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Geographically it’s the Carolina border. North Carolina is the new south, modern economy, reasonably diverse but as people say “it’s still the south”. Charlotte is rightfully right on the border
I loved in South Carolina for a bit. It’s old south. Very nice people, thicker accents not super diverse, colloquial, still hanging on to confederate monuments, which I love. Oh and good soulless food
Your biggest mistake is painting entire states with a "New South" or "Old South" brush as you're really making an urban/rural distinction. There are scores of towns in NC with "very nice people, thicker accents, not super diverse, colloquial, still hanging on to Confederate monuments," and SC has rapidly-growing towns and cities with people from other parts of the country and the world and relatively modern economies.
Well.....the GOP has an interesting history in the south. It was the party of Lincoln and very dominant during the reconstruction era - when quite a few black republicans were elected to public office in the south. Then it died out for awhile and now is the considered the popular party of the south again. So - these things ebb and flow and don't remain stagnant.
As a Northerner, I know when I've hit the south because there are just a lot of the cultural markers in the south that just aren't in the north. And I still can't wrap my head around the fact that people keep trying to offer me sweet tea when I order iced tea at the local fast food/fast casual places up here - even though it's been a thing for the past 10 years. I just don't get it and just stopped ordering iced tea after having my order screwed up one too many times - a lot of people just couldn't wrap their head around the fact that I really didn't want their newest and great product, sweet tea. Seriously?
Yeah - I get that I haven't contributed much to the actual topic of the tread (sorry), but I lament that some of these cultural distinctions between regions are becoming fewer and far between.
Well.....the GOP has an interesting history in the south. It was the party of Lincoln and very dominant during the reconstruction era - when quite a few black republicans were elected to public office in the south. Then it died out for awhile and now is the considered the popular party of the south again. So - these things ebb and flow and don't remain stagnant.
That's a good point.
It is incredible to me that some people will call the Republican areas of the south 'Old South' given GOP is the party of Lincoln and obviously there is no slavery and segregation and lynching.
South Florida was pretty Southern in the 50s and 60s. My psychological teacher is a white South Florida native (born in 1950) and she describes it as the South. It had Jim Crow, and the northerners who were there at the time had felt like they were in the south.
For your information, most of the population growth in South Florida during the post-World War II period was driven by domestic migrants from the northern United States and immigrants from Cuba and Israel. As far as I know, domestic migration from New York and other northern U.S. states superseded that of Alabama and Georgia during the 1910's. If I am not mistaken, the most recent national census during which Georgia was the top out-of-state birthplace for Floridians was the 1910 U.S. Census. And I would imagine that, in the early 20th century, domestic migrants from Georgia were not populating the far southern counties of Florida and, instead, infilling many of the northern counties, since the soil north of Ocala is much more arable than the soil south of there. Why do you think Micanopy was one of the southernmost outposts of colonial Florida?
Furthermore, the only reason why the South Florida counties of Dade, Broward and Palm Beach had Jim Crow laws is because the capitol of Florida, Tallahassee, is located in the Florida Panhandle, which was a culturally southern in the 1950's and 1960's and still is. The culture and location of Tallahassee is also the reason why, as of 2010, alcohol sales were prohibited before 12:00 PM on Sundays in most Florida counties, except for Dade. However, I believe Broward revoked this ordinance in late 2016 (Source: https://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/b...908-story.html).
Last edited by Bert_from_back_East; 10-27-2019 at 10:45 AM..
It is incredible to me that some people will call the Republican areas of the south 'Old South' given GOP is the party of Lincoln and obviously there is no slavery and segregation and lynching.
To be exact, it’s a recent phenomenon the GOP winning locally in the South. It was the rural old timers that kept Dems in power here in NC long after they had switched to Republican for Washington. But with every level of politics now being so nationalized, split tickets are harder to justify.
For your information, most of the population growth in South Florida during the post-World War II period was driven by domestic migrants from the northern United States and immigrants from Cuba and Israel. As far as I know, domestic migration from New York and other northern U.S. states superseded that of Alabama and Georgia during the 1910's. If I am not mistaken, the most recent national census during which Georgia was the top out-of-state birthplace for Floridians was the 1910 U.S. Census. And I would imagine that, in the early 20th century, domestic migrants from Georgia were not populating the far southern counties of Florida and, instead, infilling many of the northern counties, since the soil north of Ocala is much more arable than the soil south of there. Why do you think Micanopy was one of the southernmost outposts of colonial Florida?
Furthermore, the only reason why the South Florida counties of Dade, Broward and Palm Beach had Jim Crow laws is because the capitol of Florida, Tallahassee, is located in the Florida Panhandle, which was a culturally southern in the 1950's and 1960's and still is. The culture and location of Tallahassee is also the reason why, as of 2010, alcohol sales were prohibited before 12:00 PM on Sundays in most Florida counties, except for Dade. However, I believe Broward revoked this ordinance in late 2016 (Source: https://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/b...908-story.html).
But people still claim South Florida as the South just not in the same vain as Mississippi but more like New Orleans 100 years prior when it was one of the biggest port cites and attracted tons on immigrants in the 1800s. Blacks in South Florida still say they are in the South even if they are Caribbean.
As a Northerner, I know when I've hit the south because there are just a lot of the cultural markers in the south that just aren't in the north. And I still can't wrap my head around the fact that people keep trying to offer me sweet tea when I order iced tea at the local fast food/fast casual places up here - even though it's been a thing for the past 10 years. I just don't get it and just stopped ordering iced tea after having my order screwed up one too many times - a lot of people just couldn't wrap their head around the fact that I really didn't want their newest and great product, sweet tea. Seriously?
That’s odd to me since unsweet is very popular in restaurants because people are so particular about their sweeteners. If the sugar container isn’t already on the table, then you give the color preference as you order (pink, yellow, blue, white). My parents only ever drank unsweetened tea with packets.
To be exact, it’s a recent phenomenon the GOP winning locally in the South. It was the rural old timers that kept Dems in power here in NC long after they had switched to Republican for Washington. But with every level of politics now being so nationalized, split tickets are harder to justify.
It is recent (last 30-50 years), but it is more of a change in party platforms that led to the switch rather than a change in the attitudes/culture of the residents of the South, (although these are in a constant slow evolution). Once the Democratic party under Kennedy and Johnson started pushing for civili rights, there were a lot of disaffected segregationist Democrats in the South. Starting with Nixon's Southern Strategy, the Republicans focused on picking up these conservative southerners. They did it by changing the Republican's platform to include "States Rights (less aggressive federal enforcement of civil rights laws)," and "Religious issues," namely anti-abortion, anti-gay rights, and a focus on the free exercise clause while ignoring the establishment clause. It was a highly effective strategy, and now the South is strongly Republican.
Well again, it was only this decade that Republicans had won both sides of the NC General Assembly, decades after Reagan broke open the South on a national level. This idea everyone here viewed themselves as Republicans is misguided. Many viewed themselves as old-school Democrats, but have found themselves squeezed out as both political parties have gotten puritanical on issues even in local elections.
There tends to be lower turnout in local elections when a president, governor, senator race is not on the ballot.
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