cities, you already know the exact percentage of minority, poor, non-bachelor-degreed persons that live in every one of the city's neighborhoods? And after gentrification, you know exactly how much home values, median HHI, educational attainment rates, etc have changed?

Last edited by Mutiny77; 04-02-2018 at 10:03 PM..
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