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Old 12-07-2018, 03:34 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
943 posts, read 414,357 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Usrname View Post
It's not really possible to buy a stick built home on as little as half acre anywhere in the Western states for under 100K, right now, starting from W. South Dakota and West from there.
One may see real estate listings but it's 100% going to be some major issue with the home (water issue, total fixer, meth lab, mold, unpermitted, etc). May be few legit homes in NM.
At the same time, there're quite a few homes on large lots to chose from in the eastern half of the country.

Half acre is a small lot size for out-of-town home....why is land so expensive in the West?
Is it the climate? Plenty of cold winters, snow, extremely hot or extremely rainy/overcast climates in the West.
Is it scenic views? Plenty of homes are located in dusty deserts, steppes, no forest, mountains or water body anywhere really close.
Lack of natural hazards? Plenty of homes (most!) are in earthquake, wildfire or flash flooding zones.
Clean environment? Not everywhere West for sure.
Medical care is pretty horrendous here, it can't be the attraction.
Amenities, infrastructure? Rural homes in the middle of nowhere with 1.5 hour drive to civilization are similarly priced.
Most of rural homes in the West are at risk of ending up without water/needing new super-expensive well, water table is 100s of feet below and water is often bad.
Why in the world are land and home prices so high all over Western states? Can't figure out what's the attraction here, unless you're somewhere right in a very scenic area.
Is it the lack of bugs??
Since the West is so arid, it is harder to sustain a population of life. The water table issue you mentioned is prevalent in AZ although AZ is a cheap state. The water table issues can cost a lot of money in AZ too. West is expensive, because of the high demand of people wanting to live in the desert. You need to get the water from a far away source and transport it across the arid West. Yes, the West is notorious for still being expensive in rural areas.

California is super expensive, because of it's super high 39 million people population. I can't understand how California can even have water in the first place with 39 million people drawing most of it out. California is expensive, because of it's issues too such as traffic, earthquakes, and mudslides in such a super desirable area.

I've been on Zillow.com and narrowed my search options to houses 100K and below. You can find a good amount of houses in the West under 100K, but not so much to consider the West as "cheap". When I move out on my own, I plan on getting a house below 100K. Having a big house and a lot of land is no object for me anyway. I don't plan on having kids and that means I can just stick to small houses.
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Old 12-07-2018, 03:40 PM
 
367 posts, read 269,463 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by potanta View Post
Since the West is so arid, it is harder to sustain a population of life. The water table issue you mentioned is prevalent in AZ although AZ is a cheap state. The water table issues can cost a lot of money in AZ too. West is expensive, because of the high demand of people wanting to live in the desert. You need to get the water from a far away source and transport it across the arid West. Yes, the West is notorious for still being expensive in rural areas.

California is super expensive, because of it's super high 39 million people population. I can't understand how California can even have water in the first place with 39 million people drawing most of it out. California is expensive, because of it's issues too such as traffic, earthquakes, and mudslides in such a super desirable area.

I've been on Zillow.com and narrowed my search options to houses 100K and below. You can find a good amount of houses in the West under 100K, but not so much to consider the West as "cheap". When I move out on my own, I plan on getting a house below 100K. Having a big house and a lot of land is no object for me anyway. I don't plan on having kids and that means I can just stick to small houses.
Yes, desert can sustain only that many people....and coastal CA large cities water issues are notorious too.
Wildfire issue is big too now, and after Paradise fire entirely new wildfire insurance model is to come, I think.

For < 100K one can not get a house in the West (except some are left in NM, in hot desert) , unless on a VERY small lot like may be 7000 sq ft (and to me lot size has nothing to do with kids, which I don't plan to have either) and even then most likely in very undesirable location like next to a junkyard or with druggie neighbors....don't trust Zillow, a lot of houses with major issues are listed at lower price range, can be another 100K in correcting these issues or just tear-down scenario. They don't tell about this in the listing. Nothing in the lowest price range on zillow can be touched with a 100 foot pole, except by flippers. If you see a decent-looking <100K house on zillow (Western states)...in person it'll be another picture, like taken over by mold or smell of meth lab.

Last edited by Usrname; 12-07-2018 at 03:49 PM..
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Old 12-07-2018, 03:54 PM
 
Location: North Dakota
7,737 posts, read 9,030,452 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James Bond 007 View Post
Mountains and other scenery.
This.
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Old 12-07-2018, 05:30 PM
 
Location: Kansas City, MISSOURI
9,013 posts, read 2,735,231 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Usrname View Post
In most of them you'd either never see the mountains (unless you're in a high rise on driving on elevated highway, buildings obscure the view) or see them not that often while in the city....In PWN, any mountain view is usually covered by the clouds, in LA...smog. I love mountains, camp in them a lot, but find mountain views even from your house window or lot get really old really fast, once you realize how much this costs you.
It's not necessary to be able to see them absolutely everywhere you go. I mean, when you're sitting at your desk at work playing with spreadsheets or whatever, you aren't going to need to have a view of some mountains, because you're busy doing something else. Or when you're in your house you don't absolutely need to see the mountains from your living room window. A nice glimpse of some mountains driving on certain roads is usually good enough. Plus, lots of people like to be able to take a quick drive out to the mountains on the weekend if they want to.
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Old 12-07-2018, 09:23 PM
 
367 posts, read 269,463 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James Bond 007 View Post
It's not necessary to be able to see them absolutely everywhere you go. I mean, when you're sitting at your desk at work playing with spreadsheets or whatever, you aren't going to need to have a view of some mountains, because you're busy doing something else. Or when you're in your house you don't absolutely need to see the mountains from your living room window. A nice glimpse of some mountains driving on certain roads is usually good enough. Plus, lots of people like to be able to take a quick drive out to the mountains on the weekend if they want to.
I believe you (though myself can't understand paying a lot of extra for occasional mountain exposure). Liking for the mountains itself isn't surprising, but usually the number of people who're hellbent on being somewhere close to the mountains is pretty stable. Colorado homes, however, went up in price almost twice since both 2011 and pre-recession 2005 - very big increase (I don't believe there's any real backing value in these prices, and do expect them to crash). Parks and campgrounds tend to be very crowded in the West now, which also nullifies enjoyment of living here... well there's weed legalization factor here too, but still (tech doesn't pay that well in CO).

Last edited by Usrname; 12-07-2018 at 09:51 PM..
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Old 12-08-2018, 12:01 AM
 
2,549 posts, read 1,639,165 times
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Lack of land that accessible to water/utilities compared to demand.
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Old 12-08-2018, 12:25 AM
 
Location: San Angelo, TX
1,781 posts, read 2,986,802 times
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Less than 100k, look at houses in small "satellite" towns near large cities. Los Lunes or Belen near Albuquerque. Silver City and Deming to El Paso. Weatherford or Mineral Wells to DFW. Wichita, KS. Pueblo, CO and Laramie, WY to Denver. Pocotello, ID to Boise. Briggs, ID to Jackson Hole, WY. Helena, MT near Bozeman. Like the old saying: don't live in the fancy resort town, live in the town near the fancy resort town.
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Old 12-08-2018, 10:51 AM
 
367 posts, read 269,463 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danbo1957 View Post
Less than 100k, look at houses in small "satellite" towns near large cities. Los Lunes or Belen near Albuquerque. Silver City and Deming to El Paso. Weatherford or Mineral Wells to DFW. Wichita, KS. Pueblo, CO and Laramie, WY to Denver. Pocotello, ID to Boise. Briggs, ID to Jackson Hole, WY. Helena, MT near Bozeman. Like the old saying: don't live in the fancy resort town, live in the town near the fancy resort town.
Thank for the tip...but these are very non-hospitable (and non-scenic, parched) environments, lacking water/well/water quality issues, and also wouldn't want live on anything less than several acres. Jackson Hole is very expensive btw, LOL, there's nothing to be had there or close. (and there're no livable houses in whole ID for 100K even on small lots...only "contractor special")

I posted this thread about general driving forces behind home pricing -- it's not about my personal housing search, not going to buy here. (I could easily live in the most expensive locations in the West, because of my profession, if I took mortgage, but this wouldn't allow me to get nearly enough land to be comfortable, neither I'd want to take any mortgage/not my cup of tea, this is just me personally...want to own-free-and-clear and against corporate slavery, also free to travel the world, and can own outside the US right "in the mountains" for small $).

Just interested in dynamics/what drives RE prices in the West....what makes people migrate here, despite low quality of life here and overcrowding. With upcoming recession (pretty sure on this one), don't new buyers, whole whole equity is in their house/usual scenario now, feel anxiety. It's not about 100K figure (can replace this with 90K or 120K -- this is just general question about Western price increases...foreclosures used to be sitting at 30K all over few years ago and just a little later people take on debt fearlessly).

So far all answers had been very helpful in identifying the factors (though I personally believe there's strong tulip mania factor as well). I've read an article about hype created among Millenials for some locations (like CO)...I think this is very accurate, seems like there's "cool city" hype driving some of these moves.

Last edited by Usrname; 12-08-2018 at 11:32 AM..
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Old 12-08-2018, 03:00 PM
 
Location: Erie, PA
2,865 posts, read 1,258,732 times
Reputation: 6454
Quote:
Originally Posted by Usrname View Post
Thank for the tip...but these are very non-hospitable (and non-scenic, parched) environments, lacking water/well/water quality issues, and also wouldn't want live on anything less than several acres. Jackson Hole is very expensive btw, LOL, there's nothing to be had there or close. (and there're no livable houses in whole ID for 100K even on small lots...only "contractor special")

I posted this thread about general driving forces behind home pricing -- it's not about my personal housing search, not going to buy here. (I could easily live in the most expensive locations in the West, because of my profession, if I took mortgage, but this wouldn't allow me to get nearly enough land to be comfortable, neither I'd want to take any mortgage/not my cup of tea, this is just me personally...want to own-free-and-clear and against corporate slavery, also free to travel the world, and can own outside the US right "in the mountains" for small $).

Just interested in dynamics/what drives RE prices in the West....what makes people migrate here, despite low quality of life here and overcrowding. With upcoming recession (pretty sure on this one), don't new buyers, whole whole equity is in their house/usual scenario now, feel anxiety. It's not about 100K figure (can replace this with 90K or 120K -- this is just general question about Western price increases...foreclosures used to be sitting at 30K all over few years ago and just a little later people take on debt fearlessly).

So far all answers had been very helpful in identifying the factors (though I personally believe there's strong tulip mania factor as well). I've read an article about hype created among Millenials for some locations (like CO)...I think this is very accurate, seems like there's "cool city" hype driving some of these moves.
I agree that it probably is a bubble and the 'cool city' hype is definitely a driver in some of the moves happening.

In some of the cities like Denver, $150K might get you a condo with 750 square feet. I'm looking at a place here now for the same price that's 4200 sq feet with a garage with a large pond on the property & wooded lot I agree that having land is very important.

I'm not sure about the West either. It's dry, much of it is brown/dried up, and there's already major water shortages. I would never want to live in a place that was prone to drought or did not have greenery.

My company uses quite a few interns (engineering, R&D, Web Developer) and I would say of the ones moving away from here, 90% of them are going West. They commonly say that it is 'better' out West or feel that there is more out there for them. I'm not sure where they get that as most of them have never been outside of Erie prior to making this statement.
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Old 12-08-2018, 03:51 PM
 
367 posts, read 269,463 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marie Joseph View Post
I agree that it probably is a bubble and the 'cool city' hype is definitely a driver in some of the moves happening.

In some of the cities like Denver, $150K might get you a condo with 750 square feet. I'm looking at a place here now for the same price that's 4200 sq feet with a garage with a large pond on the property & wooded lot I agree that having land is very important.

I'm not sure about the West either. It's dry, much of it is brown/dried up, and there's already major water shortages. I would never want to live in a place that was prone to drought or did not have greenery.

My company uses quite a few interns (engineering, R&D, Web Developer) and I would say of the ones moving away from here, 90% of them are going West. They commonly say that it is 'better' out West or feel that there is more out there for them. I'm not sure where they get that as most of them have never been outside of Erie prior to making this statement.
I see about interns....pretty funny, yes, I think they's certain hype. Even grown adult professionals often live with roommates in those cities... It's all good while economy is going strong, but recession is likely. New bubbling markets like Denver don't have long tradition rooted in tech, unlike SF Bay area, which weathered the recession and Dot com bust.
I heard in Denver even condos go for like 300K now...150K might be in "bad part of town".
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