New Urbanism (metro, largest, suburban, highway)

[sobo16]

What is the general opinion of "traditional neighborhood" mixed-use communities that are becoming more popular? Can they really replicate the urban experience? Does anyone live in one of these communities? Is there a true sense of community that one wouldn't find in a regular McMansion suburb?

[scarletneon]

I don't live in one, so I can't speak as to whether it even remotely feels like an urban experience, but to me they look fake and too polished. But then again, most people that want to live in the little "suburb cities" probably want sterility anyway, and not have to run into the crazy homeless guy on a regular basis.

I think it's a nice idea, but why not redevelop abandoned urban areas in the same way rather than plopping down a little "city" in a corn field?

[JMT]

I think the new urbanism developments are a good idea, in theory. In reality, however, they tend to be so expensive that the average joe can't afford to live there. To me, that kind of defeats the purpose.

Nonetheless, the developments I've seen have been great, and I wish to God that I could afford to live there.

Here are a couple of them that I've seen and LOVE.

First up, Harbor Town which is adjacent to downtown Memphis. It's a broad mixture of single family homes, townhouses, condos and apartments with neighborhood retail and paved trails connecting it to downtown Memphis. Photos were found at Google Images:









In Atlanta, an old steel mill adjacent to Midtown was torn down and a essentially a new city built in its place, complete with 5,000 new residences, office towers, the country's largest IKEA, movie theaters, Dillard's, Publix grocery store, bookstores, parks, etc., and connections to mass transit. Pics taken from Google Images.

First up, the original steel mill:

http://www.epa.gov/Region4/opm/nepa/images/lg_atlantic_steel_mill.jpg (broken link)

What it looks like now:

http://blog.smartgrowthamerica.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/figure-0-7.jpg (broken link)

[sav858]

I like them and prefer them to the typical, auto oriented sprawl BS of the last 50+ years. But they are more expensive generally so many can't afford to live in one. And sometimes they build them in the wrong location and just add to sprawl and traffic like any other typical development. It's looks good on paper but when you build out in the middle of nowhere people are still gonna drive to work elsewhere and cram local highways and freeways. Next to transit station makes sense obviously, but away from them they aren't that much better than anything else out there besides how they look.

[Moth]

I lived in one in Dallas and generally liked it. It had a sterile quality to it, but it was also brand new so that is somewhat inevitable. It had a number of independent restaurants and some chains plus conveniences like dry cleaning.

Better than the typical McMansion sprawl.

[Iconographer]

I would compare most of these new communities to a room where someone ran out and bought all the furniture and accessories at once, as opposed to a room where the decor evolved over years of collecting. Some people might prefer the 'new'. but it's not going to have 'the lived-in' feel I prefer.

[scarletneon]

JMT - thank you I couldn't remember what Atlantic Station was called. It was too sterile and new for me when I visited -- BUT thankfully they did develop it in the city rather than 50 miles out.

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by sobo16

What is the general opinion of "traditional neighborhood" mixed-use communities that are becoming more popular? Can they really replicate the urban experience? Does anyone live in one of these communities? Is there a true sense of community that one wouldn't find in a regular McMansion suburb?

My DD and I were talking about this issue the other Saturday. We went to our local public library and across the street the farmer's market was being held. The market is in the same area where the pubic ice rink is set up in the winter. DD remarked that our suburban city seems more "authentic" than these new urbanism places, of which there are several in the Denver metro area. I happen to agree with her (probably the first time that has happened in a while, lol!). Even though our city has subdivisions that were built by the same builder, they are relatively small and all but the oldest have dedicated open space and parks in them. Our older hood was not built by one builder, and was built before the dedicated os requirement, but we do have a bike trail at the "back" of the subdivision, which backs to a large tract of city-owned open space, and there is a park within walking distance (about a mile) where my friend and I walk every day. (Well, almost every day. Once in a while we don't feel like getting out of bed.)

To get back to the OP's question, can they replicate the urban experience, my answer is "not really". Maybe they can give you 75% of it or so. The houses are all within the same few years of age, built by a few builders, all with the same type of architecture. They tend to be full of young families, which is typical of new neighborhoods in the 'burbs as well. The shopping, except in the biggest ones, tends to be what you'd find in any strip mall.

Originally Posted by supernerdgirl

I don't live in one, so I can't speak as to whether it even remotely feels like an urban experience, but to me they look fake and too polished. But then again, most people that want to live in the little "suburb cities" probably want sterility anyway, and not have to run into the crazy homeless guy on a regular basis.

I think it's a nice idea, but why not redevelop abandoned urban areas in the same way rather than plopping down a little "city" in a corn field?

I think your opinion of suburbanites is a little condescending. In any event, the new urbanism places in the Denver area do not attract the "crazy urban homeless" on any kind of a regular basis, as the homes are new and being both new and "hip", they are expensive. To encounter the homeless, the New Urbanist will have to leave their bubble and go out into the city. Denver's old Stapleton airport is being re-developed into a New Urbanist area, and the old Villa Italia mall in Lakewood, CO, an old, inner ring suburb, is as well. Then there is another one, Brandburn, that was built on undeveloped land. The people who live in these places do like them very much, so I guess that says something good about the concept.

[scarletneon]

Originally Posted by Katiana

I think your opinion of suburbanites is a little condescending. In any event, the new urbanism places in the Denver area do not attract the "crazy urban homeless" on any kind of a regular basis, as the homes are new and being both new and "hip", they are expensive. To encounter the homeless, the New Urbanist will have to leave their bubble and go out into the city. Denver's old Stapleton airport is being re-developed into a New Urbanist area, and the old Villa Italia mall in Lakewood, CO, an old, inner ring suburb, is as well. Then there is another one, Brandburn, that was built on undeveloped land. The people who live in these places do like them very much, so I guess that says something good about the concept.

You apparently missed the "", yes?

[Billiam]

better than the typical, but still hideous