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Old 09-29-2008, 02:40 PM
 
Location: Northern Wayne Co, PA
620 posts, read 1,844,259 times
Reputation: 339

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I understand that the markets may crash. But no matter how I look at it, all I see is that the purpose of the government of the USA has no part in bailing out businesses of any kind like this, particularly when the cost to its citizenry is monumentally significant.

I hope this crisis makes more people realize that being a slave to the culture of debt is not a sustainable solution for personal well being.

And there is WAY to little emphasis on how the one population in this country who is in a constant state of financial crisis...because they are poor...will somehow to have PAY for corporate greediness. It blows my mind that its even being considered as a viable option.

The next generation doesn't matter in the energy decisions we make...it doesn't matter in our financial policy...it doesn't matter when we decide to go to war...and why...all because of decisions motivated by self-interest, not by a sincere concern for the well being of the collective currently alive and that will come for many more generations.

It's this attitude of, let's push the crisis off further down the road, until after we can be held responsible, then we won't have to deal with it. I just hope that the corporatocracy doesn't determine that the working class should be held responsible for the consequences of corporate greed.
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Old 09-29-2008, 03:08 PM
 
71,452 posts, read 71,629,249 times
Reputation: 48996
we are all in a boat with a hole in it thats sinking... how the boat got the hole and who is responsable can be sorted out later....

the crisis is first working its way through main st which is why most of america dosnt see the implications... they will see it very soon as their own companies wont have cash flow to make payroll, no money to be loaned for inventories of businesses, no car loaNS AND NOOOO STUDENT LOANS

basically we are screwed without the flow of money....
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Old 09-29-2008, 03:21 PM
 
Location: Idiocracy
904 posts, read 1,813,897 times
Reputation: 370
Woah, somehow missed this news earlier in the day. I'm a bit shell-shocked after looking at my (now-even-more-) meager investments.

Mommy
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Old 09-29-2008, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Texas
835 posts, read 1,195,933 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by Summering View Post
But the banker big shots "already bailed" with their big buyout pensions..........
So who is left holding the little sums that are left?
I'm with Math, this is hitting my 401K to drastically. And yours? This is your retirement.
I don't know why people would want the markets to crash.
I'm not saying the paperwork is worded exactly right..........
But if the banks all fold, you know it means no credit for homes, cars, and all the things your use to in life.
This is the market that pays your salary, that pays your mortgage........
The biggest closing point drop in history. This is a bad day for all of our American families........
I see no cause for celebration, in the least.
I have gas ration coupons and grocery tickets from the 1930 crash ( collected over time).........
This is very serious, a deal needs to be made..........money has to be freed up.
I have been watching this all day, because this is not good for me, and not good for you.
You have to look at the 777 drop as % of the market. It is only a 7% drop which is not even significant to be counted on the list of top 5 drops of the market.
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Old 09-29-2008, 03:40 PM
 
71,452 posts, read 71,629,249 times
Reputation: 48996
i dont remember a higher 1 day percentage drop except 1987. i could be wrong but id like to know what other 1 day drop was worse other than oct 87.. im not to familar with anything prior to that as i wasnt in it. problem is that way back before 1987 most of america wasnt in the markets much, there were no iras , 401k's, 403b's etc... coupled with the wealth effect. people have way more money today invested than ever before. a 20-25% drop this year has far more devasting effects than it did back when very little of main st was invested
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Old 09-29-2008, 03:49 PM
 
Location: In Northern Wayne
57 posts, read 111,481 times
Reputation: 25
what??? Your 401K. Ha,ha,ha, your long haul no?

The Dow and S&P are at levels of oh, God 2005. not exactly a great loss.


P.S. think of the great news.... Oil is down too.
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Old 09-29-2008, 03:57 PM
 
71,452 posts, read 71,629,249 times
Reputation: 48996
It is if you bought in recently or are retired and living off withdrawls... the markets havent kept up with inflation so even at 2005 levels your pretty far behind... remember the rule of thumb for retirement withdrawls is you can take about 4% of your nest egg a year providing you are getting an average of about 7% from a 50/50 mix of equities and everything else.... if you arent getting the 7% which you definatly are not then that has serious consequences on your money your with drawing to live on.

you need to grow your nest egg by about 3% a year to keep it even with inflation. anything over that you can pull to live on, if you pull more or dont get 7% you risk outliving your money
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Old 09-29-2008, 04:06 PM
 
Location: bethlehem PA
248 posts, read 689,837 times
Reputation: 85
i agree with summering. when the financial wheels of this country come to a screeching halt, it is the everyday person - you and me - who are going to feel the pain.
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Old 09-29-2008, 04:13 PM
 
Location: Texas
835 posts, read 1,195,933 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
i dont remember a higher 1 day percentage drop except 1987. i could be wrong but id like to know what other 1 day drop was worse other than oct 87.. im not to familar with anything prior to that as i wasnt in it. problem is that way back before 1987 most of america wasnt in the markets much, there were no iras , 401k's, 403b's etc... coupled with the wealth effect. people have way more money today invested than ever before. a 20-25% drop this year has far more devasting effects than it did back when very little of main st was invested
Sorry grabbed the wrong info last time so I'll try once more with the Dow info....

Aug. 31st 1998 Falls 512.61 to close at 7,539.07 a 1,798.90 (19.26%) drop since July 17, 1998.
This is the fourth largest dollar loss in history eliminating all gains since June 10, 1997.
March 7th 2000 Falls 60.50 to close at 9,796.03 for a YTD low completing a tumble of 16.48% from Jan 14.
Sept. 7th 2001 Falls 234.99 to close at 9,605.85 falling 1,767.07 (15.5%) since May 21, 2001.
Sept. 17 2001 Falls 684.81 to close at 8,920.70, largest dollar loss in history, down 7.13%.
Sept. 21 2001 Falls 140.40 to close at 8,235.81, eliminating all gains since July 30, 1997, over 4 years ago. Since May 21, 2001 the market has declined 3,137.11 for a percentage loss of 27.58. In the one week since the terrorist attack the market has declined 1,369.70 for a percentage loss of 14.26%.
July 23rd 2002 Falls 82.24 to close at 7,702.34. The market has declined 4,020.64, or 34%, since January 14, 2000.
Oct. 9th 2002 Falls 215.22 to close at 7,286.27. The market has declined 4,436.71, or 38%, since January 14, 2000.
Rank Date Close Net Chg % Chg
1 12/12/1914 54.00 -17.42-24.39
2 10/19/1987 1,738.74 -508.00-22.61
3 10/28/1929 260.64 -38.33-12.82
4 10/29/1929 230.07 -30.57-11.73
5 11/06/1929 232.13 -25.55-9.92
6 12/18/1899 58.27 -5.57-8.72
7 08/12/1932 63.11 -5.79-8.40
8 03/14/1907 76.23 -6.89-8.29
9 10/26/1987 1,793.93 -156.83-8.04
10 07/21/1933 88.71 -7.55-7.84
11 10/18/1937 125.73 -10.57-7.75
12 02/01/1917 88.52 -6.91-7.24
13 10/27/1997 7,161.15 -554.26-7.18
14 10/05/1932 66.07 -5.09-7.15
15 09/17/2001 8,920.70 -684.81-7.13
16 09/24/1931 107.79 -8.20-7.07
17 07/20/1933 96.26 -7.32-7.07

Last edited by artifice; 09-29-2008 at 04:31 PM..
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Old 09-29-2008, 04:19 PM
 
71,452 posts, read 71,629,249 times
Reputation: 48996
s&p was down 8.80 today so except for 1987 its the 2nd biggest drop in modern times
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