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View Poll Results: Which offers a better quality of life?
The US 102 45.74%
Canada 100 44.84%
It's a tie 21 9.42%
Voters: 223. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-09-2018, 12:17 PM
 
Location: Boston, MA
11,725 posts, read 8,298,849 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
How about "the U.S. is not a placebo nation"?
I can live with that. I guess I just don’t like the tumor connotation.
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Old 11-09-2018, 01:30 PM
 
438 posts, read 162,781 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Be Proud View Post
??huh?


Whats strange is you would expect to see more inclusion but you don't.
This past election in Texas alone all 19 black women who ran for office for judge positions won their races.In Texas.

Now you talk about studies and such and say its the countries but which country are you more likely to see or hearmore of the things I have mentioned?
I am a perso who happens to be black,I id not make this distinction,Society did.So in dealing and realizing where the most promise is offered,why would I pick Canda as a place for me to flourish?
Perhaps if I were poor then I agree Canada is better.That seems to be where the problem starts when you want more from Canadian society
I do agree that minorities in the US may face more social hostility in some ways but yet have a greater chance to break glass ceiling than Canada (or other Anglophone countries for that matter).

I think minorities in the US are also just more vocal (and have more history) about making their mark, so even though Latino, African-American and also Asians often face questionable treatment in the US, they also are able to achieve many things- have many solid role models, etc..-more than would be the case as a minority in the other Anglophone countries.

Personal story, I am Asian-American, I have relatives in Canada and a few of them (born there) mention systemic discrimination, for instance- they have trouble becoming police officers up there, for whatever reason- hiring practices. In San Francisco, there is no shortage of Asian-American police officers of various levels.

The US has just more "extremes" in every angle of the meaning, and I do think as a country, the US still is "land of opportunity" in that regard.
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Old 11-09-2018, 02:31 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,672 posts, read 8,743,773 times
Reputation: 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by Be Proud View Post
??huh?

That quote is from your own article


I wouldnt say it unless I got it from a source,The US is here in this list as being one of the hardest to gain citizenship
https://www.investopedia.com/article...itizenship.asp
For Americans and Mexicans its easier as I said

https://www.canadavisa.com/nafta-wor...tml#gs._cOSWPE

Canada is a super liberal country,Id say thats not always good,
Everything in Canada is super expensive,I couldnt believe when I visited the grocery store in Mississauga while staying with a friend how very limited the selection was and how expensive things like American Cheese and milk was,Ridiculous.
Same when i went to the Duane Reade around the corner of another friend who lives off Jeanne Mance
Im not the biggest fan of the police but Toronto has one of the most corrupt police departments in North America.
I guess thats why Canada doesnt allow America dairy as your government gives heavy subsidies to protect dairy farmers.

Your largest city had the most vile racist man that made Trump look good as its mayor for many years.
A woman who was leader of a major party in Quebec pushed strong Nationalistic programs aimed at pushing out non native French speakers,
Discrimination among non French is relatively high in Quebec.

Gay Marriage is legal in every state so dont know what s your point.For all your liberal laws you would think you would see more Muslims,Latino,blacks and gays in high political positions andas CEO or executives.
I have a cousin that was beaten so badly in Toronto a few years ago.He was beaten because he had a white girlfriend.My cousin is from the South and he went all the way to Canada to get hospitalized due to a hate crime.

Two years ago I was in Toronto just before PRIDE visiting a very good friend who is Canadian by Jamaican parentage.
He actually lived in the US and only returned to Canada to take care of his mother who eventually died,Its been a decade since he has been back in Canada and he still wishes to come back to the US even though he actually is doing quite well.
He wants to go back because he and other blacks feel like the ceiling is much lower and harder for blacks to rise to the upper echelons of success as in America.
He says he and other black professionals complain about this all the time,One only needs to look across the board from politics to business and see it is even much whiter than it is in America.

He is a successful black gay male living in Toronto.A week after I came back I got this from another friend who lives in Montreal who saw this and sent it to me

https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/video?cli..._WVrbqnohHVqlU

One thing to pass laws but if there is no way to make sure they are enforced,its just an exercise in futility.

Whats strange is you would expect to see more inclusion but you don't.
This past election in Texas alone all 19 black women who ran for office for judge positions won their races.In Texas.

Now you talk about studies and such and say its the countries but which country are you more likely to see or hearmore of the things I have mentioned?
I am a perso who happens to be black,I id not make this distinction,Society did.So in dealing and realizing where the most promise is offered,why would I pick Canda as a place for me to flourish?
Perhaps if I were poor then I agree Canada is better.That seems to be where the problem starts when you want more from Canadian society
More immigration doesn't equal " easier to get into ". Canada's immigration is based on a point system. In fact we invented that system and is now used by other countries like Australia. Our immigrants have to meet higher thresholds than yours. In fact, Trump was looking at Canada's point system as a way of tightening your system.

https://www.canadavisa.com/comprehen...tml#gs.B9z8LjU

Grocery stores? Really, Canadian grocery stores have excellent selection, and is not " less " than US stores, perhaps just offering different products. Don't embarrass yourself by going there..besides " American Cheese " is not a thing in Canada. Milk is hormone free as well.

You are taking the " overall ' and pegging it to individual incidences. Not once did I say there aren't issues in Canada in regards to racism etc. What I did say ,and what is true, is that there is LESS violence in Canada than the US. Hence why the US ranks lower in QOL.

Laws are enforced.

I don't get what you mean wanting " more from Canadian society ". Unless you mean government help in welfare etc. Food stamps etc don't exist in Canada. People in Canada are far less reliant on government handouts, far less.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/merrill.../#3df2848b3e6c

Last edited by Natnasci; 11-09-2018 at 02:48 PM..
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Old 11-09-2018, 02:34 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,672 posts, read 8,743,773 times
Reputation: 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavePa View Post
Lots of stereotyping floated in this thread on especially the US having no Vail of services to the poor. Plenty on the US welfare rolls too. Most have free medical care. You need to really be poor, own little, especially be disadvantaged, have a disability of sorts, prison and arrest records that hamper hire-ability, emotional issues clearly a big issue, have young children that clearly puts you a sure-bet to get it. But PLENTY of rules that must be followed. Some break them and lose benefits. Most isn't without meeting minimum criteria regularly needing re-approvals.

Poor, disabled and poorer retired can apply for regional and state heating homes assistance that is many times donated funds etc.

Plenty on state disability rolls too. Emotional, drug abused caused and of course physical. Many also get free medical. My ex-wife is one. Years of emotional scares from childhood sexual abuse, had some physical issues but a major car accident added to it. Had hospitals drop forgive her bills even before disability.

Though we eventually did get back together ..... here issues remain all real, Her disability continues. But to continue to get the free medical portion..... we couldn't remarry. Under my insurance she would have to join. Much in doctor visits would be out-of-pock. Most in-hospital procedures and stays would be covered. But I'd be broke just on Psychiatrist visits. Plus specialist, medicine changes that each change to dosage and new med would be insurmountable.

Most states have a state sponsored insurance every child is covered as my state regardless of income. But higher incomes you pay a potion then. Every child has formula and other minimums paid by the state. You must apply of course for it.

The olé stereotype of generations on welfare is still true. But according to the Canadians. Poor get nothing in the US. One really false statement. Middle-class though do get least. They fall thru cracks in owning too much and risk of loosing it.

You also have funding to pay for care of family members who are Autistic and such for life. My Brother takes care of out 50 year old Autistic cousin. He must keep records of money spent. Very little is for more. My brother also gets a fee now to care for our 85-year old Mother. Keeping her out of a nursing home.

Finally county paid elderly care visits have others aid in her care, bathing and staying there while he shops etc.

All the small cities near me have government subsidized senior-citizen high-rises basically. Those especially relying on just Social security and mostly Widows .... live there in nice apartments the rest of ther lives. Services provided too.

That ALL IS NOTHING.
I haven't seen anyone posing that the poor in the US don't get help. In fact so many of you do, the article from Forbes says you are at a tipping point. Having more people reliant on government takes away points on QOL for a country. Social programs are not just handouts.
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Old 11-09-2018, 02:36 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,672 posts, read 8,743,773 times
Reputation: 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCityDreamer View Post
Canada is largely Americanized nowadays.

Most Americans don’t think there’s that much difference between the U.S. and Canada, except that the U.S. has 9 times the population. Canada is basically that quiet country up north.
Americanized? Certainly pop culture and entertainment is very present, but our institutions, our politics, our form of government, our public school, system, our post-secondary school system, our gun laws and our views on guns, and definitely our political views and our views on the role of government are VERY different from most Americans.

Here's a bit of silly article, but it makes the point on employment alone.

https://www.businessinsider.com/diff...an-americans-5
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Old 11-09-2018, 02:39 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,672 posts, read 8,743,773 times
Reputation: 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Joshua View Post
If you take the first two definitions then you said that the US in neither gentle nor kind.
Americans can be gentle and kind. Like anyone. The actions of your country, are not always benign.
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Old 11-09-2018, 02:50 PM
 
926 posts, read 313,549 times
Reputation: 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by krosser100 View Post
I do agree that minorities in the US may face more social hostility in some ways but yet have a greater chance to break glass ceiling than Canada (or other Anglophone countries for that matter).

I think minorities in the US are also just more vocal (and have more history) about making their mark, so even though Latino, African-American and also Asians often face questionable treatment in the US, they also are able to achieve many things- have many solid role models, etc..-more than would be the case as a minority in the other Anglophone countries.

Personal story, I am Asian-American, I have relatives in Canada and a few of them (born there) mention systemic discrimination, for instance- they have trouble becoming police officers up there, for whatever reason- hiring practices. In San Francisco, there is no shortage of Asian-American police officers of various levels.

The US has just more "extremes" in every angle of the meaning, and I do think as a country, the US still is "land of opportunity" in that regard.
Growing up in the small Southern town I had only one Asian friend.There just were not many at all.His name was Saikon(sure I misspelled that).He was Japanese and didnt have many friends as his English was horrible but we were close until he moved away a year later in 5th grade.
Ive always been patient and I tried harder than many of the other students to try and understand him so that would explain that I guess

Over the years I now live in a diverse city,I have many friends from all ethnicity and races. In fact the many of my friends are South Asian(India/Bengali).My best friends are South Asian,African American,Algerian,French.
People I dont just "know" but I consider like brothers as do they towards me as well.

It was'nt till I went to San Francisco for the first time as a 20 year old did I see Asians not in those stereotypical roles.As you stated, I saw Asian police and trash men,mechanics etc.I was actually bewildered but in humanized a race I had very little interaction with.
Also considering this wasnt too long after Rodney King that Korean American relations were at it all time low as they were seen as predatory in the way they did business in black communities.
People forget how bad that was .Korean store owners and their families were being attacked and targeted across the U.S.

I remember Korean store owners started getting wise and living in the communities and getting to know there customers by being more friendly.
I see this even today when i go to some of those areas how they really get involved with the community.
Iabout 8 years ago when i lived in the hood flipping house there was a small Korean owned store where the father of a family owned store was shot and killed brutally.The community was outraged and on the news there gave such an outpouring of support.
People were really outraged and demanded justice.This community really loved the store owner as he always looked out for some of the poorer residents that could not always pay.
There was one guy who was the most "thuggish" hard core black guy you would ever see basically said in the interview that they would find whoever did that and they would "get what they deserved".

The US gets a perceived notion that its more racist due to all the Incidents like Rodney King and now all the current police stuff but it happens all over the Western world,Especially Canada.
Im not picking on Canada as I said i go there quite often and love it BUT Canadians often have there head in the sand when it comes to racial inequality.Much like how Europe is.
I will always contend that America assimilates people better in society than any other Western Country in the world
I agree with you.Limitations of race are easier to overcome in the U.S. and for me that makes all the difference in what kind of quality of life I can live
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Old 11-09-2018, 03:07 PM
 
926 posts, read 313,549 times
Reputation: 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post
More immigration doesn't equal " easier to get into ". Canada's immigration is based on a point system. In fact we invented that system and is now used by other countries like Australia. Our immigrants have to meet higher thresholds than yours. In fact, Trump was looking at Canada's point system as a way of tightening your system.

https://www.canadavisa.com/comprehen...tml#gs.B9z8LjU

Grocery stores? Really, Canadian grocery stores have excellent selection, and is not " less " than US stores, perhaps just offering different products. Don't embarrass yourself by going there..besides " American Cheese " is not a thing in Canada. Milk is hormone free as well.

You are taking the " overall ' and pegging it to individual incidences. Not once did I say there aren't issues in Canada in regards to racism etc. What I did say ,and what is true, is that there is LESS violence in Canada than the US. Hence why the US ranks lower in QOL.

Laws are enforced.

I don't get what you mean wanting " more from Canadian society ". Unless you mean government help in welfare etc. Food stamps etc don't exist in Canada. People in Canada are far less reliant on government handouts, far less.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/merrill.../#3df2848b3e6c
Hardly embarrassing myself.Its what I saw and if American cheese wasnt a "thing" in Canda why is it on burgers many times just like in the U.S.?
Hormone free milk is available here as well so again not sure where you are going with that.I go into a grocery store here and there are several types of milk products from Dairy,Organic,Cashew,2%.1% whole etc and different brands at that.

Yes you totally misunderstood my point about wanting more from society.Meaning inclusion.

So now the US has benefits for the poor?Which is it?A minute ago you were going on about how people in Canada have benefits Americans dont.You make it sound like US is a third world country.

Do you think if Canada was as populated as the US they could provide the same level of healthcare they do now?
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Old 11-09-2018, 03:17 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,672 posts, read 8,743,773 times
Reputation: 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by krosser100 View Post
I do agree that minorities in the US may face more social hostility in some ways but yet have a greater chance to break glass ceiling than Canada (or other Anglophone countries for that matter).

I think minorities in the US are also just more vocal (and have more history) about making their mark, so even though Latino, African-American and also Asians often face questionable treatment in the US, they also are able to achieve many things- have many solid role models, etc..-more than would be the case as a minority in the other Anglophone countries.

Personal story, I am Asian-American, I have relatives in Canada and a few of them (born there) mention systemic discrimination, for instance- they have trouble becoming police officers up there, for whatever reason- hiring practices. In San Francisco, there is no shortage of Asian-American police officers of various levels.

The US has just more "extremes" in every angle of the meaning, and I do think as a country, the US still is "land of opportunity" in that regard.
I live in Vancouver. We had a Police Chief of Chinese descent. I see many asian police etc. I highly doubt that there is systemic discrimination going on. Minorities in Canada would be VERY vocal about it if they believed there was. Certainly the police chief would of brought it up.

I can't find numbers for the VPD, but SFPD is about 16 percent asian, but they don't break asian down.

I also think, just assuming that there are darker forces at work because of the ethnic make-up of a police force, without taking into consideration possible other things at play, isn't definitive.
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Old 11-09-2018, 03:18 PM
BMI
 
Location: Ontario
7,261 posts, read 4,494,437 times
Reputation: 5593
Quote:
Originally Posted by krosser100 View Post
I do agree that minorities in the US may face more social hostility in some ways but yet have a greater chance to break glass ceiling than Canada (or other Anglophone countries for that matter).

I think minorities in the US are also just more vocal (and have more history) about making their mark, so even though Latino, African-American and also Asians often face questionable treatment in the US, they also are able to achieve many things- have many solid role models, etc..-more than would be the case as a minority in the other Anglophone countries.

Personal story, I am Asian-American, I have relatives in Canada and a few of them (born there) mention systemic discrimination, for instance- they have trouble becoming police officers up there, for whatever reason- hiring practices. In San Francisco, there is no shortage of Asian-American police officers of various levels.

The US has just more "extremes" in every angle of the meaning, and I do think as a country, the US still is "land of opportunity" in that regard.
Not true.

The Toronto Police Force is actively encouraging minorities to join the force.
They are hiring a lot of visible minorities to better reflect the ethic makeup of the city.

Canada best known police force...The RCMP....”the Mounties” ...same thing,
they now allow Sikh’s to wear a turban in lieu of the tradition hat.

Sky is the limit for visible minorities in Canada, no different than in USA,
just google Michael Lee-Chin.....he started off very poor and became a billionaire in Canada.
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