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View Poll Results: City where you feel there is an inferiority complex?
NYC 25 8.74%
LA 23 8.04%
CHICAGO 80 27.97%
HOUSTON 84 29.37%
ATLANTA 61 21.33%
PHILLIE 44 15.38%
DETROIT 40 13.99%
DALLAS-FORTWORTH 41 14.34%
BAY AREA (San francisco, Oakland, San Jose), CA 16 5.59%
MILWAUKEE 40 13.99%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 286. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-05-2009, 02:26 AM
 
Location: US Empire, Pac NW
5,008 posts, read 10,793,962 times
Reputation: 4125

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Quote:
Originally Posted by landcruiserTT View Post
Chicago, Philly, and Houston
In response to the guy posted before me I can't say St Louis is. People who live there genuinely love it and don't look at CHicago with an ounce of envy. You hear that same statement but in reverse from Chicagoans "well we're not like <insert something> like ST LOUIS is." It must be because St Louis has all those baseball championships to hang over Chicago's head. I think again it stems from Chicago. For a big "world class city" they sure do not act like it. That city is divided and it wants everyone else to be that way.

Erm ...

I grew up in Chicago and went to St. Louis after college for a job.

Whenever I talked to people whom I knew, they would ALWAYS 100% talk about how something "isn't like CHICAGO is..." you obviously don't know what you're talking about.

The people who pump up St. Louis know that entire blocks of downtown are run-down and abandoned, there's zero cultural advantage, crime in St. Louis is abysmal, and all the white people moved out of the city a long time ago, save a few forward thinking people who aren't racist. Even the beer is substandard for all the pomp and history behind Budweiser. Believe me, I know, Ilived there for two years and befriended a lot of people. I didn't elicit those remarks, they came naturally.
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Old 12-05-2009, 04:20 AM
 
2,231 posts, read 5,423,811 times
Reputation: 537
Quote:
Originally Posted by wpmeads View Post
Really? I guess for the purpose of this thread, you could say the massive construction projects going on in Dallas' museum and theater districts might be because Houston's museum and theater district has been far superior for a long time.
No, Dallas-Ft Worth had plenty of museums and theatres, in fact, more of them than Houston.

The development of the Dallas Arts District and its Pritzger Prize winning architecture reflects Dallas' desire for excellence... it has nothing to do with Houston. If anything, it is an attempt to equal Lincoln Center in NYC or the Kennedy Center in Washington...
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Old 12-05-2009, 04:22 AM
 
2,231 posts, read 5,423,811 times
Reputation: 537
Quote:
Originally Posted by krock1dk View Post
Take it up with the Census. According to them, the city of Houston proper, seperate from the rest of the metro area, is the 4th largest US city in population with 2-million residents, behind New York, L.A, and Chicago. Period. But its like the 7th largest metro area or something like that.
No, it is just the 4th largest municipal government, and that is meaningless.
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Old 12-05-2009, 04:27 AM
 
2,231 posts, read 5,423,811 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wpmeads View Post
So Houston should just try and be like every other city. Give me a break. The Houston annexes cities so it can have majority of its metro under one government. Do you really think the city government is annexing cities because so they can satisfy their "insecurities" about Houston? That's completely absurd.

DFW overshadows Houston? Seriously? That's got to be the most ignorant Dallas booster comment I've ever seen.
No, the municipal government annexes suburbs because politicians are greedy for power.

Claiming that Houston is the 4th largest something is an expression of civic insecurity on the part of the claimant. Houston has many legitimate things to be proud of, but that boast is not only deceptive but trivial. Who would be impressed by the fact that a municipality has annexed its suburbs?

And yes, statistically Dallas-Ft W has the edge over Houston by most statistical categories. Not all, but most. It does, of course, have a larger population than metro Houston.

Last edited by aceplace; 12-05-2009 at 05:28 AM..
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Old 12-05-2009, 09:20 AM
 
33 posts, read 25,048 times
Reputation: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by eskercurve View Post
Erm ...

I grew up in Chicago and went to St. Louis after college for a job.

Whenever I talked to people whom I knew, they would ALWAYS 100% talk about how something "isn't like CHICAGO is..." you obviously don't know what you're talking about.

The people who pump up St. Louis know that entire blocks of downtown are run-down and abandoned, there's zero cultural advantage, crime in St. Louis is abysmal, and all the white people moved out of the city a long time ago, save a few forward thinking people who aren't racist. Even the beer is substandard for all the pomp and history behind Budweiser. Believe me, I know, Ilived there for two years and befriended a lot of people. I didn't elicit those remarks, they came naturally.

Sorry brother man, but your comments here just reek of b.s. You were just scorned by a perceived putdown of Chicago in that landcruser guy's post and are now overcompensating by declaring that 100% of everyone in St. Louis is jealous of Chicago in some way. Even if 100% of people whom you knew while there acted that way, which is extremely unlikely based on something called common sense, how does that translate to hundreds of thousands of people? Sounds like you just wanted to bash St Louis for whatever reason or get some revenge. This second city complex you are displaying probably projects from you wherever you go. I don't care for St Louis personally either, and I am a Cubs fan to boot but I am not going to say idiotic things like there is no culture and there are "few forward thinking people". What's wrong with YOU?

Last edited by lotus PA; 12-05-2009 at 09:39 AM..
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Old 12-05-2009, 09:39 AM
 
Location: Houston
2,026 posts, read 3,675,924 times
Reputation: 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by aceplace View Post
No, Dallas-Ft Worth had plenty of museums and theatres, in fact, more of them than Houston.

The development of the Dallas Arts District and its Pritzger Prize winning architecture reflects Dallas' desire for excellence... it has nothing to do with Houston. If anything, it is an attempt to equal Lincoln Center in NYC or the Kennedy Center in Washington...
Are you familiar with Houston's museum and theater district? Is it a fact that Dallas-Fort Worth has more museums than Houston or are you just assuming? Yes I know about the Pritzker Prize winning architects designing museums in Dallas. Houston has its fair share as well. And Dallas has quite a ways to go before it's museum district is on the same level as the Lincoln Center or the Kennedy Center. It doesn't even have much of a local art scene outside of Southwest art in Fort Worth.

Another thing, why do you assume that when Dallas has big plans for a massive museum district, it's to achieve excellence, but when Houston invest in projects (like a massive LT system) the reason is due to the city's insecurities toward Dallas? That seems very one sided kind of like you whole argument.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aceplace View Post
No, the municipal government annexes suburbs because politicians are greedy for power.
That's still a better explanation than the annexes suburbs because it's insecure. Although I doubt that is the sole reason for annexing cities.

Quote:
Claiming that Houston is the 4th largest something is an expression of civic insecurity on the part of the claimant. Houston has many legitimate things to be proud of, but that boast is not only deceptive but trivial. Who would be impressed by the fact that a municipality has annexed its suburbs?
Stating the fact that Houston is the 4th largest city has nothing to insecurity. Do you think most people outside of CD know or care who has the biggest metro? I don't think most people even care that Houston is the fourth largest city. Do you really expect Houstonians to go around telling people that Houston is the 5th (I believe we've already past Philly) largest metro?

Quote:
And yes, statistically Dallas-Ft W has the edge over Houston by most statistical categories. Not all, but most. It does, of course, have a larger population than metro Houston.
Not really. In most categories they're pretty close and Houston is ahead of the DFW in many areas as well. GDP would be one off the top of my head.
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Old 12-05-2009, 10:03 AM
 
Location: Houston
2,026 posts, read 3,675,924 times
Reputation: 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by aceplace View Post
No, Dallas-Ft Worth had plenty of museums and theatres, in fact, more of them than Houston.
Is that an assumption or a fact?

[quote]The development of the Dallas Arts District and its Pritzger Prize winning architecture reflects Dallas' desire for excellence... it has nothing to do with Houston. [quote/]
It's funny that when Dallas plans on developing a massive museum district it's to achieve excellence, but when Houston proceeds with major developments it's due to insecurity. That seems a bit one sided. And yes I am aware of all the Pritzker Prize architects that have/are designing museums in Dallas and Fort Worth. Houston has its fair share as well.

Quote:
If anything, it is an attempt to equal Lincoln Center in NYC or the Kennedy Center in Washington...
Are you familiar with the Houston Museum District and the Houston Theater District? Dallas has a long ways to go before it's on the same level as NYC and DC. If you talking contemporary art scenes, Dallas is far behind Houston much less NYC.



Quote:
Originally Posted by aceplace View Post
No, the municipal government annexes suburbs because politicians are greedy for power.
That's still a better reasoning that Houston annexes cities because it's insecure. I'm very skeptical that greed is the sole reason behind cities annexing suburbs.

Quote:
Claiming that Houston is the 4th largest something is an expression of civic insecurity on the part of the claimant. Houston has many legitimate things to be proud of, but that boast is not only deceptive but trivial. Who would be impressed by the fact that a municipality has annexed its suburbs?
Stating facts has nothing to do with insecurity. Do you think people around Houston walk around filling better about themselves because Houston is the fourth largest city? do you really expect for Houstonians to say their city is the 5th largest (I think we've past Philadelphia) metro? Who said we expected anyone to be impressed by the fact that Houston is the fourth largest city?

Quote:
And yes, statistically Dallas-Ft W has the edge over Houston by most statistical categories. Not all, but most. It does, of course, have a larger population than metro Houston.
Not really. In most cases they're pretty close and in many statistics (like GDP for example) Houston is ahead of Dallas/Fort Worth. That's not overshadowing.
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Old 12-05-2009, 10:21 AM
 
Location: US Empire, Pac NW
5,008 posts, read 10,793,962 times
Reputation: 4125
Quote:
Originally Posted by lotus PA View Post
Sorry brother man, but your comments here just reek of b.s. You were just scorned by a perceived putdown of Chicago in that landcruser guy's post and are now overcompensating by declaring that 100% of everyone in St. Louis is jealous of Chicago in some way. Even if 100% of people whom you knew while there acted that way, which is extremely unlikely based on something called common sense, how does that translate to hundreds of thousands of people? Sounds like you just wanted to bash St Louis for whatever reason or get some revenge. This second city complex you are displaying probably projects from you wherever you go. I don't care for St Louis personally either, and I am a Cubs fan to boot but I am not going to say idiotic things like there is no culture and there are "few forward thinking people". What's wrong with YOU?
It's called hyperbole. Look it up.

And all I have to say is that everyone I knew in St. Louis - native or transplant - mentioned it at least once. They didn't mention it all the time, just when a topic of Chicago came up (like them asking me where to go, etc) or it popped into their heads. Most of the time it would be framed like "Well <insert something here> doesn't compare / isn't like CHICAGO, but ... "

As for the "there's no culture" comment, I'll grant you there is some, in the form of people who have been moving back into the city lately to renovate and turn some areas into really nice places, like the French district and the Garden district. But in terms of historical culture and background, there isn't much that survived the 1960s White Flight to the suburbs. In the past 10 years or so have things really started to come around.

So there, some cold facts for you. Happy? And on a second note, have you lived there? Have you even visited there?
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Old 12-05-2009, 10:39 AM
 
Location: Underneath the Pecan Tree
15,989 posts, read 30,680,544 times
Reputation: 7280
Quote:
Originally Posted by aceplace View Post
No, the municipal government annexes suburbs because politicians are greedy for power.

Claiming that Houston is the 4th largest something is an expression of civic insecurity on the part of the claimant. Houston has many legitimate things to be proud of, but that boast is not only deceptive but trivial. Who would be impressed by the fact that a municipality has annexed its suburbs?

And yes, statistically Dallas-Ft W has the edge over Houston by most statistical categories. Not all, but most. It does, of course, have a larger
population than metro Houston.

Do you understand what your saying??? You can't claim to be the 4th biggest city.

Last time I checked; the history books, the government, the census bureau, and the world addressed us as the 4th biggest city. Houstonians don't have to claim it; it just is. Your turning a well-known fact into an opinion. Would you also like to address the fact that the Dallas metro area is also bigger in land size than metro Houston???

"It seems your are trying to satisfy your insecurities by claiming to be the 4th biggest metro area."
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Old 12-05-2009, 10:59 AM
 
33 posts, read 25,048 times
Reputation: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by eskercurve View Post
It's called hyperbole. Look it up.

And all I have to say is that everyone I knew in St. Louis - native or transplant - mentioned it at least once. They didn't mention it all the time, just when a topic of Chicago came up (like them asking me where to go, etc) or it popped into their heads. Most of the time it would be framed like "Well <insert something here> doesn't compare / isn't like CHICAGO, but ... "

As for the "there's no culture" comment, I'll grant you there is some, in the form of people who have been moving back into the city lately to renovate and turn some areas into really nice places, like the French district and the Garden district. But in terms of historical culture and background, there isn't much that survived the 1960s White Flight to the suburbs. In the past 10 years or so have things really started to come around.

So there, some cold facts for you. Happy? And on a second note, have you lived there? Have you even visited there?
My wife's grandma Vivian, wife's uncle Jay and his wife, older nieces, nephews, cousins..all live in or near St Louis. Against my will, I am forced to drive there often to visit and for ballgames and holidays. They also come up here for visits and some other holidays. Wife is very close to her "grammy" and that side of the family. We've been doing this for 20+years and I have not once heard any single one of them say "Oh this here is probably better in Chicago" or anything remotely similar. My wife is from Chicago and so are her parents. Another experience was my friend at University of WI Oshkosh was from St Louis. I don't think Chicago ever came up the whole time I knew him and he knew full well I'm into the Cubs.
I think maybe your St Louis friends were being somewhat polite to you and Chicago "popped up" because they knew you were from there. I often do the same thing as a way of complimenting other people's home towns. In fact, I might have even done it about St. Louis once or twice. The history of how they built that arch is amazing. I think I might have said something like "we dont have any amazing world landmarks like that in WIsconsin" ..ya know. Doesnt mean I feel inferior. Inferiority complex is more like when you are super defensive about criticism and then sometimes pass it on or project to others. Living about halfway between Chicago and Milwaukee I get a nice vantage point of the pissing matches here. There is inferiority complex far more in those two cities than in St Louis IMO. But that's a whole different story.

Last edited by lotus PA; 12-05-2009 at 11:32 AM..
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