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Old 01-16-2019, 11:08 AM
 
1,505 posts, read 522,496 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CookieSkoon View Post
The reasons I have for not considering Maryland southern are as much, if not more, to do with its landscape, location, and general climate. The modern culture being more like the north is just an aside.

There are parts of the northeast and Midwest that culturally feel southernesque but are certainly not part of the south.
The vast majority of Marylanders these days consider themselves Northeastern rather than Southern, anyways.

 
Old 01-16-2019, 11:09 AM
 
793 posts, read 288,806 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrJester View Post
I would imagine maybe Louisiana was less isolated, due to a major Italian and Spanish immigrant community coming through New Orleans?
New Orleans has been historically the urban center of the South. But it’s the major exception. Birmingham and Richmond’s industrialization efforts, though minor in comparison to its Northern counterparts, did also stick out. But even there, they were much more likely to draw from the Southern farms for workers than from across the ocean as was seen to feed the factory towns up north.
 
Old 01-16-2019, 11:13 AM
 
793 posts, read 288,806 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CookieSkoon View Post
The reasons I have for not considering Maryland southern are as much, if not more, to do with its landscape, location, and general climate. The modern culture being more like the north is just an aside.

There are parts of the northeast and Midwest that culturally feel southernesque but are certainly not part of the south.
There was a thread a few weeks ago where someone said they were leaving the South to return up north soon. Turns out they were from Southern Indiana which they considered climatically and culturally Southern. But it isnít Southern no matter any similarities. Maryland at least has a better claim to being Southern, but I think that claim reached its expiration point in a different century.
 
Old 01-16-2019, 11:49 AM
 
Location: Virginia Beach
4,209 posts, read 2,825,676 times
Reputation: 4497
Quote:
Originally Posted by CookieSkoon View Post
You are being frustratingly evasive. Majority this, population that. We're talking about Virginia as a whole are we not? Or have you shuffled your wording around because the entire state in one bite doesn't suit your narrative?
No, it doesn't fit your narrative. You're the one who said "a lot of Virginia is quite Carolinian/southern Appalachian", with no explanation. Lol so we just take your word for it? The majority of the people don't live in said areas of Virginia, and where the people live, has higher cultural, geography/landscape, and infrastructural ties to Maryland than to North Carolina or the Appalachians. So this is your narrative getting busted, as my point isn't inaccurate--->but yours is...

"A lot of Virginia" lol....you're not the only guy here with experience along the Eastern seaboard, which is the beauty of differing opinions. I never denied that Maryland has cross cultural similarities with other states, but it's a hard sell to say it resembles any state more than Virginia. Even Western Maryland is a parallel to the Culpeper to Harrisonburg areas in Virginia. Just from my experience, I don't know that I've been anywhere most like Maryland than VA...

I also didn't deny that there are parts of Virginia that share commonalities with Carolina and the southern Appalachians, but be for real. The areas where three-quarters of Virginians live are not as much reminiscent of Carolina and the Appalachians as they are of parts of Maryland, on a number of levels. This is more about the narrative you and others continue to perpetrate that not only somehow magically, Maryland and Virginia aren't that alike despite loads of evidence to the contrary, but also that you guys like separating Northern Virginia from the rest of Virginia, because those of you who push said narrative have only the most rudimentary knowledge and perception of NoVa anyway...

I've long said if forced to pick, I'd say Maryland is more northern than southern. This denial of its southerness like Maryland grew legs and walked out of the South and left all of its southern characteristics in a dumpster is bull****, though..
 
Old 01-16-2019, 12:05 PM
 
900 posts, read 765,002 times
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But there isnít any part of Maryland that isnít like Virginia. There are parts of Virginia that arenít like Maryland but thatís a factor of VA being twice as large in land area.

Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont... these places arenít anymore hotbeds of ethnic diversity
than MS or AR.

And no. 50 years ago DC was still a sleepy Southeren swamp and Baltimore wasnít much more cosmopolitan than that either.
 
Old 01-16-2019, 12:16 PM
 
Location: Virginia Beach
4,209 posts, read 2,825,676 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spencer114 View Post
But there isnít any part of Maryland that isnít like Virginia. There are parts of Virginia that arenít like Maryland but thatís a factor of VA being twice as large in land area.

Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont... these places arenít anymore hotbeds of ethnic diversity
than MS or AR.

And no. 50 years ago DC was still a sleepy Southeren swamp and Baltimore wasnít much more cosmopolitan than that either.
Exactly...

Maryland is as unique as the other 49 states, but this push to dictate that it belongs in a different region altogether than VA is funny...
 
Old 01-16-2019, 12:32 PM
 
Location: BMORE!
7,728 posts, read 6,137,255 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaylord_Focker View Post
Why are southerners so eager to include Nova and DC in the south? I don't get it.
They're already part of the south.
 
Old 01-16-2019, 12:34 PM
 
Location: BMORE!
7,728 posts, read 6,137,255 times
Reputation: 3585
Quote:
Originally Posted by spencer114 View Post
But there isnít any part of Maryland that isnít like Virginia. There are parts of Virginia that arenít like Maryland but thatís a factor of VA being twice as large in land area.

Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont... these places arenít anymore hotbeds of ethnic diversity
than MS or AR.

And no. 50 years ago DC was still a sleepy Southeren swamp and Baltimore wasnít much more cosmopolitan than that either.
DC is a busy southern swamp now.
 
Old 01-16-2019, 12:44 PM
 
29,893 posts, read 27,345,109 times
Reputation: 18435
Quote:
Originally Posted by spencer114 View Post
Charleston? Yes so much.
It saw nearly 10 times the immigration as New Orleans in the 19th century (1820-1920).

Did they all stick around? Of course not.
Well that's the whole point. As a port city, of course the city had some immigrants come through, like the Irish and Germans. But Charleston never regained its standing as one of the nation's largest cities after the early 1800s and never saw anything close to the immigration waves that Northeastern port cities saw in the late 18th/early 20th century largely because the South's economy was devastated after the Civil War, and that's not to say anything about the epidemics that often wiped out swaths of the populations of Southern coastal cities during that time. As it was mentioned earlier, the South was essentially stuck in a time warp for a full century after the Civil War and did not keep pace with the North at all.
 
Old 01-16-2019, 12:47 PM
 
29,893 posts, read 27,345,109 times
Reputation: 18435
Quote:
Originally Posted by eddie gein View Post
Again, DC was an historically quasi southern town. Slave trade until 1850. Slavery legal until 1862. Some Jim Crow and segregated schools until the 1950s. Segregated and substandard housing. The list goes on and on.

At the same time, DC, being the seat of the federal government had a lot of northerners providing push back and advocating change.
You're preaching to the choir and none of this changes the fact that the "average" Southerner sees DC as a city apart.
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