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Old 10-12-2018, 09:32 PM
 
Location: Washington DC
3,827 posts, read 3,322,469 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Around View Post
Here's Downtown DC:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Do...!4d-77.0362937

As you can see, it doesn't include Georgetown, Foggy Bottom, Dupont Circle, the West End, etc.

I’m a little confused on why you quoted/responsed to my comment yet didn’t read what I posted?


It was such a short post, I’m sorta lost on to how you didn’t understand I was saying downtown as in “of, in, or characteristic of the central area or main business and commercial area of a town or city.” A generic, general term of the word downtown. Not just the area called Downtown in DC. The very map you posted (which I have to thank you for posting a map of where I live, I would’ve been lost without that information) pretty much shows there is zero distinction or transition between “Downtown” DC and the other portions of downtown DC such as Foggy Bottom, DuPont, etc as far as whether it’s downtown or not.

But if you ever refer to Charlotte, I’ll be quick to let you know Charlotte doesn’t have a downtown. It has an uptown. And I’ll give you a map too showing there is an uptown and not a downtown. If you want to be super technical about the names of downtowns.

Last edited by Charlotte485; 10-12-2018 at 09:42 PM..
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Old 10-12-2018, 09:56 PM
 
3,236 posts, read 1,567,005 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the resident09 View Post
Have you been to every city on the list to count the cranes and determine otherwise?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gantz View Post
1. That article and statistic is bogus. Those crane numbers are literally made up.
2. No one counts development by the number of cranes they see.
Some links do crane counts. But if it has pictures and addresses..... with renderings of the new high-rises to skyscrapers. It is legit to say they are as if a crane count too. .
Curbed Chicago does a new high-rises count every few months.
This was the last. Most in its Core. They would have cranes to count.

Shows Chicago at 49 high-rises to skyscrapers under-construction.

https://chicago.curbed.com/maps/high...nstruction-map
Quote:
Originally Posted by the resident09 View Post
It's not a barometer for anything, it's in Downtown! Across from the Staples Center.
Chicago's Convention Center mentioned .... isn't even in its Downtown. It's not in the City's portal as in its CBD. It's in what one could say its Core or Greater Downtown. Even its Museum Campus .... right there by it on the lakefront. Isn't included in the City's own link for its CBD. Yet some keep expanding DC's.

Heck, I remember threads some argued Old Town just north of the official CBD the city defines in its City Portal, should be included. Others claimed ... Oh "No Way". It's ALL residential and doesn't look like being a downtown. Yet even Chicago's Gold Coast of many high-rises along Lake Michigan. Has only like a couple blocks included as its Downtown. It even looks like it should be and ifs South Loop today. Is with many high-rise to skyscrapers .... technically isn't in it.

But DC keeps getting a bigger one claimed and claims of could be a 2nd or even 3rd ....

Also, the Capital grounds to the monuments and Whitehouse .... are the whole Nations as in OURS. That is WHY THEY ARE FREE to enter and see. They are in DC ..... but to calm as DCs to boast? Of course, if not for these museums etc. DC would have much fewer.
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Old 10-13-2018, 07:17 AM
 
9,841 posts, read 11,452,969 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gladhands View Post
This is going to devolve into one of those conversations where we insist that one city’s “downtown” is a quarter of its land area, while limiting some other city’s downtown to five square blocks.

Anyway, Boston and Miami are glaring omissions from the original post. Probably Atlanta, too.
Downtown should be based on the eye test for all cities. If everything is built with the same density and development intensity, it’s really one place. If 20 building’s that are all 15 stories line a street, is someone going to conclude that the neighborhood changes at the 10th building? This whole thread is ridiculous.

Visitors can tell when the intensity changes. If someone walks from Foggy Bottom to Golden Triangle to Midtown to Penn Quarter to Chinatown to Mt. Vernon Triangle to NOMA to Atlas District in DC you would be walking for hours and you would see the same level of development intensity the entire time.

Then if you walked past the Capitol down across the National Mall to L’Enfant Plaza to The Wharf to Waterfront Station to Capital Riverfront, the footprint would grow even larger.

Last edited by MDAllstar; 10-13-2018 at 07:27 AM..
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Old 10-13-2018, 07:32 AM
 
9,401 posts, read 9,563,269 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MDAllstar View Post
Downtown should be based on the eye test for all cities. If everything is built with the same density and development intensity, it’s really one place. If 20 building’s that are all 15 stories line a street, is someone going to conclude that the neighborhood changes at the 10th building? This whole thread is ridiculous.

Visitors can tell when the intensity changes. If someone walks from Foggy Bottom to Golden Triangle to Midtown to Penn Quarter to Chinatown to Mt. Vernon Triangle to NOMA to Atlas District in DC you would be walking for hours and you would see the same level of development intensity the entire time.

Then if you walked past the Capitol down across the National Mall to L’Enfant Plaza to The Wharf to Waterfront Station to Capital Riverfront, the footprint would grow even larger.
That’s not true. You can’t really tell when you go from Downtown to Back Bay or to the Bulfinch Triangle in the West End in Boston but they are absolutely different neighborhoods

Also that definition obviously favors DC over any other city because you can’t expect Philly to have a sea of 35 story buildings a big as DCs footprint of 10. So even if there was a drop off from 35 to 10 is that a cut off of Dowtown?

That’s applying completely different standards to different cities.
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Old 10-13-2018, 07:52 AM
 
9,841 posts, read 11,452,969 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4 View Post
That’s not true. You can’t really tell when you go from Downtown to Back Bay or to the Bulfinch Triangle in the West End in Boston but they are absolutely different neighborhoods

Also that definition obviously favors DC over any other city because you can’t expect Philly to have a sea of 35 story buildings a big as DCs footprint of 10. So even if there was a drop off from 35 to 10 is that a cut off of Dowtown?

That’s applying completely different standards to different cities.
There isn’t a drop off to 10 stories though. There is a drop off to 4-6 stories in a handful of cities and 2-4 stories in a larger group of cities and 1-2 stories in MOST cities. What city drops off to 10 stories and if so, where and for how far?

Outside of NYC, what city has neighborhoods outside their downtown with all buildings 10 stories or taller? I think most cities have buildings in downtown that are different heights, but the majority of buildings are taller than 4-6 stories. DC has a sprawling huge downtown footprint because for every 24-story building in a downtown, we have two 12-story buildings. That’s why our downtown footprint is double the size of most cities. They go up, we go out. In the future, they will continue to go higher, and we will continue to go out farther. That’s what height limits do. It’s why DC has gentrified so fast and why it will continue to do so. We are even building 10 story building’s across the river in Ward 7 and Ward 8 now because the core is all spoken for at this point.

Last edited by MDAllstar; 10-13-2018 at 08:01 AM..
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Old 10-13-2018, 07:58 AM
 
9,401 posts, read 9,563,269 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MDAllstar View Post
Downtown should be based on the eye test for all cities. If everything is built with the same density and development intensity, it’s really one place. If 20 building’s that are all 15 stories line a street, is someone going to conclude that the neighborhood changes at the 10th building? This whole thread is ridiculous.

Visitors can tell when the intensity changes. If someone walks from Foggy Bottom to Golden Triangle to Midtown to Penn Quarter to Chinatown to Mt. Vernon Triangle to NOMA to Atlas District in DC you would be walking for hours and you would see the same level of development intensity the entire time.

Then if you walked past the Capitol down across the National Mall to L’Enfant Plaza to The Wharf to Waterfront Station to Capital Riverfront, the footprint would grow even larger.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MDAllstar View Post
There isn’t a drop off to 10 stories though. There is a drop off to 4-6 stories in a handful of cities and 2-4 stories in a larger group of cities and 1-2 stories in MOST cities. What city drops off to 10 stories and if so, where and for how far?
Kendall square/West End/Southern Back Bay and the Seaport are all 100% not Downtown Boston and are 10+ stories all around.

Midtown Atlanta is mostly midrises and nobody considers it Downtown Atlanta.

By that Logic Downtown Miami streches about 100 miles up the coast.

Downtown/ West End St Louis
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Old 10-13-2018, 08:16 AM
 
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Some posters can't leave a CBD/Downtown be itself. Some cities have oldest neighborhoods grandfathered in as always there so..... Some have high-rise living areas the continue after its CBD Downtown. But are not placed into it.

But for some cities. Just vibrant neighborhoods with amenities to cater to its population.... right next to its CBD. Just considered part of it for a Grander effect.
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Old 10-13-2018, 08:18 AM
 
9,841 posts, read 11,452,969 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4 View Post
Kendall square/West End/Southern Back Bay and the Seaport are all 100% not Downtown Boston and are 10+ stories all around.

Midtown Atlanta is mostly midrises and nobody considers it Downtown Atlanta.

By that Logic Downtown Miami streches about 100 miles up the coast.

Downtown/ West End St Louis
Midtown Atlanta and downtown Atlanta is seemless. Somebody considering something to be a different neighborhood doesn’t mean a stranger visiting would have any idea you left one neighborhood and entered another. People in DC don’t call any neighborhood downtown. You are either going to Gallery Place/Chinatown, DuPont, The Wharf, Navy Yard, NOMA, Union Market, H Street, Penn Quarter, Foggy Bottom, Mt. Vernon Triangle, Logan Circle, etc., etc., etc. We don’t have a neighborhood called downtown. It’s all downtown.

Miami has one downtown, and then a very skinny strip of buildings that runs for miles. Those neighborhoods are dominated by smaller buildings and houses. If I walk for 1 minute and the development drops to all 2-4 story buildings like walking away from the coast in Miami, that’s not what I would consider a neighborhood and neither does the city of Miami.

Backbay is one neighborhood with different kinds of development. It’s not a neighborhood full of highrises.

Last edited by MDAllstar; 10-13-2018 at 08:27 AM..
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Old 10-13-2018, 08:24 AM
 
7,744 posts, read 4,590,691 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4 View Post
Kendall square/West End/Southern Back Bay and the Seaport are all 100% not Downtown Boston and are 10+ stories all around.

Midtown Atlanta is mostly midrises and nobody considers it Downtown Atlanta.

By that Logic Downtown Miami streches about 100 miles up the coast.

Downtown/ West End St Louis
If you’re looking at Chicago, along the lake, high-rise construction pretty much runs from Hyde Park all the way up to the Evanston border. It’s silly to base one’s definition of a downtown on structure, rather than function.

That said, I do believe in the concept of a “greater downtown”, and all of the Seaport District should probably be considered downtown Boston. And while Commonwealth Avenue, in the Back Bay, might not be an unambiguous part of the citiy’s downtown, Boylston clearly is.
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Old 10-13-2018, 08:29 AM
 
9,401 posts, read 9,563,269 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MDAllstar View Post
Midtown Atlanta and downtown Atlanta is seemless. Somebody considering something to be a different neighborhood doesn’t mean a stranger visiting would have any idea you left one neighborhood and entered another. People in DC don’t call any neighborhood downtown. You are either going to Gallery Place/Chinatown, DuPont, The Wharf, Navy Yard, NOMA, Union Market, H Street, Penn Quarter, Foggy Bottom, Mt. Vernon Triangle, Logan Circle, etc., etc., etc. We don’t have a neighborhood called downtown. It’s all downtown.

Miami has one downtown, and then a very tiny strip of buildings that runs for miles. Those neighborhoods are dominated by smaller buildings and houses. If I walk for 1 minute and the development drops to all 2-4 story buildings like walking away from the coast in Miami, that’s not what I would consider a neighborhood and neither does the city of Miami.
Okay so there is a fundaamentsl difference in how cities define Downtown. Even having Downtown Boston at ~.75 sq mile you’d be including areas that people would laugh at you for considering say the North End or the Seaport in “Downtown Boston” heck some don’t even count Chinatown, meaning downtown is about .25 sq miles, just Fidi and DTX

While some cities like DC seem to consider everything Downtown. (even Downtown Minneapolis is like 3 sq miles). And obviously Minneapolis’s CBD isn’t 6x bigger than Bostons

Last edited by btownboss4; 10-13-2018 at 08:38 AM..
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