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Old 01-31-2009, 08:28 PM
 
Location: Boston, Massachusetts
505 posts, read 1,225,504 times
Reputation: 224

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Well, the northeast was first, but that doesn't make it better. And "the entire American way of life" encompasses lifestyles seen more outside the NE, such as large-scale farming (as opposed to small family farms), ranching, mining, and the like.
This is very true. I didn't think of it like that.
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Old 01-31-2009, 08:56 PM
 
Location: IN
20,852 posts, read 35,958,846 times
Reputation: 13297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
We just debunked the idea that houses are smaller in the NE. You pay for heating, you pay for cooling. I don't know who really WANTS smaller homes. As I said before, I wouldn't want to go back to one bathroom houses, or a house w/o a family room.
You mentioned the Albany, NY area.
I live in the Appalachian mountains near a smaller city.
"Most" houses here both newer and older are under 2000sqft.
Many houses do not have garages or have a detached garage/barn.
Many houses are of modular construction to avoid paying greater property taxes.
Many houses use wood for heat, and people selectively cut wood from their own land for fuel.
Property taxes for a 2000sqft + house with 10+ acres will run over $7000 in some cases.

Based on my travels, the houses get bigger in size the closer you get to the Boston suburbs and the larger urban areas. Most of the houses in the rural areas here in NH (especially away from the lakes) are quite a bit smaller in size.
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Old 02-01-2009, 07:31 AM
 
Location: NE Nebraska
84 posts, read 359,716 times
Reputation: 99
[quote=DeaconJ;7255831]Maybe this will help...


Detroit Population
1960 1,670,144
1970 1,514,063
1980 1,203,368
1990 1,027,974
2000 951,270
Detroit - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Dearborn Population
1960 112,007 17.9%
1970 104,199 −7%
1980 90,660 −13%
1990 89,286 −1.5%
2000 97,775 9.5%
Dearborn, Michigan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Flint MI Population
1960 196,940 20.5%
1970 193,317 −1.8%
1980 159,611 −17.4%
1990 140,761 −11.8%
2000 124,943 −11.2%
Flint, Michigan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Lansing Population
1960 107,807 17%
1970 131,403 21.9%
1980 130,414 −0.8%
1990 127,321 −2.4%
2000 119,128 −6.4%
Lansing, Michigan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
/quote]

I can't say anything about the other areas presented by Deacon except the Michigan city populations can be deceiving due to the political nature of the beast. By looking at the Michigan city numbers, a person would think people are leaving in droves as recently as 2000. At times, people have left Michigan in droves, but more commonly they have left the city for townships. In the townships people see less taxes, better education and less crime. Basically the Michigan home rule system allows unincorporated townships to become small unicorporated cities in their own right. The total population numbers here show my point.

Detroit Area Counties

Oakland County, MI
Census Populations
1920 90,050 81.6%
1930
211,251 134.6%
1940
254,068 20.3%
1950
396,001 55.9%
1960
690,259 74.3%
1970
907,871 31.5%
1980
1,011,793 11.4%
1990
1,083,592 7.1%
2000
1,194,156 10.2%
Est. 2007
1,206,089 1%
Oakland County, Michigan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Macomb County, MI
Census Populations
1920 38,103 16.9%
1930
77,146 102.5%
1940
107,638 39.5%
1950
184,961 71.8%
1960
405,804 119.4%
1970
625,309 54.1%
1980
694,600 11.1%
1990
717,400 3.3%
2000
788,149 9.9%
Est. 2007
831,077 5.4%
Macomb County, Michigan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Wayne County, MI
Census Populations
1920 1,177,645 121.5%
1930 1,888,946 60.4%
1940
2,015,623 6.7%
1950
2,435,235 20.8%
1960 2,666,297 9.5%
1970 2,666,751 0%
1980 2,337,891 −12.3%
1990
2,111,687 −9.7%
2000 2,061,162 −2.4%
Est. 2007 1,985,101 −3.7%
Wayne County, Michigan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 02-01-2009, 09:22 AM
 
Location: On the Great South Bay
7,137 posts, read 9,909,375 times
Reputation: 6424
Madpie I think your figures are showing what many people think about cities and the people who are running them. City leaders often seem to care far more about commercial, business and builders profits before they care about the quality of life of their own citizens.

There seems to this attitude in cities that everything should be built to maximize profit - for instance if it is vacant land then it must be developed into housing. If it is already housing then it must be torn down to create larger apartment buildings. No thought is given on the increasing traffic that is going to be created, where people are going to park their cars or where the children are going to go to school etc.

Occasionally a city will set aside land for a park or public square. But even then it is quite often the park was a gift from a private individual or the square was a hard to build on traffic circle.

Now in contrast many suburbs and smaller cities are closer to the people and seem to pay attention to quality life issues. The reality is sometimes different of course.
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Old 02-01-2009, 09:55 AM
 
Location: Boston, MA
11,745 posts, read 8,308,298 times
Reputation: 5796
In 1950, the availability of air conditioners for the cooling of homes exploded.

In 1950 declines in the northern population began.

Coincidence?
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Old 02-01-2009, 08:21 PM
 
Location: Rockport Texas from El Paso
2,601 posts, read 7,529,441 times
Reputation: 1578
Joshua you might be on to something. The 1950s though was when TVs became widespread. This has resulted in less local accents. People sat at home and saw other places that looked nice with friendly people. Lots of shows featured California and Florida -beaches ocean and someone in Detroit or NY or any of those cold midwest or eastern cities , would see that a few times a week and figure "hey I want to live there!":
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Old 02-02-2009, 01:30 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
15,470 posts, read 25,420,814 times
Reputation: 8936
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeromeville View Post
I do think that economic events are happening faster than people think and that the West's booming popularity will come to an end sooner than later (which might be a relief for people already living out there). California has become a state that people are desperate to leave... much like New York was in the '70s, '80s and '90s... everyone from California is looking to move to Oregon, Washington, Colorado, Arizona, Utah... but "what goes around, comes around" and today's popular places may be unpopular sooner than anyone thinks.

During the '80s and '90s New York lost a great deal of its population to states like North Carolina, Georgia and Tennessee... I've heard stories that there are entire suburbs in NC composely entirely of transplanted Northeasterners, not a "local" to be found... now the shoe is on the other foot, the financial industries in places like Charlotte (Wachovia) that supported the economy down there has evaporated, and the Carolinas are no longer the promised land. Don't think that can never happen to places where transplanted Californians have fled to (other states out west).

As for the Sun Belt, a lot of that booming prosperity was fueled by a housing bubble and those home prices are never going to be that high again... say goodbye to the malls, construction jobs, barista jobs and various "scenes" that rely on real estate generated business. The West is going to start to revert to what it was -- which is VERY NICE -- but a lot of people are also going to lose their jobs (the California unemployment rate is just awful) and swarm into other Western states, bringing their problems with them. kind of like a reverse Dust Bowl.
NY State is still losing plenty of people, more so than Ca as a percentage of population. Last year CA lost 144K people out of about 38 million, NY lost 126K out of about 19 million

Yes many people have left and are leaving Ca but I think a lot of people exaggerate about how bad it actually is. The domestic out migration makes up such a small % of the state's population overall. And California is one of the most rooted states along with TX, NC, WI, GA, with 69% of native residents over 18 still living in the state, not as many people leave here as some people make it sound like. None of my family or friends have left this state and don't have any plans to.
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Old 02-02-2009, 07:29 PM
 
3,326 posts, read 7,751,221 times
Reputation: 1973
Nobody ever calls me for my opinion on these things. Oh well.
I live in Kansas City, and would take it over any and all of the top rated cities on that goofy list, and it's not even in my personal top five. Minneapolis is actually one of the nicest, cleanest, safest cities in America. Too cold for wusses, though. Wusses commit most crime, apparently.
If most people want to live in lala land, then so be it.
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:11 PM
 
Location: Rockport Texas from El Paso
2,601 posts, read 7,529,441 times
Reputation: 1578
northbound I see the reason no one calls you for your opinion.

You say -Warm weather wusses - committing the most crime.. let's see what are the cities with the most crime

Umm Detroit, Flint, Camden NJ, Gary Indiana- all winter getaways I suppose.

Think of where we would be (literally ) if we did call for your opinion.
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:18 PM
 
3,326 posts, read 7,751,221 times
Reputation: 1973
Quote:
Originally Posted by ocean2026 View Post
northbound I see the reason no one calls you for your opinion.

You say -Warm weather wusses - committing the most crime.. let's see what are the cities with the most crime

Umm Detroit, Flint, Camden NJ, Gary Indiana- all winter getaways I suppose.

Think of where we would be (literally ) if we did call for your opinion.
I thought those calls were supposed to be a random sampling of Americana. So much for that.

Crime-ridden New Orleans, Memphis, Atlanta, Little Rock, Houston, Dallas, Los Angeles, Phoenix, Miami.. or any other town in Florida.. not exactly safest cities in America material. Boston, Minneapolis, Seattle.. are, but not without there own problems, of course. The south has some okay qualities, as does the north. My personal preference is north for more reasons than I could ever explain in one post.

Oh yeah, some of us love winter.
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