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Old 01-05-2019, 09:50 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70 View Post
I've only visited Winston-Salem briefly but the fact that its a major college town makes it pretty open.
I was asking NDFan how Winston-Salem was a "usual suspect" along with Atlanta, Charlotte, and Raleigh, three of the fastest-growing metros in the South with transplants from all over; Winston-Salem is not in that mold. I can think of several other Southern cities that are true "major college towns" (I wouldn't classify Winston-Salem as such) so I'm not sure that was his reasoning. I'm not saying it's the most insular city out there but I really wouldn't say it's "pretty open" either.
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Old 01-05-2019, 10:04 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Iconographer View Post
Plus it has its share of tourist traffic passing through.

https://www.visitnc.com/greensboro-w...RoCO_gQAvD_BwE

I don't think of W-S as insular at all.
Macon has tourist traffic passing through as well but I don't really see how that makes a place less insular.

I don't think of Winston-Salem as insular either but it's most certainly not among the least insular Southern cities. Historically the city's business leaders have taken a much more conservative approach to growth and expansion compared to Charlotte, which has managed to gobble up several Winston-based businesses and institutions over the years. Winston-Salem had a head start on both Charlotte and Raleigh and could've easily been top dog in NC today but that's not really what the powers-that-be wanted, which conveys a certain sense of insularity to me.
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Old 01-05-2019, 01:02 PM
 
Location: St Simons Island, GA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
Macon has tourist traffic passing through as well but I don't really see how that makes a place less insular.

I don't think of Winston-Salem as insular either but it's most certainly not among the least insular Southern cities. Historically the city's business leaders have taken a much more conservative approach to growth and expansion compared to Charlotte, which has managed to gobble up several Winston-based businesses and institutions over the years. Winston-Salem had a head start on both Charlotte and Raleigh and could've easily been top dog in NC today but that's not really what the powers-that-be wanted, which conveys a certain sense of insularity to me.
Macon a tourist destination? News to me. They're passing through, all right...to Florida and Savannah.
Winston-Salem has some viable attractions, at least: Old Salem( NC's answer to Williamsburg), Reynolda House Museum (a favorite of yours truly) and the incredible Reynolda Gardens at Wake Forest. It also has a vibrant downtown. Tourist interaction with locals would certainly help to mitigate insularity, and W-S would appear to offer more attractions than many of its Southern peers.
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Old 01-05-2019, 01:32 PM
 
Location: North Caroline
258 posts, read 128,552 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iconographer View Post
Macon a tourist destination? News to me. They're passing through, all right...to Florida and Savannah.
Winston-Salem has some viable attractions, at least: Old Salem( NC's answer to Williamsburg), Reynolda House Museum (a favorite of yours truly) and the incredible Reynolda Gardens at Wake Forest. It also has a vibrant downtown. Tourist interaction with locals would certainly help to mitigate insularity, and W-S would appear to offer more attractions than many of its Southern peers.
I agree with both of you. I don't think Winston is particularly insular or non-insular. As Iconographer mentioned, W-S has some spectacular attractions for visitors, even beating out cities with higher populations in this regard, but I wouldn't put it in the same category as Raleigh or Charlotte when it comes to "openness," even accounting for tourism. Mutiny has a point about the historical economic decline of W-S relative to its sister cities in NC, but this has been changing recently with projects like the Wake Forest Innovation Quarter and downtown redevelopment: https://www.politico.com/magazine/st...co-town-214377

Perhaps it was for the best Winston didn't grow enormously like Raleigh and Charlotte did during the latter half of the 20th century, though, as there is a lot to preserve historically about W-S that might have been been mismanaged/jeopardized otherwise.
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Old 01-05-2019, 02:22 PM
 
29,902 posts, read 27,345,109 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iconographer View Post
Macon a tourist destination? News to me. They're passing through, all right...to Florida and Savannah.
Winston-Salem has some viable attractions, at least: Old Salem( NC's answer to Williamsburg), Reynolda House Museum (a favorite of yours truly) and the incredible Reynolda Gardens at Wake Forest. It also has a vibrant downtown. Tourist interaction with locals would certainly help to mitigate insularity, and W-S would appear to offer more attractions than many of its Southern peers.
I'm aware of Winston-Salem's attractions and sites of interests but it's not really a tourist destination. When you said it has tourist traffic "passing through," I thought you meant that literally...as in driving straight through town to get to the mountains or the beach. That's why I mentioned Macon and said I didn't see the relevance of having tourists pass through (on their way to other places).

Anyway, all of this is helping to prove my point. If Winston-Salem were a "usual suspect" a la Atlanta, Charlotte, and Raleigh, you wouldn't have to make the case for it. It's not among the most insular Southern cities but it also doesn't belong in the same group as Atlanta, Charlotte, Raleigh, etc as the least insular. It's the odd man out in that list and plenty of other Southern cities are ahead of it in the least insular category. I'd even say its next door neighbor, Greensboro, is less insular but I certainly wouldn't say it is among the least insular Southern cities.
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Old 01-05-2019, 04:18 PM
 
Location: North Caroline
258 posts, read 128,552 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
I'd even say its next door neighbor, Greensboro, is less insular but I certainly wouldn't say it is among the least insular Southern cities.
What makes you say that, Mutiny? Not that I disagree-- just curious about your rationale.
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Old 01-05-2019, 04:52 PM
 
29,902 posts, read 27,345,109 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TarHeelTerritory View Post
What makes you say that, Mutiny? Not that I disagree-- just curious about your rationale.
Greensboro seems to desire and embrace growth more, it has seemingly invested more in big-ticket amenities in its downtown over the past couple of years (two parks, ballpark, civil rights museum, PAC) and the city has built and is building outsized venues to attract more events and visitors, (KCC, coliseum complex, new PAC), which is why it lands some events that normally go to larger cities. Sometimes it gets criticized for maybe trying too hard, but I see it as ambition and not wanting to get left behind.
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Old 01-05-2019, 05:16 PM
 
Location: St Simons Island, GA
23,059 posts, read 35,012,419 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TarHeelTerritory View Post
What makes you say that, Mutiny? Not that I disagree-- just curious about your rationale.
Bottom line is an 'insular' community tends to be down on its heels, economically moribund and unused to (and thereby distrustful) of outsiders. There simply aren't many cities in the Southeast that fit that description anymore. To find it, you'd have to go to smaller and more isolated communities; but in fact most of the region is accustomed to the 'invaders'.
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Old 01-06-2019, 12:27 AM
 
Location: The Heart of Dixie
7,816 posts, read 12,321,925 times
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Among the smaller Southern cities, I'd say Asheville NC and Key West FL are especially NOT insular. Yes I know Key West isn't culturally a Southern city but its geographically Southern.
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Old 01-06-2019, 05:47 AM
 
21,187 posts, read 30,351,954 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
Greensboro seems to desire and embrace growth more, it has seemingly invested more in big-ticket amenities in its downtown over the past couple of years (two parks, ballpark, civil rights museum, PAC) and the city has built and is building outsized venues to attract more events and visitors, (KCC, coliseum complex, new PAC), which is why it lands some events that normally go to larger cities. Sometimes it gets criticized for maybe trying too hard, but I see it as ambition and not wanting to get left behind.
I agree with your assessment but would say while perhaps something of a more recent interest that Winston Salem's leaders have more/less gone on board for more aggressive downtown growth, no doubt in order to keep up with their neighbors. https://www.journalnow.com/business/...50a1278be.html Sometimes slower and steady wins the race, or at the very least keeps you competitive over the long haul. Winston Salem (like it's tobacco cousin, Durham to the east) has endearing well-preserved industrial character which will be an added benefit to those who see value over the more traditional (and widespread) new-build architecture of Greensboro.
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