U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S.
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 04-30-2007, 01:28 PM
 
Location: IN
20,853 posts, read 35,976,422 times
Reputation: 13304

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajf131 View Post
Agreed. They actually from what i've heard are trying to develop an OZark biking trail extending from St. Louis all the way to the Mark Twain national park or something like that. With the Katy Trail they are hoping to complete it to Kansas City. But far more needs to be done I think. Maybe once we get another governor we will start seeing improvements. I don't agree with much of Blunt's policies, I don't know about you but overall I think he has not done an incredible job with the state while he's be in office. I've heard far more complaints about him than appraisals.
Once Missouri does get another governor they had better become more focused on economic development in rural Missouri considering that large amounts of people still live in rural counties with few jobs and are not migrating to urban areas in large numbers. Economic development in rural Missouri is not good at all when you compare the numbers with rural counties that are within the Midwest core. For example, New York State focused much of their economic development efforts on the New York City metro and the rest of the state has been on a long economic downturn. Most of upstate New York is just the eastern extension of the Midwest rust belt.

 
Old 04-30-2007, 01:35 PM
 
Location: St. Louis, MO
3,742 posts, read 6,909,420 times
Reputation: 660
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plains10 View Post
Actually many counties in northern Missouri have poverty rates above the 13% level as well, which is above average when you compare it to the Midwest core. The percentages are much higher because of the POOR levels of economic development that are occuring across many counties in rural Missouri. However, at least more of the residents of these counties seem to be moving to urban areas to find jobs as evidenced by some population declines in rural counties in northern Missouri.
(All of these counties are located in northern Missouri closer to the Midwest core)
Adair County 15.9% of residents living below poverty
Grundy County 14.2% of residents living below poverty
Knox County 14.5% of residents living below poverty
Sullivan County 14.7% of residents living below poverty
Daviess County 14.2% of residents living below poverty
Worth County- 13.2% of residents living below poverty
Harrison County 13.3% of residents living below poverty
Putnam County 13.8% of residents living below poverty
Schuyler County 13.6% of residents living below poverty
DeKalb County 13.5% of residents living below poverty

Very strange indeed. I don't know what to say to that except to say that Missouri does not have decent economic policies compared to other Midwestern states. Change is necessary for sure. Missouri has never been economically as sound as the other Midwestern states, I will definitely admit to that. in any case....i still consider Missouri the Midwest, even if it's not the richest state rurally compared to its other Midwestern counterparts. I would guess compared to the South our poverty rates are pretty low. We certainly are not poor like Arkansas, Mississippi, or Louisiana by a long shot I would guess.
 
Old 04-30-2007, 02:51 PM
 
Location: In God
3,073 posts, read 10,771,034 times
Reputation: 510
I'm not sure what poverty lines have to do with being a southern state.
 
Old 04-30-2007, 03:11 PM
 
Location: IN
20,853 posts, read 35,976,422 times
Reputation: 13304
Post Missouri has poor economic development

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpope409 View Post
I'm not sure what poverty lines have to do with being a southern state.
Missouri has had a very poor record in terms of economic development in rural counties compared with states in the Midwest core. Also, larger numbers of people live in rural counties in Missouri with few jobs compared with other states in the Midwest and Plains. Missouri has many poor rural counties, but Kentucky definitiely has more of a rural poverty problem than Missouri.
 
Old 04-30-2007, 04:30 PM
 
Location: St. Louis, MO
3,742 posts, read 6,909,420 times
Reputation: 660
Quote:
Originally Posted by mpope409 View Post
I'm not sure what poverty lines have to do with being a southern state.
Technically me neither I never thought it was an indication of Southerness at all. For me if a state is not culturally Southern and generally has no Southern accent, and its economy is not linked to the South, and its weather is not like the rest of the South, it's not the South. The South is not in general higher in poverty than the Midwest. that is a stereotype I don't believe in. Those are the three big definitions that I'm pretty sure most would agree on, and most of Missouri meets every one of those definitions. And aside from the statistics, Missouri is no more Southern than most of Kansas, Illinois, Indiana, or Ohio. These states have Southern components to them in their very lowermost parts just like Missouri. You can give all sorts of reasons and point some Southern components out in a few parts of Missouri but rarely if ever can you say they exist all over the state or even the majority of the state or even half of it. If absolutely nothing in the vast majority of Missouri can be midwestern, then pretty much nothing can be in any states immediately east or west of it as they share undeniable commonalities. That's like saying they can't spread into other states when they are right next to them which is not true. Missouri has far more in common with the Midwest states than any Southern state, It is north of the Mason-Dixon line, which is the 36 degree latitude line across Missouri extending due west, the Ohio River, and the Maryland-Pennsylvania border. FACT. And not every Midwestern state is your stereotypical prairie scene. look at Ohio or Minnesota it's not prairie everywhere you go. Poverty is the best argument that can be made to say Missouri is different from the Midwest. Other than that I can always think one or two Midwestern states like it minimum. The most important thing is Missouri in general feels more Midwestern than Southern to me generally, and i've been to every Midwestern state except Michigan. I feel like I'm getting solid undeniable proof being contested.

Last edited by ajf131; 04-30-2007 at 04:39 PM..
 
Old 04-30-2007, 04:37 PM
 
134 posts, read 401,641 times
Reputation: 79
[quote=ColdCanadian;608525]Funny!

IMHO, any place that the majority of residents consider "Southern" is Southern. When I was in north central West Virginia, one local, a fellow customer in a gas station corrected me when I asked for pork rinds. He said "Pork Skins; you're in the South now!" What would be the point in argueing with that man? Besides if all the locals believe it is Southern, to me it adds a quirky charm.

That's funny about north central WV. But I know one thing: They call Coke "pop" up there. I was at Wal Mart up there and asked where the Coke machine was and they said "What?" "We have a pop machine right over there, but there's Sprite there too>" At the hotel, I was told the pop machine was down the hall next to the ice machine, and I saw several roadside signs with "POP 75 cents" on them.

Travelling through WV, also through parts of northern KY and southern OH, I don't get a South feel like I do in GA or AL, but it doesn't feel quite Northern either. Seems to be like a transitional area to me.
 
Old 04-30-2007, 04:47 PM
 
Location: St. Louis, MO
3,742 posts, read 6,909,420 times
Reputation: 660
In appearance the rural areas of Missouri don't look any different from any Midwestern state that is for sure. The economic development may be poor...I won't contest it....I just think it's a bad reason for arguing Missouri isn't midwestern. I can think of many different ways to exclude each Midwestern state from the others and saying that there are at least some similarities between any Midwestern state and any Southern state in a unique way. There is no way you can say that any Midwestern state has absolutely zero in common with the South, nor can you say that about any state in the U.S. Missouri is Midwestern, and if not completely much moreso than Southern....end of discussion.
 
Old 04-30-2007, 04:53 PM
 
Location: St. Louis, MO
3,742 posts, read 6,909,420 times
Reputation: 660
[quote=markdalton;648515]
Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdCanadian View Post
Funny!

IMHO, any place that the majority of residents consider "Southern" is Southern. When I was in north central West Virginia, one local, a fellow customer in a gas station corrected me when I asked for pork rinds. He said "Pork Skins; you're in the South now!" What would be the point in argueing with that man? Besides if all the locals believe it is Southern, to me it adds a quirky charm.

That's funny about north central WV. But I know one thing: They call Coke "pop" up there. I was at Wal Mart up there and asked where the Coke machine was and they said "What?" "We have a pop machine right over there, but there's Sprite there too>" At the hotel, I was told the pop machine was down the hall next to the ice machine, and I saw several roadside signs with "POP 75 cents" on them.


Travelling through WV, also through parts of northern KY and southern OH, I don't get a South feel like I do in GA or AL, but it doesn't feel quite Northern either. Seems to be like a transitional area to me.
My point exactly. And for Missouri most people in the northern half (St. Louis, Kansas City, Columbia included) generally consider it Midwestern. THat ends it right there. The people that consider it southern reside in the extreme southern areas of the state. Southern Missouri below Kansas city and St. Louis is more a transitional point but Missouri is never anything close to Southern until you are practically out of the state or well South of the central part of it. This pattern really is no different from any lower Midwestern state at all (Indiana, Ohio).

I agree completely with that statement about Northern WV and parts of Southern Ohio and Northern Kentucky.
 
Old 04-30-2007, 05:30 PM
 
Location: IN
20,853 posts, read 35,976,422 times
Reputation: 13304
Post Info

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajf131 View Post
Technically me neither I never thought it was an indication of Southerness at all. For me if a state is not culturally Southern and generally has no Southern accent, and its economy is not linked to the South, and its weather is not like the rest of the South, it's not the South. The South is not in general higher in poverty than the Midwest. that is a stereotype I don't believe in. Those are the three big definitions that I'm pretty sure most would agree on, and most of Missouri meets every one of those definitions. And aside from the statistics, Missouri is no more Southern than most of Kansas, Illinois, Indiana, or Ohio. These states have Southern components to them in their very lowermost parts just like Missouri. You can give all sorts of reasons and point some Southern components out in a few parts of Missouri but rarely if ever can you say they exist all over the state or even the majority of the state or even half of it. If absolutely nothing in the vast majority of Missouri can be midwestern, then pretty much nothing can be in any states immediately east or west of it as they share undeniable commonalities. That's like saying they can't spread into other states when they are right next to them which is not true. Missouri has far more in common with the Midwest states than any Southern state, It is north of the Mason-Dixon line, which is the 36 degree latitude line across Missouri extending due west, the Ohio River, and the Maryland-Pennsylvania border. FACT. And not every Midwestern state is your stereotypical prairie scene. look at Ohio or Minnesota it's not prairie everywhere you go. Poverty is the best argument that can be made to say Missouri is different from the Midwest. Other than that I can always think one or two Midwestern states like it minimum. The most important thing is Missouri in general feels more Midwestern than Southern to me generally, and i've been to every Midwestern state except Michigan. I feel like I'm getting solid undeniable proof being contested.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mason-Dixon_line
Am I missing something or is the Mason/Dixon line located at 39N further to the east? Does the Mason/Dixon line travel further to the south following the Ohio River? Historically the Ohio River was a good dividing line between the north and the south.
 
Old 04-30-2007, 05:55 PM
 
Location: In God
3,073 posts, read 10,771,034 times
Reputation: 510
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plains10 View Post
Missouri has had a very poor record in terms of economic development in rural counties compared with states in the Midwest core. Also, larger numbers of people live in rural counties in Missouri with few jobs compared with other states in the Midwest and Plains. Missouri has many poor rural counties, but Kentucky definitiely has more of a rural poverty problem than Missouri.
Still...what does that have to do with being Southern?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S.
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top