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View Poll Results: Which is the best?
Baltimore 37 30.58%
Cleveland 27 22.31%
Charlotte 57 47.11%
Voters: 121. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-05-2009, 03:01 PM
 
Location: Crown Town
2,742 posts, read 5,993,966 times
Reputation: 1667

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Quote:
Originally Posted by creepsinc View Post
You mean there's no station playing awful commercial R&B music anymore? We'll survive.

How did this get to be about PittsburgH?

Yes, Pittsburgh is still dying. Faster and faster. That's why it was chosen to represent the US at a meeting of world leaders.


Meanwhile, over here in reality, the population loss is now slowing (natural population loss when the main industry in a town collapses and said town is reinvented as a totally different kind of city). The unemployment rate is the envy of most of the country. There's construction going on EVERYWHERE. We make some positive list or another every week (literally). And we were chosen to represent the country in front of the world as a city which has rebounded from truly awful economic/environmental devastation. Keep those eyes shut tight, and keep repeating what you want to believe. Whatever helps.

If only ignorance was physically painful.

And that list is also based on RENTAL vacancies. Once again, eyes shut tight and repeat whatever helps you feel smart.
You made this about Pittsburgh. And yes, we know, you've got low unemployment, etc., etc. And still nobody wants to live there The least of your concerns should be Charlotte or any other city, your city has terrible problems all its own that you can't seem to get a grip on...

Survey: Pittsburgh among least popular U.S. cities: Survey: Pittsburgh among least popular U.S. cities - Pittsburgh Business Times:

Forecast predicts Pittsburgh population to fall 6.8 percent by 2025:
Forecast predicts Pittsburgh population to fall 6.8 percent by 2025 - Pittsburgh Business Times:
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Old 08-05-2009, 03:13 PM
 
Location: The Queen City
174 posts, read 354,643 times
Reputation: 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by creepsinc View Post
You mean there's no station playing awful commercial R&B music anymore? We'll survive.

How did this get to be about PittsburgH?

Yes, Pittsburgh is still dying. Faster and faster. That's why it was chosen to represent the US at a meeting of world leaders.


Meanwhile, over here in reality, the population loss is now slowing (natural population loss when the main industry in a town collapses and said town is reinvented as a totally different kind of city). The unemployment rate is the envy of most of the country. There's construction going on EVERYWHERE. We make some positive list or another every week (literally). And we were chosen to represent the country in front of the world as a city which has rebounded from truly awful economic/environmental devastation. Keep those eyes shut tight, and keep repeating what you want to believe. Whatever helps.

If only ignorance was physically painful.

And that list is also based on RENTAL vacancies. Once again, eyes shut tight and repeat whatever helps you feel smart.
The vacancies are more based on the fact that Charlotte has continued to develop for growth, which has now slowed due to the economy. Our emptiness is much different than most of the cities on the list. We will recover, in a very strong way.

As for the lists themselves - they should all be taken with a grain of salt. I could list hundreds where Charlotte is in the top ten, and conversely, quite a few that does not show it as favorably. That could be said with most cities. At the end of the day, magaizines must sell copies and if each list looked the same, nobody would buy.

Just one week before Pittsburgh was named most livable, it was recognized as the dirtiest based on air quality by another publication. That doesn't sound very livable to me. So where's the truth? Probably somewhere in the middle. I'm not dissing the Burgh - I'm just proving a point. People can't use these lists as their references.

For what it's worth - you are right, Pittsburgh is a wonderful city. If I had to relocate from Charlotte, it would be on my top 10 list for sure. In my opinion it has rebounded and continues to do so, better than any of the other rust belt cities.
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Old 08-05-2009, 03:48 PM
 
98 posts, read 257,423 times
Reputation: 143
I've been to Baltimore a couple times. Between having a mean-ass bum poking a pointy umbrella tip between my eyes as I walked by, wild and violent ghetto creatures assualting me for money and the "blue-light special" neighborhoods I wasn't impressed. Federal Hill was nice but it seems the rest of the inner-city is a zoo. You can't even buy alcohol in a grocery store there. At least I could find any.

Cleveland and Charlotte, not sure about, but I would go to Charolette simply because of weather.
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Old 08-05-2009, 04:34 PM
 
Location: RVA
2,418 posts, read 4,196,123 times
Reputation: 1195
Quote:
Originally Posted by NCbyChoice View Post
The vacancies are more based on the fact that Charlotte has continued to develop for growth, which has now slowed due to the economy. Our emptiness is much different than most of the cities on the list. We will recover, in a very strong way.

As for the lists themselves - they should all be taken with a grain of salt. I could list hundreds where Charlotte is in the top ten, and conversely, quite a few that does not show it as favorably. That could be said with most cities. At the end of the day, magaizines must sell copies and if each list looked the same, nobody would buy.

Just one week before Pittsburgh was named most livable, it was recognized as the dirtiest based on air quality by another publication. That doesn't sound very livable to me. So where's the truth? Probably somewhere in the middle. I'm not dissing the Burgh - I'm just proving a point. People can't use these lists as their references.

For what it's worth - you are right, Pittsburgh is a wonderful city. If I had to relocate from Charlotte, it would be on my top 10 list for sure. In my opinion it has rebounded and continues to do so, better than any of the other rust belt cities.
First of all, thanks for your balanced post. When I say negative things about Charlotte, it's not about residents like yourself, and it's nice to hear somebody who has something to say about Pittsburgh (a city I never brought up that's way off-topic here) and appears to actually have visited at least once. Second of all, that air quality thing was bogus. They used one monitor, out of at least 20, and it was right next to the Clairton coke works, one of the last smoky factories in the area, and it's not even in the city of Pittsburgh.

Third of all: (yawn) [/subscribe].
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Old 08-05-2009, 07:35 PM
 
2,095 posts, read 5,869,862 times
Reputation: 918
The only thing I mind about Cleveland is the perception people have of the city. I myself know it's got more to offer than 90% of other major cities in the nation. Yeah, the unemployment is high -- but it's higher in SoCal.. so why do we only get bashed? But, in the long run 90% of the population still has a job. Our crime is high, but with the declining inner-city population it looks worse. Cleveland is more diverse than Charlotte and Baltimore, which of course in my opinion is a positive. Baltimore and Cleveland both have so many cultural, music, and entertainment amenities it would be splitting hairs to compare them. Charlotte certainly has some great areas, and is still improving which is great. Overall, all three cities have great aspects about them, and no so great things. I personally could live in any area comfortably and be proud of where I am from. Having traveled extensively and lived in numerous places, we all should be proud of our cities instead of trying to compete. It's a worthless debate. There is going to be a time when Charlotte is struggling and the rust belt cities improve, so the hate is immature.

But this is kind of an off topic rant.. Who's to blame for the poverty in the Rust Belt? Is it the leaders in the area not transitioning into different fields of work.. Or is it the Government fault for off-shoring so many industrial jobs leaving fellow Americans jobless? When manufacturing and other blue-collar jobs were thriving and not moved overseas, it was people from the South, like Charlotte, moving north for jobs. It's a shame that so many families lost their jobs because of an incompetent government.
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Old 08-05-2009, 08:29 PM
 
Location: metro ATL
8,190 posts, read 12,326,275 times
Reputation: 2698
Quote:
Originally Posted by WeSoHood View Post
Yeah, the unemployment is high -- but it's higher in SoCal.. so why do we only get bashed?
Oh, SoCal gets bashed. But that will always be a very desirable area due to the climate, amenities, and geographical amenities (beaches and mountains). SoCal rocks.

Quote:
But this is kind of an off topic rant.. Who's to blame for the poverty in the Rust Belt? Is it the leaders in the area not transitioning into different fields of work.. Or is it the Government fault for off-shoring so many industrial jobs leaving fellow Americans jobless? When manufacturing and other blue-collar jobs were thriving and not moved overseas, it was people from the South, like Charlotte, moving north for jobs. It's a shame that so many families lost their jobs because of an incompetent government.
I suppose you might start with comparing declining Midwest cities with others in the region who appear to be bucking the trend and doing relatively well for themselves (e.g., Chicago, Minneapolis, Columbus, Indianapolis, etc.). What have they done that the others have failed to do?
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Old 08-06-2009, 05:52 PM
 
2,095 posts, read 5,869,862 times
Reputation: 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carolina Blue View Post
You made this about Pittsburgh. And yes, we know, you've got low unemployment, etc., etc. And still nobody wants to live there The least of your concerns should be Charlotte or any other city, your city has terrible problems all its own that you can't seem to get a grip on...

Survey: Pittsburgh among least popular U.S. cities: Survey: Pittsburgh among least popular U.S. cities - Pittsburgh Business Times:

Forecast predicts Pittsburgh population to fall 6.8 percent by 2025:
Forecast predicts Pittsburgh population to fall 6.8 percent by 2025 - Pittsburgh Business Times:
And about 99% people surveyed probably know nothing about those cities. Your bashing Pittsburgh, an all-american city, to boost your own ego on Charlotte.
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Old 08-06-2009, 05:54 PM
 
2,095 posts, read 5,869,862 times
Reputation: 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akhenaton06 View Post
Oh, SoCal gets bashed. But that will always be a very desirable area due to the climate, amenities, and geographical amenities (beaches and mountains). SoCal rocks.



I suppose you might start with comparing declining Midwest cities with others in the region who appear to be bucking the trend and doing relatively well for themselves (e.g., Chicago, Minneapolis, Columbus, Indianapolis, etc.). What have they done that the others have failed to do?
Those aren't rust belt cities, beside Chicago. And Columbus is highly over-rated. The city was losing people, nearly fell below 200,000 people in 2000.. it was only until they annexed land and suburbs that it appeared to be doing 'good'.

Oh and so you know Rust Belt is NOT synonymous with Midwest. Columbus didn't base it's industries on blue collar jobs.
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Old 08-06-2009, 06:37 PM
 
Location: SC
1,141 posts, read 3,151,532 times
Reputation: 632
Quote:
Originally Posted by grapico View Post
Eh... I would rank them

Baltimore (decent, and you have DC with good public trans into it)
Charlotte (just kina blah... if I was in that region I would go to Atlanta no questions, but I haven't spent as much time in this city... from what I have though it doesn't seem like there is much to it, downtown seemed kina new and shiny, but not much culture to it.)
Cleveland (seems to be dying, spent a December there and was pretty dull and bleak... depressing... On contrast December in next door neighbors Chicago and to a lesser extent even Pittsburgh there is still quite a bit going on.)
Just my personal experience, I lived on the outskirts of Cleveland, hung out much of the time in Pittsburgh, and lived in Charlotte until recently.

It would depend on what age one is and what one is interested in.

My pick would be Pittsburgh, simply because I'm over 50 and there are still many things to do in Pittsburgh. If you're over 50 in Charlotte, there isn't much to do unless you revolve your life around church. Art/museums are horribly lacking in Charlotte. Some people could care less, but for me, who loves art and museums, I find that surprising for the size of Charlotte.
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Old 08-06-2009, 06:41 PM
 
Location: SC
1,141 posts, read 3,151,532 times
Reputation: 632
Quote:
Originally Posted by WeSoHood View Post
And about 99% people surveyed probably know nothing about those cities. Your bashing Pittsburgh, an all-american city, to boost your own ego on Charlotte.
Have to agree on this, I am familiar with both areas.
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