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That's funny, because whenever I say I go to the south often to visit my parents in Florida, you're the one who tells me that isn't the south....yet 15 minutes east it is? Very strange logic there.
Florida, I think, is a very strange case. The coasts are inhabited by littoral people who generally stem from the northeast, and bring their culture and lifestyles to the fringe of both Florida coasts. Littoral southern culture, I think, ranges from New Orleans/Grand Isle to Destin. The northeastern transplants kind of take over from that point. In contrast, the interior of Florida is still very much older generation southern, though I will agree with TANaples that Immolakee, Belle Glade and Pahokee are really almost third world extensions of the Caribbean. But you can make these claims with many southern, agricultural centers. For instance, I was in Ludowici Georgia, about 10 years ago, where vidalia onions are harvested. To my amazement, the town was almost about half Mexican immigrants, and that was 10 years ago. And that circumstance knows no geographic boundary, really. I remember when I used to live in Southern New Jersey, about 20 minutes from me was one of the nation's largest blueberry crops. I remember one late summer day, driving by, there was not one white face in the fields. A few minutes later, on Rt 206, in succession, came 5 buses, all with Florida license plates. From what I understand, these people were classic migrants: they were essentially bused to where the next crop needed to be picked. Getting back to my original point, I think that's why much of rural, agricultural old Florida has that increasing sense that like it's not really the south that many in Northern states envision.
Wrong, as usual. The South as a cultural region begins south of the Mason Dixon in the north, to the Florida Keys in the South, and Louisiana to the west. Texas can be included, but Texas is so diverse and has numerous influences -- Southern culture is only one of influences that makes Texas what it is. Oklahoma's really just a Southern Plains state.
There are some places in the South that aren't "Southern" or don't fit the "Southern mold". These places are large cities and suburbs that attract people from all over the world, so they tend to have more of an "un-southern" feel that people mistake for being Northeastern or whatever it is they incorrectly assume. This is usually the case for Central Maryland and Northern Virginia, or even South Florida or parts of Louisiana.
Southern culture, whatever that may be, definitely exists in Maryland. First, the native dialects(like Baltimorese) are partially influenced by Southern speech, and southern accents like the Tidewater one are just as native to Maryland as they are to Virginia. Second, native cuisine like crabs, Smith Island Pound Cake, Maryland Beaten Biscuits, Stuffed Ham and Maryland Fried Chicken, or tobacco, one of the state symbols that has a tremendous legacy in Maryland, all lean more in the Southern direction. Third, there is nothing "Northeastern" about Southern Maryland or the Eastern Shore. There are those who say Baltimore and DC aren't southern cities, yet they have Southern roots/origins, and continue to be influenced by the South in their own intricate way. Just because they've changed a lot from what they originally were, have gotten bigger, become more diverse, as many places have, doesn't mean they no longer fit into the region. But to see that requires letting go of cliched and oversimplified stereotypes of what the South is.
Really, have you even been to Maryland? Tobacco has long been dead in this state. It's a bigger "symbol" in Connecticut, which I suppose makes them Southern as well. Half those foods you mentioned are native to Maryland, not the South (stuffed ham, blue crab). Baltimore's accent is nearly the same as Philadelphia, as are it's demographics, economy, and history. The accent has a slight Southern influence because workers from the Carolinas migrated to those cities to work in the factories, it's not etymological. Over 90% of DC residents say it's Northern according to a UNC poll done over a decade ago. "Those who say" outnumber people like you 1,000:1.
Give it up man, it was humorous at first listening to your rantings and ravings that MD and DC are Dixie, but now it's tiring. Maryland, DC, et al may have been Southern back in the time of the Missouri Compromise, but they aren't now. Places like Atlanta and Charlotte have transformed and become diversified, but they're still solidly Southern. Southern culture exists in Maryland, DC, Delaware, and Northern Virginia, but it's prevalence is paltry and rapidly diminishing relative to the Northeastern culture that exists there. For every reason that you say the area is Southern (true or false), I can give you 10 reasons why it's not. Maryland, DC, and Delaware (and NoVa) today are primarily grouped in either:
Physically the South starts/ends at Chicago's latitude lol.
There's no clear definition IMO because there's parts of non-Southern states that feel Southern and parts of Southern states that don't feel Southern, parts of Pennsylvania feel a little Southern but its the Mid-Atlantic. Parts of Maryland feel Southern too but its the Mid-Atlantic.
Not all of Florida feels Southern, parts of the Orlando area are straight up Dixie & Hick (people in the stores with no shoes on).
I'd say roughly South & West of DC is where the South starts on the East Coast.
That's funny, because whenever I say I go to the south often to visit my parents in Florida, you're the one who tells me that isn't the south....yet 15 minutes east it is? Very strange logic there.
You would have to spend more time there and experience much more of the State to understand.
You and your Mom also use your experiences in Naples and transfer them to equate the entire South, which most know is not accurate at all. Naples isn't culturally Southern at all, and hasn't been for years. BUT, there are certainly areas of Florida away from the coasts as far South as South Florida that still ARE Southern, in every way imaginable.
The imaginary line people draw across the I-4 corridor dividing the South/North aspects of the State simply doesn't work for me. It's just not that simple.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnatl
You would have to spend more time there and experience much more of the State to understand.
You and your Mom also use your experiences in Naples and transfer them to equate the entire South, which most know is not accurate at all. Naples isn't culturally Southern at all, and hasn't been for years. BUT, there are certainly areas of Florida away from the coasts as far South as South Florida that still ARE Southern, in every way imaginable.
The imaginary line people draw across the I-4 corridor dividing the South/North aspects of the State simply doesn't work for me. It's just not that simple.
I've been all over Florida countless times. You think every time I go to Naples (3-4 times a year for a week at a time), I stay in that dull "city" the entire time? No, I travel around to different cities and towns because it gets boring staying in the same area. Of the ~50 times I've been to Florida, you can imagine how extensively I've traveled in that state.
Location: Concrete jungle where dreams are made of.
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Yet another thread turning into "Where has Rachael traveled"...I don't know why you guys are so interested in where I've been. I'm not listing all the towns and getting off-topic. If you're that interested, go find where I've discussed it in my old posts.
Yet another thread turning into "Where has Rachael traveled"...I don't know why you guys are so interested in where I've been. I'm not listing all the towns and getting off-topic. If you're that interested, go find where I've discussed it in my old posts.
Of course people are interested - due to the many various claims you make.
I listed the places you claim to have visited in Florida. If that is indeed it, you really have not traveled extensively throughout the State at all, as you repeatedly claim to have.
Location: Concrete jungle where dreams are made of.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnatl
Of course people are interested - due to the many various claims you make.
I listed the places you claim to have visited in Florida. If that is indeed it, you really have not traveled extensively throughout the State at all, as you repeatedly claim to have.
That's it, no big deal.
I have been through the whole state. Small towns I don't remember the names of. Go look in my old posts from way back when if you're so interested in finding out.
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